what do you think about "the augments" arc?

[frenchman]

as i wrote in the title, what do you think about the augments arc?

beyond the pleasure to see brent spiner, i think it's a good arc, not the best but a good one.

the augments : or the sexy augments. when i saw them, i had the feeling to watch top models. as i liked Alec newman in the Dune mini-series, as i hated him in Enterprise. i thougt his acting so bad.

t'pol: blalock has had the worst line ever in the fourth season. when she fight with Big Show and she says him "i'm not for sale".

lucas : we saw finally doctor lucas. he was exactely how i imagined him. a kind of a human phlox. i would like learn more about the phlox/lucas friendship.

the eugenic wars : i would definitely liked learn more about that.

archer : he is taken in hostage by malik on his own ship and like a newbie. and where is the security team? oh, shame on me!! Malcom was there, alone. apparently, everybody can come aboard and do what he wants without no problems (for example, at the end, malik can teleport himself on the ship and no one can see it. I know it's the first earth ship, but don't they have detectors?)

but don't misunderstand me, i very liked this arc. i pointed some bad things (according to me, of course).

so what is your opinions?

 

[Tharsis]

I liked Alec Newman's performance well enough. It was a bit over the top but he definately sold me on being evil. Anyone else think he would have made an excellent choice to play Anakin Skywalker. There is something about him, he reminds me a bit of Mark Hamil, but has more a dark look to him. It would have been perfect.

 

[commodore64]

As a whole, I thought it was interesting, but thought parts were lame. I wanted to think Alec Newman was incredible, especially since I liked him so much in the Dune series ... but I didn't think he was outstanding. I kinda feel like Enterprise frequently didn't know what to do with good guest stars.

Brent Spiner was entertaining. And I really enjoyed seeing the Orions fleshed out more.

I'd probably give it 3.5 stars out of 5.

 

[SFRabid]

For me it falls somewhere in the lower-middle of a good season four. It was entertaining but for me it did not flow very well. For some reason I felt like I was being jerked around.

 

[Myasishchev]

Beyond Brent Spiner and Dr. Lucas, it wasn't all that great.

Now, luckily, Arik Soong was the major character of the arc.

My problem was with the Augments. Nowhere did I see how these people were plausibly supposed to be "better" than humans. Yes, they were stronger, faster, maybe even smarter (although we don't see much evidence of that). And I understand that they are meant to be more aggressive, willing to do things that humans aren't... but the success of humanity is in its societies. Augments, or at least the ones that act like Malik's crew, can't be a society. They're just a gang, and not since the 13th century has a gang managed to best a civilized society.

These Augments had none of the charm of Khan. Khan was aggressive, overly and ultimately stupidly so, but he had the absolute loyalty of his followers, and from his perspective, his actions may even have made some sense--if you woke up, and realized your kind have been hunted to extinction by the people who've woken you up, you might mistrust their motives too.

Maybe you can impute the same motivations to Malik, but they don't come across so well. Maybe it's in his interactions with Soong--Malik seems more like a teenage jerk than a superhuman. The Augments as a group are, at best, PG Reavers and at worst cardboard. Also, the plan to attack the Klingons is... well, dumb. Yes, the Klingons might attack Earth if you conduct terrorism against them, but that doesn't mean they won't come after you! I mean, this would be like al-Qaeda saying "If we claim ties to the Afghan government, they'll just bomb Kabul, and surely won't come after us!"

If they'd dropped the stupid plan, and tried to humanize the Augments a bit more, so that we understood their plight and sympathized with them, it would've worked perfectly. Arik Soong runs circles around Jon Archer in their dialogues, and by far he's the most sympathetic character in the arc... maybe even the best character ENT ever had.

But instead they turned it into yet another clutch of "genetic engineering is bad" episodes. The only intellectually interesting bits are Soong's, and everything else is just there to prove him wrong. Wasteful and disgraceful. You seek out new life--well THERE IT SITS.

 

[The Sneeze Police]

Not my favorite episodes, but they were watchable.

