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"Voyage Home" Enterprise on its way to scrapyard

The USS Ranger, which stood in for the Enterprise in ST4, is on its way to the scrapyard.

http://www.peninsuladailynews.com/a...-uss-ranger-is-on-its-way-to-texas-scrap-yard

Yeah it's sad. I was in Bremerton a few years ago and the decommissioned carriers: Independence, Ranger, Kitty Hawk and Constellation were all there in a row and the active carrier Nimitz was one slip down.

It was amazing to see 5 super carriers in a row like that, even though 4 were inactive.

Now Constellation and Ranger are gone. Independence is due to be towed later this year. Kitty Hawk will be there for a few years in inactive reserve but by year's end she'll be the only one left.
 
I guess they feel her days are over.

But we had requested...
Well she was decommissioned in 1993 and immediately deemed unfit for further service, so she wasn't even held in inactive reserve. It's fair to say her day had been over for a long. She's basically been sitting by a pier rusting away for 22 years. Couple of groups tried to save her for a museum but failed.

Navy's been kind of slow on disposing of it's retired carriers. But they're making up for it now with a vengeance five have been started in the last few years including sadly the enterprise and a 6th one is going to join them later this year.
 
Still, when you consider that these ships were only intended to be around for 30 or 40 years, they've had REALLY long lives.
 
Wow! I've been on board this carrier, when it docked in Fremantle Harbour (Western Australia) in 1993 - it was the beginning of January if I remember correctly. I think it was on its way home during its final voyage, from a deployment in the middle east.

I recall the excitement of being able to walk up and touch an F-14 Tomcat (I was an 11 year old boy), as one was open for tactile contact to the public, with its pilot standing by it, answering questions from the public. My dad even lifted me up so I could put my hand inside of the M61A1 Vulcan hole behind the nose. The actual Top-Gun movie-used F-14 was also on display behind a rope.

That kind of lax security would never of been seen in the post-9/11 world, but I got the distinct impression - even at the age I was then - that it was a PR move by the US. Australia has always been a big ally of the US and it was very soon after the first Gulf War. It truly was an awesome experience!

I never realized it was the same ship from The Voyage Home!!!
 
Still, when you consider that these ships were only intended to be around for 30 or 40 years, they've had REALLY long lives.

Well what's impressive, or sad depending on how you at it, was the fact that the ships were so adaptable that they could have served between around 50 years.

When the first "Super-Carrier" i.e. aircraft carriers that were specifically designed to operate jet aircraft and were much larger than their predecessors and had reveolutionary design elements that made aircraft safer and more efficient (although some of these designs like the angled deck were retro fitted onto some WWII era carriers so they could operate some jets, albeit in smaller scale) was launched in 1955 (USS Forrestal) it was designed to have a service life of about 30 years, much of which was based on the assumption jets would continue to evolve so much that jets in 30 years would be too advanced for the ship to operate.

However the basic design of the Forrestal class was so successful that, with upgrades from time to time it could continue to operate each next generation of aircraft, which didn't advance as much as the military thought. In fact the Forrestal is essentially the same design that every aircraft carrier built since had been based on. There have been improvements and advances, the most notable being the switch to nuclear power, but in most ways the Forrestal, when she was decommissioned, was pretty much every bit as capable and powerful a warship as the most modern carriers are.

In the early 80's, when the the Cold War was still going and the Navy wanted to keep as many carriers active as possible, the Navy instituted a program called "Service Life Extention Program" or SLEP which was designed to add another 15-20 years of service life to the pre Nimitz class carriers, stretching their lives into 2005-2020 time span. Kind of like how they refitted the Enterprise in TMP, although the exterior of the carriers reamained more or less the same.

The program consisted of taking a ship or 2 out of service and, over a period of 2-3 years upgrading upgrading the ships in ways that couldn't be done during normal refit schedules. Then once they went back into the feet doing it to another ship or two.

When the program started there were 9 1950-60's era carriers in the fleet. Of these 6 received the SLEP program,a 7th the USS Enterprise, being the only nuclear powered one of the group received her own program called RCOH (Recoring and overhaul) which was a more extensive version that also included replacing her nuclear power cores. Due to the complex nature of the Enterprise, being the first nuclear carrier and one of a kind, her RCOH went way over budget to the point where it cost almost as much as the ship itself cost to build. Many speculate had she not been named ENTERPRISE and been historic in nature the RCOH would have been cancelled and she would have been decommissioned in the 90's.

