Spoilers Was Luke...

[Kirk the Jerk]

It's gonna be a lot more painful to watch someone you know falling to the Dark Side, than to try to save someone you never knew.

I think it's pretty clear that what Luke saw was so bad that all he could think of was stopping it, even if he had to kill Ben to do it.

I'm thinking you must have seen some kind of alternate cut somewhere, because that's not how things played out in the version I saw. In the one I saw Luke had already stopped himself before Ben saw him.

So in your version he dis-engaged his light saber did he? He said ‘oh what am I doing?’ And then Ben woke up? If that was the case why did he push him through a wall?

 

[JD]

No, but he stopped before he actually swung the blade.
You should probably go take another look at my other post, I just edited it.

 

[Kirk the Jerk]

No, but he stopped before he actually swung the blade.
You should probably go take another look at my other post, I just edited it.

Ok I get that, he stopped because he saw Ben’s eyes, had he not woke up though we already know he would’ve killed him because he had planned to do so n that’s my main problem. He’d have gone ahead with it, I mean he was inches from doing it, but the fact he looked his nephew in the eye stopped him from hurting him. I just cannot buy that Luke would do that, it’s a cowards way, killing someone in their sleep. Especially someone you’ve raised from a child. Luke wasn’t a coward before TLJ. I just don’t like this portrayal of my child hood hero. That is all.

 

[JD]

We don't know that for a fact, he was clearly hesitant even before Ben saw him.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

If Luke was so hell-bent on killing Ben, he would never have gone into the room in the first place. Luke could have easily killed him from a distance, using the Force or even a blaster.

 

[Reverend]

For those not paying attention, each time we saw the incident with Ben and Luke it was slightly different depending on who's perspective it was being told from and in what context and yet all of them are true. It's like a mini 'Rashomon'.

 

[fireproof78]

A mistake isn’t going in to some ones room in the middle of the night attempting to kill them though (that’s more than a mistake, to me). It came across as a pre planned thought. Like he decided that killing him was the best course of action. I don’t believe Luke would do that n that is my argument. Whether or not this movie showed us that actually, that was the case, I cannot accept that to be true.

Again I use the example of a parent and their criminal son or daughter. The son or daughter could cause numerous crimes yet the parent would still believe that their child is good. They still believe that they will learn from their crimes and become good which is why they don’t shop them in to the police. Luke would still see the good in his nephew despite him having bad thoughts IMO.

Since I work with people who have been called "evil" by their parents and regarded poorly, I'm going to say that it is possible. People are capable of great evil, no matter what we want to believe.

Secondly, Luke saw the Dark Side, fully encountered it. It made him afraid and he went in to the room, sensed the Dark Side in Ben, and Snoke's draw upon in. He activated his lightsaber, and, for a brief moment, thought of stopping the darkness from spreading. Then he stopped himself, but, before he could do anything else, Ben woke up.

At least that's if I'm remember the film correctly, since it was told from different perspectives, Luke's and Ben's.

 

[Kirk the Jerk]

If Luke was so hell-bent on killing Ben, he would never have gone into the room in the first place. Luke could have easily killed him from a distance, using the Force or even a blaster.

Using a blaster isn’t the Jedi way

 

[11Alive]

Well, if we assume a certain premise - namely, that when it comes to the incident in question and the different ways it's depicted, the third time's the charm - then what we have assumed the film to be telling us does not match your description of what happens.

Give it up. I've come to the conclusion that he's either as dense as a neutron star or just trolling. Given his user name, I'm leaning towards the latter.

 

[11Alive]

We've been asking that question since Obi Won "died".

What the heck are you talking about? Nobody struck down Obi Wan's Force ghost. Vader killed the flesh and blood Obi Wan.

Why would a projection not have an aura around it also? And if you can make the projection realistic, it wouldn't be that hard to make the appearance of your ghost equally realistic if, say, you needed to keep your crazy nephew distracted while your sister and the last hope of the galaxy escaped through the caves.

You are reaching for straws because you don't like what you saw (or probably didn't really watch intently) on the screen.

Leia sensed his presence had vanished, and probably realized he was already "dead." As for Rey, as far as I can remember she was a lot more interested in taunting Kylo at that point.

No. You need to watch it again and pay attention. They were boarding the Falcon when Luke died and left his robes. Rey wasn't "taunting Kylo." They weren't feeling his projection vanishing, which happened a minute earlier. They were sensing his life ebbing away as he used the last of his strength. Unless you think Force ghosts still wear actual robes.

I'm through with you, too. I think you, like Kirk the Jerk, just like to argue for the sake of argument.

 

[fireproof78]

Using a blaster isn’t the Jedi way

Hmm....

Weird...

 

[WarpFactorZ]

I don't think so. Remember, also, that that Ren slices through him first and THEN tries to stab him, only then realizing he's fighting a ghost.

No, he realizes he's fighting a Force projection.

Luke's final line "I will not be the last Jedi" coincides with Rey using the force to rescue what's left of the resistance,

Yes, but this doesn't imply he's a ghost. Also, he said "I will not be the last Jedi" (still alive), not "I wasn't the last Jedi" (dead).

What comes immediately after that is probably a flashback.

Nothing in the movie supports this conclusion.

 

[Kirk the Jerk]

Hmm....

Weird...

Hahaha! Damn! Well, erm, Technically the only photo there of Luke using a blaster as a Jedi is the one at Jabbas palace but we digress

 

[Crazy Eddie]

What the heck are you talking about? Nobody struck down Obi Wan's Force ghost. Vader killed the flesh and blood Obi Wan.

