Was Worf/Kurn's Mok'tovah murder in your eyes?

Still, it would have been nice for the writers themselves to attempt some kind of follow-up on the matter given how the House of Mogh/Worf was stronger than ever by the end of DS9.

 

yeah, a true example of dropping the ball by the writers. It was obvious that eventually Worf was going to get his name and honor restored just as he did in TNG. So what was the point of the whole Kurn thing other than to provide the plot of an episode? Then it comes off as truly monstrous when it turns out it was all for nothing because Worf's honor is restored within a year. Unbelievable that they never show Worf racked with guilt for what he did, basically destroying his brother's identity for nothing.

 

I completely agree. In fact, that is the only point I consider when I watch that episode - what a dreadful end to a potentially great character. Kurn in the Dominion War would have been excellent.

 

I'm sure he considered it a tradeoff. Better his brother be alive if amnesiac than be dead altogether. If Kurn's memory hadn't been erased I'm sure he would have found a way to be KIA within weeks.

 

The difference is, those practices are objectively evil, since they victimize others - they harm innocent people. To oppose them is an absolute good.

Kurn, OTOH, chose to undergo a Klingon tradition which did not harm others - only himself. He had that right.

 

Regaining his honour in DS9 was different to TNG. In TNG, he and Kurn knew that the Council wrongly accused their father. In DS9, there was little hope of getting his name restored. He didn't even know Martok (the real Martok) until mid-way in season 5. As the cliche says, hindsight is 20-20.

 

murder? it was frickin' tedious!!

 

It was not murder.

I think Sisko and everyone else was acting like a complete ass in that episode. It was Kurn's choice to make, not theirs. If he wants to die, let him. Then Worf's choice at the end to erase Kurn's memories was just...

Disgusting.

 

Even if Worf and Kurn thought it was a hopeless cause to get their honor back, once Worf DID manage this you'd think he would've at least reflected on what happened to Kurn.

 

That's just it though. I think it's evident that Kurn had the right to ask Worf for Mok'tovah, and Worf had the right to follow Kurn's wishes and I don't think Sisko would dispute this. The impression I got from Sisko was that they were not on a Klingon station, not that he had a problem with the Mok'tovah per se, just that it happened on DS9 where these officers were assigned to represent Starfleet.

Really, if Worf took a month leave and went to fight alongside Kurn in battle, or if they performed the Mok'tovah on another planet, or on a Klingon world, no one on DS9 would have cared. Jadzia would probably have went with him to help.

Just because it's culturally acceptable for a Klingon or a Human to behave a certain way, it doesn't mean that they necessarily get to do so when they are guests of the Bajoran government on a Bajoran station, under the authority of Starfleet.

 

And yet, back in TNG, Picard raised a fuss when Worf killed Duras - even though this happened on a Klingon vessel.

 

He raised a fuss, but he POINTED OUT that the Klingons had no problem with what happened. He put a reprimand on Worf's STARFLEET record, because it could've easily been spun (if the Klingons were in a bad enough mood to think about it) as a Fed assassination.

 

And THERE is the reason Worf was wrong. He should have told his brother to man up and that they would fight to get it restored. C'mon, who seriously thought Worf would stay dishonored?

 

Yeah but Kurn was suicidal, and Worf wanted his brother to live, but with some honour. The point is when Kurn's memory was wiped he became a new person, a blank slate if you will. Which means he gets a second chance to regain his honour.

 

Sure. It also means Kurn essentially died and not only that but went out like a chump. Worf needed to give his brother tough love and impart the lesson he had already learned himself. Die in battle if he must, proving to Gowron, etc that he's going to go out like a warrior with honor, not a whining miserable and defeated coward afraid to face the future without honor.

Like many hitting the suicide switch, they're not thinking rationally or they'd see it should be pretty easy to pull off fairly painlessly.

 

No one got killed. It was acceptable in Klingon culture. Kurn wanted to die anyway. It wasn't Worf's fault his bro was an impatient douche.

 

I had always figured, at least based on Worf's TNG character, that after the events of DS9 and the restoration of his honor, he would likely go to Rodek, explain the truth, and offer to re-wipe and re-educated him back to being Kurn. But you are absolutely right. What would have been wrong with a couple of lines from Worf? Something along the lines of: "I accept your offer. However, first I must seek out my brother and set things right." TPTB dropped the ball on this one.

 

I think the biggest issue was that it was occurring on the station, and the station has a set of laws and guidelines for behavior that have to be followed. All Worf needed to do is take some vacation days and do it somewhere else-- and it would have been nobody's business (in fact, nobody would have even needed to know about it).

 

I just think it was a badly written episode and everyone was extremely out of character.

Worf wouldn't engage in brain butchery.

Neither would Sisko or Bashir.

Dax, also, would have respected Kurn's ritual suicide.

If and when he returned to his honor, he also would have sought out his brother immediately.

I think a much better ending to the episode would have been either letting him die gloriously in battle or, if this really is a metaphor for depression, get him Klingon therapy.