What could a future earth space ship look like.

[KJbushway]

Ok please remember what I said, its FUTURISTIC. Both of you need to get off what a modern generational ship would be like, becuase in the future you might not need a generational ship. Yes, modern you be right it would be a life sentence shuttle, but in the future it could be a year sentence ship. SO the question is what will it look like.
Now you want to talk about a generational ship between galaxy from the future, good. I would love to see what it would look like, but the question is what would a future ship look like.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

Well one you can't replicate everyone's exact comfortable climate, I like cold, not everyone does.

True, but for the average human anything between about 74 and 85 degrees is going to be livable. If you like it colder or warmer you could just wear a jacket or a t-shirt.

What you said below that is what I already pointed out in the surrounding sentences. But trust me you can from smelling the air around you and it being different from what you know can get you homesick.

Assuming you're the type of person who tends to GET homesick. It depends more on the personality type than the environment; I've known people who get homesick visiting relatives down the street.

the people on the ship will have curiosity about where the ancestors came from(example: if that weren't the case Ancestry.com wouldn't be here)

True as that is, that curiosity for the most part can be satisfied by a simple trip to the ship's library. Most of US have never visited the place where our ancestors came from either.

One last point, you have to remember I said what will a future ship look like. So you might not need a generational ship, unless you leave the galaxy to populate another galaxy. So please stop thinking modern, you wont need it to be generational, becuase it would be FUTURISTIC.

If you're not using a generation ship or even a colonial habitat, then it's a non-issue anyway. Anything fast enough (FTL) to make the trip in less than a generation would, by definition, permit easy movement back and forth for anyone who wants to go.

But this assumes that some type of FTL drive is even possible with future technology, which is hardly a given. A generation ship with future technology could easily be an entire asteroid hollowed out and propelled through space with nuclear pulse thrusters, or you could avoid those sorts of complications with cryogenics and the crew stays in hibernation for the 60 to 70 years it takes to get anywhere. Just speculating on the basic premise, it's sort of an open-ended question, and it largely hangs on whether or not you expect FTL drives will be available in the future or ever.

Anyway, "modern" and "generation ship" don't even belong in the same sentence, the technology to attempt such a thing won't exist for another hundred years (i.e. in the future). Something the size of an O'neil cylinder or Babylon-5 with a fusion engine attached would eliminate ALL of the problems of "homesickness," a journey of 30 to 50 years would be more than sustainable for a small but growing population. Children growing up in such a vessel would have no difficulty coping with the voyage, but it might be tricky convincing them to relocate to whatever Earthlike planet they find below.

 

[KJbushway]

Ok all good points, but still the original question is what would it look like.
And the generational ship technology is around today.

 

[KJbushway]

Well one you can't replicate everyone's exact comfortable climate, I like cold, not everyone does.

True, but for the average human anything between about 74 and 85 degrees is going to be livable. If you like it colder or warmer you could just wear a jacket or a t-shirt.

What happens when people feel there entitled to have what they want, which is common. It doesn't matter if its livable, its about comfortable.

the people on the ship will have curiosity about where the ancestors came from(example: if that weren't the case Ancestry.com wouldn't be here)

True as that is, that curiosity for the most part can be satisfied by a simple trip to the ship's library. Most of US have never visited the place where our ancestors came from either.

Apparently you don't know many people, becuase ancestors doesn't mean that its your 15 grandfather. Your grandfather is your ancestor. Alot of people do actually visit were their ancestors came from. Poeple who had their ancestors in concentration camps back in ww2, have visited that place.

One last point, you have to remember I said what will a future ship look like. So you might not need a generational ship, unless you leave the galaxy to populate another galaxy. So please stop thinking modern, you wont need it to be generational, becuase it would be FUTURISTIC.

If you're not using a generation ship or even a colonial habitat, then it's a non-issue anyway. Anything fast enough (FTL) to make the trip in less than a generation would, by definition, permit easy movement back and forth for anyone who wants to go.

But this assumes that some type of FTL drive is even possible with future technology, which is hardly a given. A generation ship with future technology could easily be an entire asteroid hollowed out and propelled through space with nuclear pulse thrusters, or you could avoid those sorts of complications with cryogenics and the crew stays in hibernation for the 60 to 70 years it takes to get anywhere. Just speculating on the basic premise, it's sort of an open-ended question, and it largely hangs on whether or not you expect FTL drives will be available in the future or ever.