But then the cold war ended and it wasn't necessary for the Navy to possess so many carriers. The natural and logical idea would have been to keep the ones in service, give the SLEP program to the two that hadn't had it yet and then replace them as they were retired. But the Navy was terrified they could cut the budget for future nuclear carriers and was so gung ho on an all nuclear fleet that they deliberately let these billion dollar assets breakdown.
The two carriers that didn't receive SLEP had it cancelled and were immediately decommissioned. One of which, the USS America, had barely been in service 30 years. The other non nuclear carriers had routine overhauls and maintainence cut drastically and only one, the Kitty Hawk, came close to it's 50 year life span (47) all the others were decommissioned anywhere between 8 and 20 years before the end of their useful service lives.
The Enterprise made it to 51 years of service before being retired in 2012 and probably only made it that long because of her iconic status. The Navy wanted all Nimitz class ships in it's fleet and the Enterprise was much more complex and costly to operate (It had 8 reactors as opposed to the Nimitz's 2. This was done because the engineers weren't totally sure how much power the reactor would be able to effectively generate at sea, so to be on the safe side they put in 8, which was the same number of generators on a conventional powered ship. As a result the Enterprise was so overpowered that the ship was never able to be opened up all the way speed wise because the hull structure couldn't take the stress. There's never been an official confirmination but street talk has it the Enterprise hit close to 50 MPH on a few occassions. By far faster than the Nimitz which could 35 and even faster than destroyers.

It's almost criminal in my mind how the nation let these ships breakdown early so they could protect their precious future builds. God knows how many billions this cost the taxpayers.

And they still haven't learned. On two occassions (Seawolf submarine and Zumwalt destroyer) the Navy has insisted on developing new ships, despite the fact the current ships we have are more advanced than any other navy in the world, that were so expensive that they couldn't be built in large numbers. Both have 3 completed or scheduled to be finished. And they're doing it with their carriers. Despite the fact no navy in the world has anything as advanced as the Nimitz class, despite it's 40 year old design, the navy insisted it wasn't enough and a new class was created. Only problem is each ship is going to cost AT LEAST $15 billion, where a Nimitz cost about $5 billion, and a Forrestal class would cost about $2 billion in todays dollars.
Yeah the new class is more advanced in many ways, but when you come down to it a newly built Forrestal class ship would be pretty close in almost every capacity and exactly the same in the amount of planes it could launch.
The Navy does their usual BS about how the cost will pay off over time., which there is no real way to measure. But Don't tell me it's so advanced that it's equal to 3 Nimitz class ships or 8 conventionally powered supercarriers.

In fact the program is already in trouble. The first ship the Ford is basically finished and will be commissioned in 2016, but it won't make it's first deployment until 2019!!!!! Three years between the date the Navy says it's operational until she goes on active combat patrol.....that's ridiculous. The second, John F. Kennedy is under construction and the 3rd the next Enterprise is supposed to start in 2020, but people are already starting to question whether that will happen.

I'm a former navy man and served proudly but this country is SERIOUSLY headed in the wrong direction with this we gotta have weapons 2 or 3 generations ahead of everyone else, despite they can only build a fraction of them because of cost.

We hear this how the US spends more on the military than any other country in the world and feel pretty smug. What people don't realize is we might spend 5 billion on a nuclear attack sub, while China spends 2 billion and gets 5 or 6 diesel electric attack subs out of it, which are still very good ships and are more than capable of taking on our super fancy subs and defeating them by sheer numbers, which is the way it's going.

We'd better hope China doesn't decide to start a conventional war with us because the way things are going we're going to be seriously outnumbered in such a way that our super sophisticated weapons won't be able to do anything about.
 
Still, when you consider that these ships were only intended to be around for 30 or 40 years, they've had REALLY long lives.

It's almost criminal in my mind how the nation let these ships breakdown early so they could protect their precious future builds. God knows how many billions this cost the taxpayers.

I'm a former navy man and served proudly but this country is SERIOUSLY headed in the wrong direction with this we gotta have weapons 2 or 3 generations ahead of everyone else, despite they can only build a fraction of them because of cost.

We hear this how the US spends more on the military than any other country in the world and feel pretty smug.

I hear ya'. while I never served, I was a navy brat. The amount we spend on our military is startling compared to the amount we spend on education when you compare it to other nations. My oldest boy is about to go to college and the costs are staggering. The issue is where do we spend our money? And what does that say about our priorities as a country. I agree we shouldn't be smug, we should be thoughtful. But I don't see that happening in the Balkanized state our country is in. That's the nice thing about trek bbs. Everyone is respectful to differing opinions. I have rarely seen feuds in the topics.
 
Still, when you consider that these ships were only intended to be around for 30 or 40 years, they've had REALLY long lives.

