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What really worries me...

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People can be very frightened of change.

We should have made this the forum motto.I believe this line gets to the heart of all the complaints from people who have not seen this movie. They fear the unknown. They fear change. They fear someone will screw up their memories of TOS.

On the other hand, Star Trek is all about change, accepting the future, optimism that things will work out if we try. I think Abrams GETS this about Trek. He may not care that it looks like 1960s television. He seems to care that a STORY IS TOLD, that he has for years felt needed to be told.

Star Trek is about as old as I am. It is also about as worn as I am. I am anxious for a fresh take on designs. I just want to see Trek telling a story. For the younger fans, and for me, I also want to see a good adventure. We had enough B&B talking heads boring me to tears with lectures instead of action.

Now let us have some fun! Now let us have wonder! Now let us have awe and amazement!
 
Then again... its by the writing team from Transformers. Try as I might, I cannot remember one intelligent exchange or line of dialog from that film.

Well, don't forget that Transformers was a Michael Bay movie. I suspect MB specifically removes any dialogue that is not a macho one-liner that can be yelled out over the sound of deafening explosions.

Also, it's a movie about giant children's toys. Buy the toys, dammit.
 
What concerned me was the obvious distain he revealed for the original. He calls the uniforms silly (and then goes and KEEPS them?!?!?!), calls the look of Vulcans "ridiculous"...

*Scratches Head* When and where did he say those things?
 
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...In the end, tell a great story. It's not about how many nacelles there are or what color Kirk's uniform is.

Or what Kirk's first name is.

Let's call him "Rob" in this one.

Or how many pointed ears Spock has.

Let's give him three. We're doing this one, so we can.




Don't you see?

If this is Star Trek, let it BE the Trek we've known.

If they HAVE TO change anything, let it be the way they changed the uniforms. NOT the way they changed the bridge.

If this is Kirk and Spock's Star Trek, then LET IT BE KIRK AND SPOCK'S STAR TREK! Don't change it. Give us more of what we had before.

Some say "The look of the bridge isn't important, it's the story-telling that counts."

Okay. Then DON'T CHANGE HOW THINGS LOOK IF IT'S SO UNIMPORTANT.

If you feel it has to be changed to "look good" then you don't want Kirk and Spock's era, you want something else.

People shouldn't contradict themselves in an attempt to defend the new version of something, especially when that new version tries to undermine the original by actually claiming to be the very same thing.
 
How about being afraid to stick with something with CBS up your... Get ready for Andromeda : the movie. Where is Kevin Sorbo anyway. Change is always easy. The stories were the problem with the movies mostly.
 
What concerned me was the obvious distain he revealed for the original. He calls the uniforms silly (and then goes and KEEPS them?!?!?!), calls the look of Vulcans "ridiculous"...

*Scratches Head* When and where did he say those things?

***​

http://www.trektoday.com/news/281008_03.shtml

The article in Empire includes an interview with J.J. Abrams. In part of the interview, he discusses the challenges of making the 1960s boldly-colored uniforms palatable to today's audiences. "For me, the costumes were a microcosm of the entire project," said Abrams, "which was how to take something that's kind of silly and make it feel real. But how do you make legitimate those near-primary color costumes? How do you make legitimate the pointy ears and the bowl haircut? It's ridiculous and as potentially clichéd as it gets..."


***


NOW do you get what this thread is about, Devon?
 
Don't you see?

If this is Star Trek, let it BE the Trek we've known.

If they HAVE TO change anything, let it be the way they changed the uniforms. NOT the way they changed the bridge.

If this is Kirk and Spock's Star Trek, then LET IT BE KIRK AND SPOCK'S STAR TREK! Don't change it. Give us more of what we had before.

I'm curious - what does this mean to you? I'm gathering the production designs looking like the 60s production designs is a really big deal for you, but otherwise - what is it you want? What exactly is "what we had before"?
 
People can be very frightened of change.

We should have made this the forum motto.I believe this line gets to the heart of all the complaints from people who have not seen this movie. They fear the unknown. They fear change. They fear someone will screw up their memories of TOS...


We never were worried about change before.

The "redesigned and refitted" Enterprise, its destruction and its being replaced by the Enterprise-A, TNG, DS9, Voyager, even Enterprise...

I wouldn't say Trek fans are frightened of change.