Like others, I was glad to see Brent Spiner, and enjoyed his performance. I felt more of a connection to TNG with Spiner's performance (and granted it would be easier for him to make that connection as a performer). The augments did not connect me to TOS or Khan. I don't think it was the performances but the writing & plot that failed to make the connection between Khan & the augments.

 

[pookha]

i think overall the second and third were the strongest.
interestingly enough i think they shifted soongs character as the arc went on.
at first he comes across as almost evil with no concern at all for his actions.
he didnt give a damn about the orions taking the crew or possible war between earth and the klingons.

but starting with the second episode we see an emergence of a conscience that carries on to the end.

but i think the weakest part was the augements themselves.
i just didnt care what happened to them the acting among them was so weak .

 

[Cronos6939]

I really enjoyed this arc. I thought Brent Spiner and most of the Augments did a great job with their acting, and it was cool to see some interactions with the Orions and the IME. I actually think that this would have made a much better "disastrous first contact with the Klingon Empire" (mentioned in TNG's "First Contact") than "Broken Bow" did. And it laid the groundwork for the Klingon Augment arc, which I also thoroughly enjoyed.

 

[bluedana]

Beyond Brent Spiner and Dr. Lucas, it wasn't all that great.

Now, luckily, Arik Soong was the major character of the arc.

My problem was with the Augments. Nowhere did I see how these people were plausibly supposed to be "better" than humans. Yes, they were stronger, faster, maybe even smarter (although we don't see much evidence of that). And I understand that they are meant to be more aggressive, willing to do things that humans aren't... but the success of humanity is in its societies. Augments, or at least the ones that act like Malik's crew, can't be a society. They're just a gang, and not since the 13th century has a gang managed to best a civilized society.

These Augments had none of the charm of Khan. Khan was aggressive, overly and ultimately stupidly so, but he had the absolute loyalty of his followers, and from his perspective, his actions may even have made some sense--if you woke up, and realized your kind have been hunted to extinction by the people who've woken you up, you might mistrust their motives too.

Maybe you can impute the same motivations to Malik, but they don't come across so well. Maybe it's in his interactions with Soong--Malik seems more like a teenage jerk than a superhuman. The Augments as a group are, at best, PG Reavers and at worst cardboard. Also, the plan to attack the Klingons is... well, dumb. Yes, the Klingons might attack Earth if you conduct terrorism against them, but that doesn't mean they won't come after you! I mean, this would be like al-Qaeda saying "If we claim ties to the Afghan government, they'll just bomb Kabul, and surely won't come after us!"

If they'd dropped the stupid plan, and tried to humanize the Augments a bit more, so that we understood their plight and sympathized with them, it would've worked perfectly. Arik Soong runs circles around Jon Archer in their dialogues, and by far he's the most sympathetic character in the arc... maybe even the best character ENT ever had.

But instead they turned it into yet another clutch of "genetic engineering is bad" episodes. The only intellectually interesting bits are Soong's, and everything else is just there to prove him wrong. Wasteful and disgraceful. You seek out new life--well THERE IT SITS.

The Augments weren't supposed to be "charming" or "successful" or "better." They couldn't be. They were raised in a vacuum by an egomaniac "father." They were taught to believe that they were "better, stronger, faster" and given a persecution complex, to boot. They were, above all, IMMATURE. They had no contact with society that could teach them those essential things humans learn in kindergarten and families and communities.

They were the personification of The Lord of the Flies. They thought nothing of killing the one they thought was weak. They killed the ones who disagreed with them, and then hid their crime, in order to stay on top. They toyed with the non-Augments, being cruel for the sake of cruelty. Then they turned on their "father," because he wasn't an Augment.

I thought that was a pretty compelling character study. I agree that Soong changed over the course of the arc, which was subtle and terrific. Spiner's reactions of relief when Archer backs down are perfect. And by the end, he realizes that the Augments can never be socialized, no matter how new-and-improved they are, precisely because of the way he raised them.

I also liked the creepy "family" dynamics, with the brother/sister vibe and the dawning realization of the father that the children are out of control. And I remember on first viewing being absolutely shocked that Trek would show someone being tortured to death - which becomes the turning point for Soong's character.