It's almost criminal in my mind how the nation let these ships breakdown early so they could protect their precious future builds. God knows how many billions this cost the taxpayers.

I'm a former navy man and served proudly but this country is SERIOUSLY headed in the wrong direction with this we gotta have weapons 2 or 3 generations ahead of everyone else, despite they can only build a fraction of them because of cost.

We hear this how the US spends more on the military than any other country in the world and feel pretty smug.

I hear ya'. while I never served, I was a navy brat. The amount we spend on our military is startling compared to the amount we spend on education when you compare it to other nations. My oldest boy is about to go to college and the costs are staggering. The issue is where do we spend our money? And what does that say about our priorities as a country. I agree we shouldn't be smug, we should be thoughtful. But I don't see that happening in the Balkanized state our country is in. That's the nice thing about trek bbs. Everyone is respectful to differing opinions. I have rarely seen feuds in the topics.

Yeah I agree it shows how messed up we are as a society. The military and sports stadiums always have more than enough money for their needs. Meanwhile schools and hospitals are always dealing with budget crunches and our politicians just shrug their shoulders and go "Well there's nothing we can do about it......"

I wouldn't be so bothered by military spending if I felt it was being done wisely in a way that actually gives us bang for our buck.

More and more though it seems the military isn't happy to have just the best equipment.......they have to have the best, best, best, equipment. Despite the absolutely ridiculous cost. The already done it three times in the past decade. Seawolf cost so damn much they only built 3 of them. The Zumwalt destroyer, same thing....Arleigh Burke class was perfectly fine and as good as any surface ship in the world despite it's 25 year old design.....nope wasn't good enough had to have a Ferarri instead of a Corvette.....bang 3 Zumwalt destroyers built. Now it's the Ford carriers....At least 15 billion a pop. Could get 3 Nimitz class ships or 8 conventional powered carriers with the exact same strike capabilities and they would be the only ships that powerful in the world.

Air Force same way. F-15's and F-16's weren't good enough so they develop the F-22....Incredible aircraft. Incredibily expensive so something like 135 are built and they've never seen any action because the AF is afraid of one getting shot down.

It's basic numbers. If you give 2 guys $5,000 and say build an army and you're going to fight in an open field and one guy buys the 2 of the fanciest automatic weapon available for $2500 and the other buys 10 AK-47's at $500......Guess which side is going to have people alive at the end? Sure a $2500 weapon is probably better than a $500 one, but it sure as hell isn't going to negate a 5 to 1 advantage in numbers if the other side has decent weapons too.
 
Reportedly USS America was badly over stressed (much like the old USS FDR). She was built differently from her sister ships.

The reports on the speed of USS Enterprise has been relegated to tall tales by most experts. Though it is still possible that she could have been rather fast, most reports see to indicate that the issue has more to do with that with all those reactors, Enterprise could just go. Not need to get the steam turbines up to speed, not need to heat up the boilers....all she needed to do was get the screws spinning and push the water out of the way. (I would report that my father is a 1969 witness to Enterprise's speed, being there off Hawaii doing rescue operation from USS Moctobi when Enterprise had her fire. When they got an all clear on the search for bodies in the water, Enterprise took off for Pearl and was over the horizon really fast. His math might be off, but he was calculating between 45 and 60 knots to get from a stand still to over the horizon in whatever period of time it was. Mind you, young sailors then still thought in terms of the engines needing to get up to speed, where as the nuclear fleet could just go.)

As for high tech into the Navy. One of the problems the older ships have been having is that they don't have the electrical power to run all the additional computer systems and cooling systems for those computers (AC for the crew, fiddlesticks, the AC is for the hardware). With things like the railguns and lasers in the works, the electrical grids on the older ships just cannot keep up for combat conditions. One assumes the new block of Burkes will have a better power grid in preperation for new systems.

By the end of the year, the US Navy will have retired all the Perry-class frigates. Repurposing the term frigate for the Littoral Combat Ships.

The Ford-class carriers....If they continue at one commissioning every five years or so the last one to be commissioned will be replacing the Ford itself. And there will be years where there are gaps in the 10 carrier navy due to the timing of commissioning of the Nimitz-class carriers verse the five years between each commissioning of a Ford.

As for the high tech of the military. The idea being that you build one high tech thing that can kill 15 of the next level down without it being shot at at all. This sort of thing works with airplanes, warships, and tanks. An analogy like that does not work in the battlefield level with troops. Unless you are talking cloaking devices, shields, or power armor to where one guy can take out 15 enemies without a worry to his own safety.
 
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