I'd say we don't like being told one thing, only to later find out something else is true. 'It fits totally in the existing timeline. It changes nothing. It's just a story never before told.'

Yeah.

On a ship that, it seems (it SEEMS) won't look like the one we know, but is being presented as BEING the one we knew.

Is it so hard to invent a new crew whose ship will look different because its in a different era?

Of course not. We've seen it done, and loved it.

We could accept a leap beyond TNG's era. We could accept never seeing Picard and Data again. We knew it'd happened with Kirk and company, and we could deal with it again. A new crew, maybe further into the future...

What's so hard about that? It could have the same spirit as the original, if that's how the people involved wanted it.

Oh, but no. They wanted more. They wanted to take Kirk and Spock and what we knew and OVERWRITE it.

Then on top of it they DENIED having done that...but then the pictures were released.

I've said it again and again, if they'd changed the ship no more than the uniforms, I'd have been totally on board. Hey, a few things changed during the run of TOS without being explained. Okay. More of the same.

But to turn the bridge into an original iMac with thryoid problems?

It looks nothing like what we knew, and I'm wondering what horrors are awaiting us when we first see the Enterprise.

I'm guessing it won't be similar to the "Oooooh!" and "Aaaah!" experience fans had with TMP. (Of course, that change was explained. How do you explain this one?)

I think the expressions of concern are legitimate, and for people who try to make the concerns sound like a bad thing, it suggests maybe they don't love TOS as much as they try to make out, and are simply more vocal and nasty than those who do.

As also mentioned elsewhere, I'll be going to see this film, and likely any sequels, but I may be a little disappointed. We may have to lose the Trek we knew to get this new serving.

Hey, if the differences even get explained in the movie ("The timeline got altered by the Romulans and their earliest efforts to alter the past"), that'd be something. It'd in a way mean this IS still our TOS, but we can blame the Romulans for things looking different. :p

But don't tell me this story is simply a tale we never heard before, and that it changes nothing...

When it does exactly that. It changes quite a few things...or so it seems.

Once again, I've said elsewhere "Let's wait and see" but I'm getting some bad feelings about this due to a certain source speaking honestly... which they didn't do before.

Tell me a good story, but don't go and try to take over the ones that came before. And for cryin' out loud, DON'T tell me you haven't done something when that's EXACTLY what you've done.

Come on guys.

They may have changed Trek and overwritten it. That means everything we've known is gone, and can't be added to. From this point on something ELSE is being called Star Trek. (And heaven help us as we try to figure out what continuity any new novels take place in, whether they take place in the TOS era, post TOS era, or even 24th century, which would surely be affected by a change in Kirk's time. Do any new novels in ANY era take place in the original timeline, or the new one? And what about series currently in the midst of being written?!?!)

This is pretty dramatic stuff for people who really love Star Trek, and for anyone to poo-poo someone else's concerns...

That's not only hard-hearted, it's pretty narrow minded.
 
I'm curious - what does this mean to you? I'm gathering the production designs looking like the 60s production designs is a really big deal for you, but otherwise - what is it you want? What exactly is "what we had before"?

You know EXACTLY what I mean, so stop pretending you don't.

I'm very curious why my speaking out from my heart on this has attracted your attention so much. You did this (or tried to) the other day in another thread, and now you're trying to do it again.

Uh-uh.

Ain't gonna let'cha.

You wanna play games?

Fine.

Let's play.

You want to know what I want?

What do YOU want, and how is changing the look of the bridge (possibly for good) and maybe the Enterprise essential for the "good stories" that you say is all YOU want?

Go ahead...

Explain to us how that's necessary. In the same breath tell us how changing the look isn't important (as you did before), but then explain in your next breath, please, why it's also important enough to DO.

Go ahead.

Also, while you're at it, explain to us how something that changes the look of the ship so much fits in innocently as part of the existing timeline, and "changes nothing", being an innocent "untold story"?

Go ahead.

Talk.

I'll check to see what you've said in a day or two. I'm sure it'll be very revealing.

Explain to us why Trek has to be changed visually, and also how a visual change doesn't overwrite what came before (especially when we were told that's not what this film is all about)?

Go ahead...

The floor is yours.

You wanna talk?

TALK.
 
Does anyone else share my fears and train of thought or am I just being paranoid?

No.