The only thing I dislike, mildly, is the ending (the cool SFX notwithstanding). The homage to TWOK felt too ...self-conscious.

 

[Shatmandu]

I enjoyed everything but the look of the Augments, who appeared to be refugees from a Pet Benetar video.

Joe, who uses sex as a weapon

 

[Praetor]

Am I the only one annoyed by the fact that the eugenics term which was the original intent with Khan and had a slightly different meaning (selective breeding) seemed almost entirely supplanted by overt genetic engineering here? I think it made for an interesting subtle distinction if they were primarily just well-bred humans analagous to thoroughbreds.

I am the only one? Nevermind.

 

[24thcenstfan]

I enjoyed seeing Brent Spiner again, but all in all I wasn't particularly enthused with the arc. The augments seemed predictable, one-dimensional to me and not all that genetically enhanced. I thought they paled in comparison to Khan.

I did like the Orion tie-in.

 

[Jbarney]

I liked it.

 

[pookha]

Am I the only one annoyed by the fact that the eugenics term which was the original intent with Khan and had a slightly different meaning (selective breeding) seemed almost entirely supplanted by overt genetic engineering here? I think it made for an interesting subtle distinction if they were primarily just well-bred humans analagous to thoroughbreds.

I am the only one? Nevermind.

they may not have used the term but really it sounds like something more then
just selective breeding in space seed..even though i know that was the term used.
maybe they got both of them confused.

MCCOY: No, I'm good, but not that good. There's something inside this man that refuses to accept death. Look at that. Even as he is now, his heart valve action has twice the power of yours and mine. Lung efficiency is fifty percent better.

though maybe this could be a hint of genetic engineering..

KIRK: Why? Because I'm not a product of controlled genetics?

but whatever enterprise was far from the first to see khan and the eugenics period as products of genetic engineering.

 

[Praetor]

Am I the only one annoyed by the fact that the eugenics term which was the original intent with Khan and had a slightly different meaning (selective breeding) seemed almost entirely supplanted by overt genetic engineering here? I think it made for an interesting subtle distinction if they were primarily just well-bred humans analagous to thoroughbreds.

I am the only one? Nevermind.

they may not have used the term but really it sounds like something more then
just selective breeding in space seed..even though i know that was the term used.
maybe they got both of them confused.

MCCOY: No, I'm good, but not that good. There's something inside this man that refuses to accept death. Look at that. Even as he is now, his heart valve action has twice the power of yours and mine. Lung efficiency is fifty percent better.

though maybe this could be a hint of genetic engineering..

KIRK: Why? Because I'm not a product of controlled genetics?

Well, I don't want to pick nits, because you may well be right, but they've said that same basic thing about Batman for years and we know he's just a man. And, technically, eugenics is controlling genetics.

but whatever enterprise was far from the first to see khan and the eugenics period as products of genetic engineering.

True indeed, it's been a common assumption. I just disbelieve its relationship to the intent.

 

[KimMH]

Greg Cox wrote Star Trek the Eugenics War - at least two parts - I am half way through the first. It chronicles Khan Noonien Singh's beginning. It also features Gary Seven and Roberta Lincoln from the TOS series. It starts out very slow but builds up to Action! Adventure! Isis the Catwoman! It is really getting very good. Does anyone know if it is a Trilogy or is it just the two books?

 

[Myasishchev]

^The third book is To Reign in Hell, and takes place on Ceti Alpha V (or VI--like Chekov, I forget ). I have no idea if it's good.

 

[KimMH]

Finished book one and it was great - timing was great because sci-fi channel recently did one or more of the augment arc - the book is killer! am looking forward to book two - on order - it really picked up steam and ended strong. have to go find #3 now too.

 

[Mr.bobo]

I like aguments arc...
...connected and interesting story...
...agument are the perfect soldier, but they arise from differences of genetic research and development...
...is that ethical...?

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

I thought Persis was incredibly HOT.

Still, all that genius and being unable to patch their clothes was kinda dumb.