USS Discovery in TOS?

[Qonundrum]

"Uhura, notify the discovery on subspace radio."

Line fluff, which meant to involve the contacting of Starfleet Command of the anomaly via stilted, informal dialogue. There's too much unrelated, one-time, irrelevant backstory since - in TOS - especially as the only time another starship is mentioned is the one that got destroyed or was about to get destroyed. And youtube has plenty of fun videos showing the Enterprise blowing up the Discovery as fanfic that makes Axanar look insignificant by comparison.

 

[Qonundrum]

The next generation created their own universe and I appreciated what was done, and they made leaps to distance themselves from TOS. Also, even an episode of Trek, "Time's Arrow" referenced Worf as a "Werewolf" so the comparison is on par.

I love the series because of the tech manuals and new lingo. No problem with the changes because it's from the future of TOS movies. What I find offensive is when these same people from the TNG who are integrated in these so-called meta prequels and sequels start merging TOS into the mix and then re-write what was on TOS.

This bullshit started on DS9 Blood Oath, and then Trials and Tribble-lations, the Movie First Contact and then ST:Enterprise, and now Discovery. I don't mind if these creators just stay in their own lane like TNG and make the best stories possible but stop re-writing and sh*tting all over a series which was instrumental to everything.

As much as I adore "Tribbleations", there's still ambivalence from me as the bomb finding scene doesn't work because everyone who had a tricorder or sensor would have picked up on it. Retconning an extra tribble falling out of the grain compartment into Dax beaning Kirk with it doesn't help. The episode comes REALLY close to keeping a line between being on the sidelines and actively interfering, but as much as a visual masterpiece it is (and it is), using "the old bomb that nobody can find despite having equipment that will find it trick" didn't really work.

"Blood Oath", from what I remember, felt more like a shoehorned ratings grab by bringing back the TOS actors for a sweeps week episode. No explanation for the bumpy foreheads was given, it';s just accepted. No tribble talk in that episode either - which may have been wise as they already risked looking fanwanky by bringing back all three Klingon commanders that Kirk faced as one heck of a coincidence. Didn't realize it got well over 8 million viewers, which was pretty good for the time (TNG did far more, but for a spinoff, 8 mil is pretty solid. Especially with other episodes doing similarly if not better.) On the other hand, getting to see role reprisals can be fun... But DS9 already had its mojo, as surrounding episodes were already holding their own and then some, the nods to the past and trolling with the lure of reprisals - was it truly needed...?

 

[STEPhon IT]

I loved Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, and I know the DS9ers will lose their minds for me saying this because I rip it a new one every time a retarded War seasons spot were mentioned, the series had it's own subculture and it was a slow pacing drama series in the beginning. It was important to flesh out these characters from the start and embrace the premise these characters couldn't simply blast their way out of crisis nor runaway from it. The crew had to face these issues head on while creating this Time Square of alien surroundings.

From some reason, the fans turning pro writers started slowly bringing a lot of the things we've already seen forever on TNG. I thought and still think implanting a War on Star Trek is a complete betrayal of the concept, and a big f^ck you to the multifaceted story lines and brilliant characters created for the show. Simply put, the DS9 characters don't work that way. It's like having the cast of Gilmore Girls all of a sudden armed with machine guns and fighting a civil war in Stars Hollow.

So Ira Behr started tinkering, and tinkering, and more tinkering taking layers out of the characters to simply react to things, but make weird attempts to cater to TNG fans. Problem was which I discovered--something in the fashion of Doctor Who--when he tried to bend over backwards to lure those fans in like Ron Moore and Michael Dorn and gravy training everything done on TNG, some did come, while many DS9 fans left the show.

TNG distanced themselves from the fanwank because it was necessary to take what they're doing seriously. DS9 couldn't resist doing it and then ended up being a total mess by the end of it. Too many cooks in the kitchen while no one wanted to clean it up. From highly intelligent races like the Cardassians and the Romulans join forces to invade the Dominion's realm was out of character and very stupid. A union like that could never happen on TNG or from the first 2 seasons of DS9 because they don't trust anyone.