Really, at this point it's a completely new version of "Star Trek," or nothing. There is nothing to motivate the studio to spend more money on the old version.

Since none of us have to see the movie, we're free to choose "nothing" if it offends us. At least with Abrams we have a choice between the two.

I agree with you.
 
I'm curious - what does this mean to you? I'm gathering the production designs looking like the 60s production designs is a really big deal for you, but otherwise - what is it you want? What exactly is "what we had before"?

You know EXACTLY what I mean, so stop pretending you don't.

I'm very curious why my speaking out from my heart on this has attracted your attention so much. You did this (or tried to) the other day in another thread, and now you're trying to do it again.

Uh-uh.

Ain't gonna let'cha.

You wanna play games?

Fine.

Let's play.

You want to know what I want?

What do YOU want, and how is changing the look of the bridge (possibly for good) and maybe the Enterprise essential for the "good stories" that you say is all YOU want?

Go ahead...

Explain to us how that's necessary. In the same breath tell us how changing the look isn't important (as you did before), but then explain in your next breath, please, why it's also important enough to DO.

Go ahead.

Also, while you're at it, explain to us how something that changes the look of the ship so much fits in innocently as part of the existing timeline, and "changes nothing", being an innocent "untold story"?

Go ahead.

Talk.

I'll check to see what you've said in a day or two. I'm sure it'll be very revealing.

Explain to us why Trek has to be changed visually, and also how a visual change doesn't overwrite what came before (especially when we were told that's not what this film is all about)?

Go ahead...

The floor is yours.

You wanna talk?

TALK.
I don't even have time to read those two posts. How can a vision of the future appear old ? Updating is one thing sure but changing is something different. The Enterprise is a character is all.
 
You can't please Star Trek fans, because we're skeptical and we don't speak with one voice. We can't even agree on which shows are best, and some here even contend that anything after TOS is miserable television.

It doesn't matter what we think. Best thing to do is approach this rationally, and in the end, if you hate it, you can have the satisfaction of knowing you can come here and argue whether or not the new movie is "canon" ;)
 
I'm curious - what does this mean to you? I'm gathering the production designs looking like the 60s production designs is a really big deal for you, but otherwise - what is it you want? What exactly is "what we had before"?

You know EXACTLY what I mean, so stop pretending you don't.

I'm very curious why my speaking out from my heart on this has attracted your attention so much. You did this (or tried to) the other day in another thread, and now you're trying to do it again.

Uh-uh.

Ain't gonna let'cha.

You wanna play games?

Fine.

Let's play.

You want to know what I want?

What do YOU want, and how is changing the look of the bridge (possibly for good) and maybe the Enterprise essential for the "good stories" that you say is all YOU want?

Go ahead...

Explain to us how that's necessary. In the same breath tell us how changing the look isn't important (as you did before), but then explain in your next breath, please, why it's also important enough to DO.

Go ahead.

Also, while you're at it, explain to us how something that changes the look of the ship so much fits in innocently as part of the existing timeline, and "changes nothing", being an innocent "untold story"?

Go ahead.

Talk.

I'll check to see what you've said in a day or two. I'm sure it'll be very revealing.

Explain to us why Trek has to be changed visually, and also how a visual change doesn't overwrite what came before (especially when we were told that's not what this film is all about)?

Go ahead...

The floor is yours.

You wanna talk?

TALK.
I really hope the bridge is the heracy they're talking about at the beginning of the movie. Though I could buy into it. It kinda looks like the phase two bridge.
 
Don't you see? Everyone who's anyone can clearly see that the Emperor is clothed in the finest robes in all the land! You must be one of those lowborn commoners who just can't see such things...
 
...

Open your eyes, people! The Emperor is walking around town bloody starkers!

...

As the emperor continues his stroll down Main Street, naked as a jaybird....

Don't you see? Everyone who's anyone can clearly see that the Emperor is clothed in the finest robes in all the land! You must be one of those lowborn commoners who just can't see such things...
Okay, okay -- we get it, already: you really, really like Hans Christian Andersen and you want everyone to know about his story. We know.

Can we move on to a new story, now?
 
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Well, there is the whole 4th and 5th year of TOS that never existed, and there is that 5-yr mission after TMP that we never saw. maybe this IS the phase II Enterprise...

Or maybe it's just a different version. Same history, different look. It's happened how many times now in Hollywood...?
 
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