Vulcans & Premarital (Pre-Ponn Far?) Sex

[fireproof78]

On any given day the life of everyone on the enterprise is in danger, they should never allow kids to live on Star ships.

So, parents should never serve in Starfleet?

 

[Willsky7]

So, parents should never serve in Starfleet?

I'm just saying that it is not a safe environment for children. If you wanna have kids maybe work at utopia planetia, the academy, some kinda base deep inside federation territory, as a secretary for an admiral, or as a janitor or something like that. I wouldn't want my kid on a star ship.

 

[fireproof78]

I'm just saying that it is not a safe environment for children. If you wanna have kids maybe work at utopia planetia, the academy, some kinda base deep inside federation territory, as a secretary for an admiral, or as a janitor or something like that. I would want my kid on a star ship.

Might want to edit that last sentence

Also, starships are equipped with shields, and phasers and the like. Heck, in the original concept with the Galaxy class, the families went on the saucer and the stardrive went in to battle.

 

[Willsky7]

Might want to edit that last sentence

Also, starships are equipped with shields, and phasers and the like. Heck, in the original concept with the Galaxy class, the families went on the saucer and the stardrive went in to battle.

Thanks lol

The saucer thing makes sense to me. But there are still so many things that could kill them all regardless. The crystalline entity and that black cloud thing from the 2nd season, or what if Q was an even bigger jerk, the borg (although I think they might have taken the kids off in best of both worlds, but I don't remember). thats some dangerous stuff.

 

[fireproof78]

Thanks lol

The saucer thing makes sense to me. But there are still so many things that could kill them all regardless. The crystalline entity and that black cloud thing from the 2nd season, or what if Q was an even bigger jerk, the borg (although I think they might have taken the kids off in best of both worlds, but I don't remember). thats some dangerous stuff.

How many disasters befall colonies too? Not saying that a starship isn't dangerous, but part of it is how long they are away from their families, and part of it is the fact that this type of danger, and attitude towards death is common place now. At least, initially in GR verse.

 

[Willsky7]

How many disasters befall colonies too? Not saying that a starship isn't dangerous, but part of it is how long they are away from their families, and part of it is the fact that this type of danger, and attitude towards death is common place now. At least, initially in GR verse.

Very true. Wesley is clearly old enough to understand the danger and accepts it, ok no problem there. But what about the younger kids that don't understand the danger and can't make decisions for themselves?

 

[fireproof78]

Very true. Wesley is clearly old enough to understand the danger and accepts it, ok no problem there. But what about the younger kids that don't understand the danger and can't make decisions for themselves?

Who says they don't? These are "more evolved" humans who are able to work together to thwart alien plots after all.

 

[Willsky7]

Who says they don't? These are "more evolved" humans who are able to work together to thwart alien plots after all.

I have no doubt that kids in Star Trek would mature faster. However there are some babies on board, what about 2 or 3 year olds, you think they talk to them about the dangers a Star ship faces when they are potty training? Plus we see those two sick kids in the one episode that got a horrible disease and are stuck behind force fields, they act like normal kids who clearly have a lot to learn about the dangers the universe holds, and they looked like 9 or 10 years old.

 

[φ of π]

A ship of exploration would be statistically more likely to encounter unexpected threats. Therefore a risk assessment regarding a family with children is a lot harder to do for an exploratory vessel than any other type of starship.

 

[Hahawaitwhat]

Starships are protected by their crews, armaments, shields, and multiple layers of security. It's not exactly a free-for-all, you know. And Earth is not exactly 100% safe either (no world or starship ever is), as it has been the target of alien attack many times as well.

In the end... whenever possible, children should be with their parents. Worf, despite his initial skittishness, honestly tried to do his best in caring for Alexander, and it seems obvious that Ben Sisko was the best father (to Jake) that he could possibly be.

The point is that you can't simply ship a kid off to his/her grandparents whenever things get rough. Sometimes you've just got to stick it out and be the best parent that you can be - wherever you happen to be living or serving.

To add to this... We're seeing the starship 'stories' when something eventful happens. It's sort of implied that *most* of the time everything is peachy-keen. So, danger only crops up in very rare instances.

 

[fireproof78]

I have no doubt that kids in Star Trek would mature faster. However there are some babies on board, what about 2 or 3 year olds, you think they talk to them about the dangers a Star ship faces when they are potty training? Plus we see those two sick kids in the one episode that got a horrible disease and are stuck behind force fields, they act like normal kids who clearly have a lot to learn about the dangers the universe holds, and they looked like 9 or 10 years old.

