And then it'll get bought by TKO or something else completely fucking insane.
News WB/Paramount merger talks
- Thread starter F. King Daniel
- Start date
This is, sadly, how I feel about Star Trek too now. It seems to be what fans want. They’ll lap up nostalgia based fanwankery like there’s no tomorrow as we saw with Picard s3 and their clamouring for “Legacy”. Is that what a franchise needs in order to survive, thrive and draw in new generations of fans though?
I’ve kind of given up on Trek for now. It pains me. But it’s just not for me right now. I’ll keep watching but I doubt I’ll be rewatch much of it. I want something fresh, bold and different and altogether less timid for fear of fan backlash. Something as brave as TNG and DS9 when they debuted; eager to forge their own unique way. Most the output on various franchises right now is just weighted down by nostalgia porn for the immediate gratification of the existing fanbase.
What would you do that Trek hasn't already done?
Disco tried the "brand new ship/brand new crew" approach (only to bring back Pike and Spock).
Even TNG brought back McCoy, Scotty, and Spock!
One reason Disco jumped to the 32nd century was to get away from all the "canon" entanglements.
No one wants the franchise to toss aside its almost-sixty-year history.
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I'm pretty much in the same boat, I have zero interest in Trek re-hashing itself over and over again, which is why I've stopped bothering. Danja raises a good point as well tho - what IS Trek supposed to do? I think of this like some kind of pendulum swinging - right now we're in "the fans want nostalgia again" territory due to PIC's season 3, but once they actually GET the nostalgia they'll scream "been there done that got the t-shirt" all over again soon (I have no doubt that this would happen if they made that Legacy show)... maybe the best thing is to just drop Trek altogether and watch the old shows and be content with that because there's only SO many ways in which Trek can be innovative without repeating itself.
On issue is that Trek fans, by and large, skew older. The youngest fans of Berman Trek who didn't discover it later via streaming are in their early to mid 30s. Overall, Trek fans are middle aged or elderly, which is prime nostalgia territory.
Trek has tried to bring in new viewers with the various series on Paramount+, but this has largely been a failure, at least compared to something like the Kelvinverse, which was more constructed as a reboot for folks whose knowledge of TOS had more to do with pop-culture osmosis than the minutiae you'd find on Memory Alpha.
I can't think of a single "clean break" thing that modern Trek has done. Going through the series:
Trek has tried to bring in new viewers with the various series on Paramount+, but this has largely been a failure, at least compared to something like the Kelvinverse, which was more constructed as a reboot for folks whose knowledge of TOS had more to do with pop-culture osmosis than the minutiae you'd find on Memory Alpha.
I can't think of a single "clean break" thing that modern Trek has done. Going through the series:
- Discovery was stylistically very different than Berman Trek. However, it draped itself in Trek lore from Season 1 (Klingons, Mudd, the Mirror Universe, Michael being Spock's sister, Sarek, etc.) Doubled down more with Captain Pike/Spock in Season 2. It's been much less tied to past Trek since then, but it's also getting canceled, so...was that a success?
- Picard's first season tried some interesting things, but the appeal from day 1 was supposed to be for people who wanted another Picard story. Lots of the lore from the beginning (like the aftershocks of the Romulan supernova) would only really be interesting to people versed in Trek. And of course the series devolved into empty fanwank nostalgia by the third season.
- Lower Decks is entirely based around self-referential Trek humor. No one but die-hard Trekkies would watch it.
- Prodigy was an attempt to introduce kiddies to the Trekverse, but it was canceled after Season 1, which suggests it didn't succeed at that. There was still plenty of memberberries of earlier Trek, however.
- SNW was basically Paramount+ giving up and deciding they'd give us something which structurally resembles Berman Trek - a semi-serialized show with character continuity, and discrete, identifiable themes/messages in each of the episodes. It seems to have been better received than the earlier series, so lesson learned I guess?
More money earned at this point.
And I think it would benefit from doing so.
Maybe that’s why, of the newer Treks, I actually find Discovery the most interesting despite its flaws. It started off with real guts and a willingness to do something different and oblique. The fans just couldn’t accept that though, and Disco is dead.