No he didn't. Obi Won vanished mid swing, disappearing in front of him. Vader found this rather puzzling, which is why we see him padding Obi Won's empty robes wondering "Why is there no body here?" Luke, who didn't know this and couldn't see what was happening, assumed Vader had cut his head off and yelled out.

You are reaching for straws because you don't like what you saw (or probably didn't really watch intently) on the screen.

I actually loved that scene. It was a very surprising and well executed plot twist IMO. I just think the plot was a bit more twisted than some people think.

I'm through with you, too. I think you, like Kirk the Jerk, just like to argue for the sake of argument.

Damn, and I thought Star Trek fandom was toxic.

 

[Kirk the Jerk]

I'm through with you, too. I think you, like Kirk the Jerk, just like to argue for the sake of argument.

Wow what is wrong with you? Who’s arguing? Clearly discussion boards aren’t your thing. I don’t come here to argue with anyone. I like to discuss my thoughts and hear other people’s, as I said before, that doesn’t mean I have to agree with everything I read. You obviously take great offence to people not agreeing with you.

 

[galad2003]

It probably does have a lot to do with the way it was portrayed, we literally know nothing of the events that led up to that night, which is probably why I and a lot of other people have a hard time accepting it.

I still find it impossible that Luke, having witnessed first hand this child grow from a baby into a young adult, would be capable of doing what we saw. It’s like a lot of parents ( rightly or wrongly) see their children as golden, no matter what crimes they’ve committed. I know Ben isn’t Luke’s child but hes the closest thing he had to his own.

What if you walked into your nephew's room and had a vision, It turns out he is Hitler before he rose to power. I think the best of us would be tempted to off Hitler if we had a flash of what he was going to do. Luke having a moment of weakness is not that hard to imagine. Plus Snoke may have been using his powers to influence both Ren and Luke.

We see the scene two times, one from Luke's POV and the other from Kylo's. Did you only catch Kylo's POV?

 

[fireproof78]

Largely, it seems that Luke doing something like this is unimaginable, despite a 30 year gap and some pretty big failures befalling him.

 

[Kirk the Jerk]

What if you walked into your nephew's room and had a vision, It turns out he is Hitler before he rose to power. I think the best of us would be tempted to off Hitler if we had a flash of what he was going to do. Luke having a moment of weakness is not that hard to imagine. Plus Snoke may have been using his powers to influence both Ren and Luke.

We see the scene two times, one from Luke's POV and the other from Kylo's. Did you only catch Kylo's POV?

Darth Vader WAS space hitler n he still believed there was still some good left in him.

In both POVs we saw Luke ignite his Saber as Ben slept. In Luke’s we see a brief pause and a tear in Luke’s eye then he realises Ben has woke up, they look at each other for a few seconds n then Ben force pulls his blue saber towards him and uses it to strike Luke’s saber which is still ‘armed’.

Luke shouts Ben, No! I understand the scene, my problem remains with Luke thinking this was the best course of action, to me it’s out of character.

But what’s done is done, nothing I say will ever change the fact Rian Johnson chose to go down this route.

 

[fireproof78]

Darth Vader WAS space hitler n he still believed there was still some good left in him.

In both POVs we saw Luke ignite his Saber as Ben slept. In Luke’s we see a brief pause and a tear in Luke’s eye then he realises Ben has woke up, they look at each other for a few seconds n then Ben force pulls his blue saber towards him and uses it to strike Luke’s saber which is still ‘armed’.

Luke shouts Ben, No! I understand the scene, my problem remains with Luke thinking this was the best course of action, to me it’s out of character.

But what’s done is done, nothing I say will ever change the fact Rian Johnson chose to go down this route.

You're welcome to that POV and certainly I've seen it around. I just am baffled by the idea that nothing that happend to Luke between ROTJ and the incident could have allowed for a moment of weakness.

But, YMMV and all that

 

[galad2003]

Darth Vader WAS space hitler n he still believed there was still some good left in him.

In both POVs we saw Luke ignite his Saber as Ben slept. In Luke’s we see a brief pause and a tear in Luke’s eye then he realises Ben has woke up, they look at each other for a few seconds n then Ben force pulls his blue saber towards him and uses it to strike Luke’s saber which is still ‘armed’.

Luke shouts Ben, No! I understand the scene, my problem remains with Luke thinking this was the best course of action, to me it’s out of character.

But what’s done is done, nothing I say will ever change the fact Rian Johnson chose to go down this route.

Rion Johnson was trying to present the characters with flaws. Luke made a mistake and he had to deal with that mistake. That mistake has horrible, horrible consequences. I guess you just want Luke Skywalker to be perfect.

This route allows the story to be different than the original trilogy. They are clearly saying Ben can't be brought back tot he light side, this is not another Darth Vader story. It will be a different story. Getting rid of Snoke helped do that to. How awful would it have been to have Snoke (Palpatine) trying to have his apprentice Kylo Ren (Darth Vader) turn his relative* (Son) to theDark side but Rey (Luke) manages to convert Kylo Ren (Darth Vader) to the light side and the destroy Snoke (Palapatine).

Johnson flipped the table ont hat script, thank goodness. it just seems like people are losing their shit over that. I guess this movie didn't have 'memberberries so everyone is losing it.

* relative being where peopel wanted Rey to be related to Luke thus making her cousins with Kylo Ren or somethign similar.