I liked those fanwank episodes less such as "Trials and Tribble-lations because of the planting of the seeds of bullshit to come - by rewriting the lingo, and tech and culture of TOS. As I've mentioned on other threads, most fans and occasional fans never questioned how or why the Klingons looked different from TOS to TMP. Many accepted some were from different places because as you know even humans don't all look alike. So "Blood Oath" comes by and created a mess, the fans turning pro are the biggest problem for Star Trek because they can't resist in trying to make Trek fit into their own feces.

 

[Qonundrum]

No other Trek series can slap TOS in the face, believe me!
JB

If they try, you know someone will come up with something like this:

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(The first 28 seconds are the best! The rest are gravy...)

 

[Emperor Norton]

I'm kinda of the opinion that there's a Bioshock Infinite deal going on here, predicated on the universe where Burnham lived versus one where she died in that attack as a child. *Mutters to self about why don't they just make it an alternate TOS parallel universe, which would be so cool instead of the globs of denial*

 

[Poltargyst]

I loved Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, and I know the DS9ers will lose their minds for me saying this because I rip it a new one every time a retarded War seasons spot were mentioned, the series had it's own subculture and it was a slow pacing drama series in the beginning. It was important to flesh out these characters from the start and embrace the premise these characters couldn't simply blast their way out of crisis nor runaway from it. The crew had to face these issues head on while creating this Time Square of alien surroundings.

From some reason, the fans turning pro writers started slowly bringing a lot of the things we've already seen forever on TNG. I thought and still think implanting a War on Star Trek is a complete betrayal of the concept, and a big f^ck you to the multifaceted story lines and brilliant characters created for the show. Simply put, the DS9 characters don't work that way. It's like having the cast of Gilmore Girls all of a sudden armed with machine guns and fighting a civil war in Stars Hollow.

So Ira Behr started tinkering, and tinkering, and more tinkering taking layers out of the characters to simply react to things, but make weird attempts to cater to TNG fans. Problem was which I discovered--something in the fashion of Doctor Who--when he tried to bend over backwards to lure those fans in like Ron Moore and Michael Dorn and gravy training everything done on TNG, some did come, while many DS9 fans left the show.

TNG distanced themselves from the fanwank because it was necessary to take what they're doing seriously. DS9 couldn't resist doing it and then ended up being a total mess by the end of it. Too many cooks in the kitchen while no one wanted to clean it up. From highly intelligent races like the Cardassians and the Romulans join forces to invade the Dominion's realm was out of character and very stupid. A union like that could never happen on TNG or from the first 2 seasons of DS9 because they don't trust anyone.

I liked those fanwank episodes less such as "Trials and Tribble-lations because of the planting of the seeds of bullshit to come - by rewriting the lingo, and tech and culture of TOS. As I've mentioned on other threads, most fans and occasional fans never questioned how or why the Klingons looked different from TOS to TMP. Many accepted some were from different places because as you know even humans don't all look alike. So "Blood Oath" comes by and created a mess, the fans turning pro are the biggest problem for Star Trek because they can't resist in trying to make Trek fit into their own feces.

Wow, I saw it so differently. I considered TNG to be pretty mediocre really. And when DS9 started, it looked to me like they were trying to be like TNG with the same kinds of mediocre stories. It wasn't until the war stuff started that things got good on DS9. Finally they stepped away from TNG and were doing their own thing which was a heckova lot more interesting than what I had seen previously on DS9 or on TNG.

 

[Poltargyst]

I'm kinda of the opinion that there's a Bioshock Infinite deal going on here, predicated on the universe where Burnham lived versus one where she died in that attack as a child. *Mutters to self about why don't they just make it an alternate TOS parallel universe, which would be so cool instead of the globs of denial*

Discovery is a parallel universe. I don't care what they say.

 

[Emperor Norton]

Discovery is a parallel universe. I don't care what they say.

I'd be totally cool with that. I'd even be a major supporter and fan for that. It's just the extreme denial and pretending and doublethink and defensiveness (which would generally be reserved for something you'd take several years of therapy for but somehow is applied to a Star Trek series) that annoys me and which I won't go along with. I know an apple isn't an orange just because the salesman says its an orange.