I’d just love something at a time period we don’t know much about, with a brand new cast of characters with no ties to legacy characters (I really like La’an on SNW but why the Noonian Singh nonsense? It’s a connection that seems crudely tacked on for no good reason). At this point, the writers are letting Trek’s history weigh them down rather than being something to be used sparingly and creatively. TNG did bring back some core TOS characters but did so very rarely and judiciously. It was a treat when it happened but both it and DS9 were determined to be their own shows. Voyager too, initially, until it basically ended up TNG redux.
I’d love Trek to do something fresh, unconstrained by constant callbacks and yet with the core optimism and hope the show has always held.
I agree. And unfortunately, I also see this as the thing Trek is moving away from, because the comfort and optimism is in the past, not in looking to the future.
I do understand that nostalgia-based sense of optimism/hope. I think that’s the reason I keep rewatching TOS, TNG and DS9. It keys me into a time when life was a lot easier and more hopeful. But when it comes to new Trek if it’s new, let’s make it new. If I want my Olde Trekke Feels, I’ll rewatch the old shows, which I’ll be doing anyway.
The whole "Warners will buy Paramount" thing aged poorly.
The moral here is "Never pay attention to axe-grinding YouTubers."
Shares of Paramount Global popped in early trading after news that Byron Allen has offered a deal worth $30 billion to acquire the company, which has been in play since last fall.
The moral here is "Never pay attention to axe-grinding YouTubers."
Shares of Paramount Global popped in early trading after news that Byron Allen has offered a deal worth $30 billion to acquire the company, which has been in play since last fall.
Pish posh, it's easily aa important as Canadian streaming numbers.
I agree. I love old Trek for what it is, and will rewatch it all the time. But, new Trek is something I want to invite me to check something out new. Or even challenge some ideas with in Trek. I don't think everything in Trek should just be taken for granted or rest on the laurels of the past.
"Kind of new for Star Trek" is an old song, and one that's only catchy if you never watch any TV or movies that aren't Star Trek.
Otherwise, it's a lot of "Yeah, but I've already seen that done better by someone else."
Maybe, but I've seen very little "kids" TV on the level of Prodigy.
I’m in my sixties. I’ve been a Trekkie since I was 6. Only because Trek wasn’t a thing when I was 5.
I’m sick to DEATH of memberberry nostalgia. I dig Lower Decks because it’s funny as hell, not because of the callbacks. In fact, I’m wearing a Moopsy t-shirt right now, because Moopsy makes me laugh so hard I practically cry. And Moopsy isn’t something any other Star Trek has ever — or would ever do. Moopsy is a new thing in Star Trek. So is Peanut Hamper. And Shaxs. And most everything else on LD. It’s fresh. I want more “fresh” in my Star Trek. Please.
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From Deadline.com:
Things may work out for Trek after all.
Whatever Allen may not want, Skydance is waiting in the wings to scoop it up.
T'Lyn has grown on me.
She's a great foil for Mariner (she's about as disciplined, restrained, and controlled as Mariner is footloose and freewheeling).
Things may work out for Trek after all.
Whatever Allen may not want, Skydance is waiting in the wings to scoop it up.
T'Lyn has grown on me.
She's a great foil for Mariner (she's about as disciplined, restrained, and controlled as Mariner is footloose and freewheeling).
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Imagine a world where Trek is diced up and sold to different concerns, and then bizarro world sequels, reboots and prequels to every version that completely ignore and contradict all the other versions, which are doing the same thing. A TNG prequel set 100 years before, but completely unlike TOS at all. A TOS sequel set 100 years later that totally contradicts TNG. And then you end up with 2000's Marvel/Xmen movie style drama when it comes to shared characters like Spock or Worf.
It would be kind of amazing, not gonna lie.
It would be kind of amazing, not gonna lie.
^ This would make the whole issue with Paramount vs. CBS (movie rights vs. TV rights) that the fandom used to have to deal with (and was soooo often annoyed by) look utterly quaint and cute in comparison 
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