Anyway, "modern" and "generation ship" don't even belong in the same sentence, the technology to attempt such a thing won't exist for another hundred years (i.e. in the future). Something the size of an O'neil cylinder or Babylon-5 with a fusion engine attached would eliminate ALL of the problems of "homesickness," a journey of 30 to 50 years would be more than sustainable for a small but growing population. Children growing up in such a vessel would have no difficulty coping with the voyage, but it might be tricky convincing them to relocate to whatever Earthlike planet they find below.

Well, one I did say that if it was between galaxies that it would be a generational ship, so you guys can argue about that. But I asked what will it LOOK like, not just the exterior but the interior.
Now we do have technology to make a generational ship it would just take all the space age countries to help. But we could do it, if lets say earth was in serious danger.

Now lets please end this arguement, its actually diverted attention away from the actual point of the thread which is to tell everyone your idea of what a future earth ship would look like. If you want to contuine generational ship topic, tell me what it would look like, extrior and interior, technology it would have. Desgin it and post the picture. but this debate between you and cruella(sorry if i spelled it wrong), can it please end. Both of your are right and wrong, its a tie, OK.

So what would a future generational ship look like, your roaming between galaxies looking to get away from the collision of the milky way and andromeda galaxy. What would be in there? It may not be the only one, say one of 15 in the fleet.

 

[Deckerd]

Between galaxies? I was talking about the local area of our galaxy. The trouble with using ST as a basis for looking at the future is that it's based on fantasy.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

Well, one I did say that if it was between galaxies that it would be a generational ship, so you guys can argue about that. But I asked what will it LOOK like, not just the exterior but the interior.

Same answer for both: picture an O'Neil Cylinder with a fusion drive attached at one end, or--if you like--Babylon-5 with a drive section. Another possibility would be to hollow out part of an asteroid and spin it to create gravity. The exterior will look like whatever you need it to look like, but the interior would invariably look like an entire terrestrial landscape rolled up inside of a tube with some sort of artificial light source at the center axis (probably a mirror refracting light directly from the ship's fusion reactors; the best possible analog for artificial sunlight).

Now we do have technology to make a generational ship

No we don't. It's more than just a matter of infrastructure, it's really an issue of figuring out how to feasibly engineer something that large that can sustain itself for that period of time without external support. We could probably build a passable space colony, but it will be a while yet before we have the ability to send it anywhere.

Not that we would really need to, actually, because there's no place outside the solar system that would really have what we'd need to survive. Since the colony has plenty of real-estate for farming and/or animal husbandry, all it really needs to survive is a plentiful supply of water and some ore material it can process into parts when things break down. Neither of those are abundant in deep space, nor will they be easy to access at relativistic velocities.

So what would a future generational ship look like, your roaming between galaxies looking to get away from the collision of the milky way and andromeda galaxy.

InterGALACTIC travel is not a viable application for a generational ship. Since even traveling at one quarter of the speed of light it would take twenty to thirty years to reach the nearest sun-like star, that type of craft is strictly limited to interSTELLAR voyages. You're not going to leave the galaxy in a generation ship; that's more of a GEOLOGIC AGE ship.

 

[KJbushway]

OK you know what I mean, just end your agruement and get back to the subject at hand. Good Idea for the hollowed out asteriod. Anyother ship ideas other than the ones above? OK what would a GEOLOGIC AGE ship look like, a different idea from the one above please.

 

[KJbushway]

Between galaxies? I was talking about the local area of our galaxy. The trouble with using ST as a basis for looking at the future is that it's based on fantasy.

I know I am trying to end the agruement between you and Alpha, becuase it was about the affects of a generational ship and not about the actual topic. So do you have any ideas about what a future ship of any kind would look like, both outside and inside?

 

[KJbushway]

My depiction of a future ship would be one that is flat but not wide, tall at least 60 stories. It would look like a navy ship inside. It would be colored a calm color inside, but would have led lighting. It would be made of a tough metallic outside with a titanium inside. It would have at least one or two fusion generators. It would have huge cylinders that spin on the outside that simulate gravity inside. They would magnetize the hull to lessen the gravitational pull on it when it moves through space. The would be star bases every where for re-supply, some manned and unmanned so that it can travel into what is considered deep space.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

OK you know what I mean, just end your agruement and get back to the subject at hand.

The argument was over three days ago. What we've been discussing here is what an interstellar space craft would probably look like, how it would be designed, and what it would need to keep the crew from going crazy and eating each other. If we're precluding FTL travel (and we probably are) then your options are limited to generation ships and sleeper ships.

It would look like a navy ship inside.

