Spoilers Voq Theory (graphic/violent)

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Lord Garth, Dec 29, 2017.

  1. Serveaux

    Serveaux The Wind Premium Member

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    nope.jpg
     
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  2. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Commodore Commodore

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    Serveaux is right.

    "Javid Iqbal" has exactly one acting credit to his name. And that's Voq on Star Trek: Discovery.

    I have more acting credits than "Javid Iqbal" does (among other credits). Me, of all people. Granted, they're all in independent films, but still...

    I highly, highly, highly doubt that Star Trek: Discovery would cast a first-time actor with no previous acting credentials whatsoever. What's he done before? And he would've had to have done stuff before to get into SAG and I'm assuming the role of Voq and any other speaking role in DSC would be SAG. And even if he paid a substantial amount of money upfront to become SAG, he still would've had to have had some previous acting credentials to land the part unless he was just that good and I don't think he is.

    "Javid Iqbal" is an alias for Shazad Latif. And Shazad Latif has plenty of credentials.

    Which is why we're here speculating about whether or not Ash is Voq. So I, among several other people, will either be right or we'll all have egg on our face. But that's what goes with the territory of posting about theories.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2018
  3. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Would there be some sort of union reason why they wouldn't be able to credit Shazad as both characters if it isn't a story reason?
     
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  4. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Commodore Commodore

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    I'm not entirely sure, I'm not SAG (and don't want to be at this point), though I should learn more about it anyway, but I think they're trying to throw people off so someone would be able to (theoretically) say, "See? It's not the same actor!"
     
  5. Tim Thomason

    Tim Thomason Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Latif has been credited in the opening credits of every episode, Tyler or Voq or neither ("Context is for Kings"). I take the final credit for Voq as an equivalent to the joke credits in the Naked Gun movies. He's already properly credited for his role, per Union rules, the other credit is just to mess with the fans.

    In my belief, at least.
     
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  6. Prax

    Prax Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    They created a new Ash Tyler in the replicator, adding in parts of Voq, the same way they replicate puppies on the Enterprise D.

    The flashbacks are memories of Voq's strange fetishes.
     
  7. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Commodore Commodore

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    Last edited: Jan 8, 2018
  8. rahullak

    rahullak Commodore Commodore

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    So I was wrong that it was just a gimmick. Voq is in Ash. And it's both mind download and surgical alterations.
     
  9. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    And it's cute how Culber's excuse actually makes worlds of sense. Yes, they did scan Tyler at arrival. Yes, they did notice all the changes. Yes, they had a good reason to think those meant nothing. And heck, they even did the "Manchurian test" to find any hidden programming, but somehow "reverse Manchurian" is not revealed by such testing.

    Most of the episode is one big infodump. But this dumplet enjoyably continues the tradition of the show carefully addressing issues raised by previous episodes, sometimes better, sometimes worse. The bits about the ethics of Culber treating Stamets fall in the same category of things finally clarified...

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  10. Attentiveluke

    Attentiveluke Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I dont know why they just didnt use the klingon augment virus on him. Ash could pass for an augment klingon circa 2260s if he had a goatee beard. They could have plucked one of the millions of klingons who suffer from this affliction from the empire and had them be an Arne davrin. Although it seems augmented klingons dont exist in either the burnhamverse or the kelvinverse....
     
  11. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The Augment-lite Klingons of ENT were internally trivially recognizable as Klingons: the heroes could immediately point this out with their primitive machinery even without the help of Phlox.

    This literal "hack job" they did on Voq seems to have worked much, much better, turning a Klingon into what looks like a maimed human to a trained human doctor. Heck, not even a tribble can recognize Voq from beneath Tyler! (Assuming the thing on Lorca's desk is even alive, that is.)

    For all we know, Darvin was indeed an Augment-lite, as McCoy could tell he was internally Klingon. But then we'd have to rationalize why McCoy doesn't know about Augment-lites. Now we can say he's an expert who recognizes simple plastic surgery when he sees it, and can rule out the use of the Augment virus and its antidote.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  12. Crazy Eddie

    Crazy Eddie Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Because the "Augment Virus" explanation for the smooth-headed Klingons is an incredibly stupid way of explaining their appearance in TOS and we are all better off moving away from that explanation if at all possible.

    Thank god.
     
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  13. Captain of the USS Averof

    Captain of the USS Averof Commodore Commodore

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    You’ve answered your own question. Augmented Klingons don't exist in the Discoverse (and Kelvinverse). If they did "Klingon purity champion" T'Kuvma would have written a 20-page speech about them.
     
  14. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Commodore Commodore

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    He definitely would've. Though, judging by his acceptance of Voq, he might've gone the route of "Klingon in your heart" because they didn't choose to be infected.

    But, this is the impression I'm getting: If DSC runs 10 seasons (I don't think it will but humor me) that would take us straight into TOS and -- though I could be wrong -- I doubt we'd see Smooth Heads.

    So, I'm leaning very heavily towards agreeing with you.
     
  15. Tuskin38

    Tuskin38 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    DSC is in the Prime Timeline, there is no 'Discoverse'.
     
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  16. dodge

    dodge Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    My life is the Discoverse! :p

    [​IMG]
     
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  17. Prax

    Prax Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Discoverse exists before the shatnerverse and after the archerverse.
     
  18. Lord Garth

    Lord Garth Commodore Commodore

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    I can vouch for it. Those of us who were born in the '70s are from the Discoverse.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2018
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  19. Rhodan

    Rhodan Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    The more likely is everyone is going to pretend that Enterpise two-part never happened.
     
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  20. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ...Even though DSC now has gone out of its way to establish it did?

    So far, Star Trek has never "tried to pretend something didn't happened". Old episodes either are referred to as being part of the in-universe history, or then are left unmentioned. Oh, there may be contradictions, but then there are contradictions to those contradictions to cancel it all out... Never has a Trek writer tried to actively claim that something aired in the name of Trek didn't actually happen.

    Timo Saloniemi