 

[Phoenix219]

Considering they already have the entire concept of alternate universes in play as a core concept, there is really no reason this *shouldn't* be the case..... one background gag / easter egg / throw-off reference (ala TNG Parallels) to show something much more resembling TOS would be all anyone needs to put it all to rest and end the arguing and hate.

 

[Nerys Myk]

would be all anyone needs to put it all to rest and end the arguing and hate.

Sad to say, but I don't think it would.

 

[johnnybear]

The next generation created their own universe and I appreciated what was done, and they made leaps to distance themselves from TOS. Also, even an episode of Trek, "Time's Arrow" referenced Worf as a "Werewolf" so the comparison is on par.

I love the series because of the tech manuals and new lingo. No problem with the changes because it's from the future of TOS movies. What I find offensive is when these same people from the TNG who are integrated in these so-called meta prequels and sequels start merging TOS into the mix and then re-write what was on TOS.

This bullshit started on DS9 Blood Oath, and then Trials and Tribble-lations, the Movie First Contact and then ST:Enterprise, and now Discovery. I don't mind if these creators just stay in their own lane like TNG and make the best stories possible but stop re-writing and sh*tting all over a series which was instrumental to everything.

I've always thought it was because Rick Berman and especially Brannon Braga were somewhat embarrassed about TOS and tried to make it conform to their idea of Trek! Berman couldn't do that while Roddenberry was still alive and the first two seasons of TNG were very much similar to the TOS style I could see!
JB

 

[johnnybear]

Discovery is a parallel universe. I don't care what they say.

Right on brother!
JB

 

[Emperor Norton]

Sad to say, but I don't think it would.

It would for many. The problem is, they wouldn't do it.

 

[johnnybear]

I wouldn't say it was hate, but fans of TOS don't like to be told that a new show that they are producing is set ten years earlier than the series we all grew up with despite it's advanced technological look and breaking of continuity! The same with ENT, but that was affected by the Temporal Cold War from a future time that was never really explored or understood! Bad writers and producers yet again that never gave us any answers to questions that they had asked since the very first episode! There is the same problem here with the odd looking Klingons which ignored the divergence set up in ENT and a conflict with them that never happened in the original timeline!
JB

 

[Syd Shanshala]

This argument AGAIN????
*rolls eyes to back of head*

 

[Nerys Myk]

I wouldn't say it was hate, but fans of TOS don't like to be told that a new show that they are producing is set ten years earlier than the series we all grew up with despite it's advanced technological look and breaking of continuity!

Speak for yourself. This TOS fan is fine with the changes made in DISCO.
It's the future! It damn well better look more advanced than today or a version of the future created in the middle of the last century.
The "breaks in continuity" are no worse that the ones in TOS its self. Though frankly I can't think of any that egregious on DISCO's part.

 

[MAGolding]

And here is a link to another question on the subject.

https://scifi.stackexchange.com/que...otify-the-discovery-on-subspace/179018#179018

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

Discovery being in TOS would make as much sense as the Orville docking at Deep Space 9, it's an unconnected universe.

 

[Commishsleer]

I wouldn't say it was hate, but fans of TOS don't like to be told that a new show that they are producing is set ten years earlier than the series we all grew up with despite it's advanced technological look and breaking of continuity! The same with ENT, but that was affected by the Temporal Cold War from a future time that was never really explored or understood! Bad writers and producers yet again that never gave us any answers to questions that they had asked since the very first episode! There is the same problem here with the odd looking Klingons which ignored the divergence set up in ENT and a conflict with them that never happened in the original timeline!
JB

I used to think as you but I've jumped over to the darkside as also mentioned by another poster.
I don't want any new Star Trek produced being restricted to the technology/fashion of the 1960s. I'd be happier with more of a retro vibe on occasion in DSC to tie it in a bit better with TOS. Not all the time but someone could have say a turtleneck in their uniform collection.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Discovery being in TOS would make as much sense as the Orville docking at Deep Space 9, it's an unconnected universe.

A ship from a Star Trek show appearing on a Star Trek show? Where's the disconnect?