Why? It isn't going anywhere NEAR the water, so why would it look anything like a naval vessel?

It would be made of a tough metallic outside with a titanium inside.

Again: why? Tough metal acts as an apt heat conductor so it would make sense to have a very THIN metallic outer hull like the gold foil parsol on skylab or the outer covering of the Lunar Module.

Of course, for weight savings it might be better to use inflatable compartments like Bigelow's "sundancer" space stations. The soft hull would be made of kevlar and other strong materials, held rigid by structural frames; being soft means it's easier to seal if you get a puncture, and in some cases mitigates the consequences of explosive decompression since metal fatigue cannot lead to a catastrophic accident.

They would magnetize the hull to lessen the gravitational pull on it when it moves through space.

How would magnetic fields accomplish THAT?

The would be star bases every where for re-supply, some manned and unmanned so that it can travel into what is considered deep space.

Since "deep space" is pretty much anything beyond CIS-Lunar space, these wouldn't be "star bases" so much as ordinary supply stations. But since these are bound to be long-term stations with alot of industrial capacity, they would probably have a sprawling civilian community around them and even a civilian spacecraft industry.

Not starbases... spaceports, really.

 

[KJbushway]

I didn't say my future ship desgin made all the sense in the world, I am entitled to have a dream even if its unclear.
If you don't know what I mean by navy ship inside, is that it would have the hallways and doors you see inside a navy ship.
Its futurisitic so they would have a heavy metal that can be coated with a light metal, but they may want a heavy hull to protect the ship from space debris, micrometeor, weapon fire.
star bases space ports, whatever.
Sorry I meant an energy field not a magnetic field.

 

[Deckerd]

I have to think that there is no reason whatsoever to have any kind of streamlining, even if it's basically a turning cylinder. Since there's no drag, you can add any amount of rubbish to the basic shape, provided it doesn't affect the smoothness of the spin. If you had a non-spinning bearing at one or both ends, a la B5, then I don't see what the problem would be to add propulsion.

 

[KJbushway]

Good point. Your right as long it doesn't affect the spin, I don't see why you can't add extra propulsion or even some kind of hangar or weapons array.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

If you don't know what I mean by navy ship inside, is that it would have the hallways and doors you see inside a navy ship.

I know EXACTLY what you meant. My question is, why would the interior of a space craft look anything like the interior of a naval vessel, when the two craft are designed to function in totally different environments? After all, the inside of a strategic bomber doesn't look anything like the inside of a submarine.

Its futurisitic so they would have a heavy metal that can be coated with a light metal, but they may want a heavy hull to protect the ship from space debris, micrometeor, weapon fire.

Heavy armor would not be particularly effective against any of the above, especially in space, with the added problem that the heavy armor costs you a bundle in mass fraction, reducing both the ship's acceleration and Delta-V budget. If impact protection is your concern, you're better off coating your ship with a whipple shield or a sandwich layer of aerogel: with a wipple shield, the hull is basically composed of multiple layers of thin material separated by an empty gap. A projectile hits the first layer, shatters on impact, and penetrates to the second as a shower of smaller particles, each of which only preserves a portion of the whole's kinetic energy; each particle, in turn, splinters into even smaller particles which no longer have enough energy to penetrate the third or fourth layer. Put some aerogel between some of the innermost layers, the effect is amplified.

Of course, if you're NOT worried about enemy weapons fire, armor is pointless anyway. A soft-hulled spacecraft would be able to stand up to random impacts alot better than a rigid structure anyway.

Sorry I meant an energy field not a magnetic field.

And what sort of energy field would accomplish this?

 

[Deckerd]

Good point. Your right as long it doesn't affect the spin, I don't see why you can't add extra propulsion or even some kind of hangar or weapons array.

Any interplanetary or, further in the future, interstellar vehicle will not have weapons, since there's nothing to shoot at.

 

[sojourner]

^There's always something to shoot at.

 

[Deckerd]

The breeze?

 

[KJbushway]

Well, depending on how large your ship is, you could have to blast your way through a asteriod field, there could be alien life out there, hopefully friendly but you never know. It could be like the vulcans no first contact unless able to travel to the stars outside or own system.

 

[JarodRussell]

These dense asteroid field as depicted in movies don't exist. Just like ubercolorful space nebulae, they are an invention of Hollywood movies.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

^ Besides which, any debris field dense enough for you to have to "blast" your way through is going to be large enough for you to see it long before you get there; you can simply change course to avoid it, or--failing that--you can always use the impulse from your main engines to blow that debris out of your way.