I think parents can make their choice.

 

[Willsky7]

To add to this... We're seeing the starship 'stories' when something eventful happens. It's sort of implied that *most* of the time everything is peachy-keen. So, danger only crops up in very rare instances.

Sure but how many ships have we seen either destroyed or dissapeared entirely. The galaxy class ship that was destroyed in DS9, I hope there weren't any kids on board. Or what if there were kids on the Pegasus, or the defiant (TOS), or any of the ships destroyed by the borg in "best of both worlds". Adults can make a life long decision to serve, and possibly die, in starfleet, but small children can't.

 

[Hahawaitwhat]

Sure but how many ships have we seen either destroyed or dissapeared entirely. The galaxy class ship that was destroyed in DS9, I hope there weren't any kids on board. Or what if there were kids on the Pegasus, or the defiant (TOS), or any of the ships destroyed by the borg in "best of both worlds". Adults can make a life long decision to serve, and possibly die, in starfleet, but small children can't.

True, but we don't allow children to make their own choices anyhow. It's at the discretion of the parents. I imagine all the benefits of growing up on a starship, all the experiences, are well-balanced with the danger.

 

[Nyotarules]

Nope, I don't like DC's explanation. Seriously: "I mean, every seven years would be a little bad." Yes, having sex only once every seven years would be bad for most HUMANS. But Vulcanians aren't humans. I say let them be alien. Let them have a strange sexuality.

My view that Vulcanian males only have sex during their Pon Farr. They must return to a specific place on the planet Vulcan to complete this ritual. I think we tend to focus only on the seven years cycle and completely forget that the place is just as important as the time. The entire premise of Amok Time is based on this.

The only thing known to disrupt that seven year cycle is stated in "The Cloud Minders" which is "extreme feminine beauty". So there may be rare occasions when the seven year cycle is disrupted, but for the most part it's the rule.

DC Fontana wrote Amok Time she set up the fictional culture so I'll take the creators word for it. I doubt Amanda waited every 7 years for sex. Pre Surak Vulcans used to kill for their mates, sounds like their sexuality was greater than a humans.

 

[Nyotarules]

Why does one assume the Vulcan sex drive the same as for humans? Also Vulcan biocontrol could decrease the urge for sex for years.

It would not make them the same as humans, it would make them the same as every other alien shown in the franchise, including humans.
If you are in an arranged marriage where you and your spouse do not like each other, every 7 years might suit you fine. However others that have a love match, I doubt they wait that long. T'Pol was capable of mating with Trip.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

T'Pol was capable of mating with Trip.

But that is Trip. Who wouldn't pounce on him if they had the chance?

 

[Willsky7]

True, but we don't allow children to make their own choices anyhow. It's at the discretion of the parents. I imagine all the benefits of growing up on a starship, all the experiences, are well-balanced with the danger.

True but there is a big difference from making a kid move schools or cities, to a Star ship. Most decisions that parents make for their children aren't life and death. I wouldn't say that anti-vaccination nuts are making good decisions for their kids.

 

[Ronald Held]

It would not make them the same as humans, it would make them the same as every other alien shown in the franchise, including humans.
If you are in an arranged marriage where you and your spouse do not like each other, every 7 years might suit you fine. However others that have a love match, I doubt they wait that long. T'Pol was capable of mating with Trip.

In the human sense,they may not like or love each other. Only mentally compatible,but this not Canon.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

There's nothing that says Vulcan couples can't love each other. They may not express that love in the same way that humans do, but Vulcans can - and do - love their mates.

Sarek and Amanda, for example. They are obviously in love. Whenever we see them onscreen - TOS, DSC, Kelvinverse, whatever - it shows. I mean, you've seen ST09, right? Sarek openly admits that he married Amanda because he LOVED her.

Remember, it's only the Kolinahr adepts - a small percentage of the Vulcan population - who have actually eliminated emotion. Most Vulcans, Sarek included, still have them. They just don't show it in the same way that we do.

 

[Tim Thomason]

I think it's conceivable that, despite Fontana's assertion, that most Vulcans don't mate as a matter of course outside the cycle.

But pairings of Vulcans and non-Vulcans (or perhaps two Vulcans not bonded with one another, since Voyager and Enterprise established female Pon Farr) is different. If a romantic partner requires or even wishes for private intimacy, then an "emotionless" Vulcan would have no qualms with providing this. It's the most logical thing to do.