Don't agree with "Worst Year EVER" but do agree that it wasn't the best. S31.. ugh.. While I enjoyed most episodes in S3, it wasn't that great.
Was Star Trek one of Hollywood's greatest losers of 2025?
- Thread starter James Cole
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SNW season 3 seemed on-par with 1 and 2, quality-wise to me. S31 was rubbish, but it's far from the franchise's worst year. That's probably when it was cancelled for the second time.
And the novel verse was in its prime during those years. I looked forward to new releases from pocketbooks as much as I had looked forward to new episodes on the television.
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Superman and Plur1bus made the year worthwhile, in my book.
Actually, I'd call it a huge relief: we have a fighting chance of the whole S31 premise being permanently abandoned, so that we can get back to exploring strange new worlds, seeking out new life and new civilizations, and boldly going where none have gone before.
And as to SNW Season 3, well, I'm awaiting the DVD release with a worm on my tongue.
On the other hand...
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I've always maintained that even subpar Star Trek is better than most of the crap on tv.
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I've always maintained that even subpar Star Trek is better than most of the crap on tv.
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You make it sound like Section 31's been used a ton of late, when really the film and the last couple episodes of Lower Decks were the most prominent instances since Discovery's second season in 2019.
S31 was a bad idea the first time, and a worse idea every time it was brought back, and if there's never another reference to it, it'll be too soon.
comparing a joke that went flat with the Sweeney advert is hyperbole at best. Anyway, Section 31 stunk. I'm surprised it even got 16%. Tommy Wiseau could have made a better Star Trek movie than whoever created that thing.
But SNW season 3 was good. I don't think as a franchise Star Trek is galloping into the next year but it's not bleeding out in the snow, either. SFA will decide that.
But SNW season 3 was good. I don't think as a franchise Star Trek is galloping into the next year but it's not bleeding out in the snow, either. SFA will decide that.
It worked perfectly as implemented by Ira Steven Behr and the rest of the writing staff on DS9 because they understood exactly what story purpose Section 31 served.
Agreed, though I didn't mind how they were used on Enterprise. Everyone else seems to just treat them as Star Trek's Secret Agents.
I don't mind Section 31 but it needed something else.
No.
Actually, yes.
Even in DS9, they felt forced. Honestly, I never saw them as a fit for the Star Trek universe.
Not to say they didn’t get a generally entertaining episode or two out of it. Much like “Mirror, Mirror”, it is a silly concept that should’ve stopped while they were ahead.
I actually think you can make an argument that this was the worst year for Star Trek, unfortunately. I'm not saying I necessarily believe that, but if you take into account:
1. Section 31 was the most poorly received Star Trek "movie" in the history of the franchise.
2. The beloved SNW series had a very sub-par season.
3. The Kelvin-verse films were (finally officially) shelved
There is definitely an argument to be made. Even looking at 2002...Nemesis wasn't as universally reviled as S31, and I'd say SNW S3 most likely had far less viewership than ENT S2.
1. Section 31 was the most poorly received Star Trek "movie" in the history of the franchise.
2. The beloved SNW series had a very sub-par season.
3. The Kelvin-verse films were (finally officially) shelved
There is definitely an argument to be made. Even looking at 2002...Nemesis wasn't as universally reviled as S31, and I'd say SNW S3 most likely had far less viewership than ENT S2.
ENT season2 had something like 4 to 5 million viewers on average. With Paramount Plus cliaming 79,000,000 subscrubers and SNW heavily advertised, I suspect more people saw season 3 of that show than ENT season 2.
One of the biggest problems with the movie as a movie is it doesn’t really want to go with its concept. They worked on this thing for YEARS, and it’s fascinating to me whenever people take story elements and then don’t want to use them the way they’re intended to exist. And after updating the concept for this project, they end up making the whole thing worse.
You have Section 31 (an organization that rationalizes doing bad things for good reasons) and a character whom the last time we saw her (DSC’s “Terra Firma”) had realized she wasn’t the same person she was as emperor of the Terran Empire. She was a character given another chance by the Guardian of Forever after her adventure in a doorway.
The most interesting thing you could do with that is set up a situation where Georgiou is NOT running a seedy bar eating eyeballs, but have her attempting to be a different person and maybe trying to do good and charity when we first see her again. And then have the story take off when she’s tempted by Section 31, who convince her that she’ll be helping people. But, in order to do that, she’s effectively breaking the law and committing war crimes.
If they had created ethical dilemmas, where Georgiou is asked to do bad things for the greater good and made it a “road to hell is paved with good intentions” story, to me that would have been more interesting and had a better shot at working. Instead of it being a “redemption arc” (which I don’t think they achieve at all with the final product) where her and the team run around like any Starfleet crew, make it a tragedy where she’s asked more and more to become her old self. Make it a story where a person is trying to be better, she’s trying to believe in the Federation’s values, and have Section 31 destroy that belief by using her for the purpose of “protecting” those values, but in the worst imaginable way possible.
The movie doesn’t want to make Section 31 or Georgiou into bad guys, which is crazy given that we’re talking about two parts of Trek canon that have already been confirmed to be guilty of mass murder. They want them to end up happy, drinking booze, and giggling around a table at the end. And I think it’s just totally wrong for the material.
A Section 31 movie (or TV series) should leave you uncomfortable. It should leave you wondering whether their choices were “good” or “right” if it means people die for the greater good, or if it’s better for people to die and suffer if it means standing up for the values they believe in.
I hope there's nowhere to go but up from that somewhat sad looking parade float... everyone needing umbrellas... Mr. Takei looking like he was in a neck brace... A bit of an inauspicious start to the 60th year.
"Optimism!" Like the Denobulan said, I guess.
"Optimism!" Like the Denobulan said, I guess.
I thought the parade float looked great. It can't be helped that it rained.
