Uniform Code Not So Uniform

[The Borgified Corpse]

Because Dukat hated him.

Yes, but how does the Bajoran government know that that's not all an elaborate ruse to give Garak an excuse to stay behind on the station and spy on them? Even if Gul Dukat's hatred for him was genuine, he's just one officer. Garak could still be reporting to the Obsidian Order. WE know that that wasn't the case but the characters on the show circa Seasons 1-2 don't know that.

Later on in the episode, Ro pulled off a nice trick with her uniform.

Ro was part of the landing party that beamed down to a Bajoran camp. At the camp, Ro encountered a little Bajoran girl. Feeling sympathy for the girl, Ro took off her jacket and gave it to the girl. Note how she opened up her jacket from the frontside.

But just previous to her taking off her jacket, you can notice that her jacket (as well as the jackets of every other Enterprise Starfleet crew member) had the zipper, or opening, on the backside. That was a nice trick Ro pulled off.

Apparently, Starfleet uniforms may not be uniform from one scene to another. I guess it depends on the plot.

In any case, when Ro did take off her jacket, it was revealed that she wore a sleeveless shirt under that jacket. Actually, I thought that she looked good wearing that shirt. Too bad TNG didn't incorporate that jacketless-sleeveless-undershirt look more often for its female crew members. It was a good look. It was casual, yet it still looked respectable.

It might have happened, but I can't recall anyone else going jacketless (with that particular uniform jacket) during the series. Early on the series, there were crew members who wore the short sleeve and shorts getup. But that looked tacky. And on TMP, there was also a short sleeve version of the uniform that crew members had the option of wearing.

So it wouldn't have been unprecedented for there to have been a casual version of the Starfleet uniform that could have been worn by some TNG characters at various times.

Interesting. The only other officer I remember regularly doing the sleeveless undershirt look was Major Kira. Maybe Bajoran women have arms that get hot very easily?

As for her trick of unzipping the front even though the zipper usually seems to be visible in the back, I'm very used to costume's changing for the sake of the scene. Reminds me of the bit in Batman Returns where there's exactly one shot of Michael Keaton wearing the cowl without the black makeup around his eyes because he takes his cowl off in that shot and the character doesn't actually wear black makeup around his eyes. That's just something that they make the actor do because it looks goofy otherwise.

 

[fireproof78]

Yes, but how does the Bajoran government know that that's not all an elaborate ruse to give Garak an excuse to stay behind on the station and spy on them? Even if Gul Dukat's hatred for him was genuine, he's just one officer. Garak could still be reporting to the Obsidian Order. WE know that that wasn't the case but the characters on the show circa Seasons 1-2 don't know that.

I think mutual hatred of Dukat may soften their view, for whatever reason.

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

I suspect that their general hatred of Cardassians would supersede any sympathy they might have for Garak's situation vis-à-vis Gul Dukat. Remember the Bajoran that killed Aamin Marritza at the end of "Duet." "He's a Cardassian. That's reason enough." I suspect that most Bajorans share his attitude even if most of them don't resort to random murder. So I kinda feel that the Bajoran government wouldn't take too kindly to a Cardassian who is so evasive that he won't even make his first name a matter of public record.

 

[fireproof78]

I suspect that their general hatred of Cardassians would supersede any sympathy they might have for Garak's situation vis-à-vis Gul Dukat. Remember the Bajoran that killed Aamin Marritza at the end of "Duet." "He's a Cardassian. That's reason enough." I suspect that most Bajorans share his attitude even if most of them don't resort to random murder. So I kinda feel that the Bajoran government wouldn't take too kindly to a Cardassian who is so evasive that he won't even make his first name a matter of public record.

A Cardassian tailor who had attracted the ire of Dukat would possibly evoke enough. Not saying they completely trust him but enough to make it work. Even if most Bajorans share the attitude of "He's a Cardassian" it doesn't automatically mean we shoot him either. Sometimes all it takes is knowing the right person. Had a German uncle who came to the United States right before the outbreak of WW2. He ended up working for a major power company back in Pennsylvania/Eastern United States.

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

If Germany had brutally occupied the U.S. for 50 years, I suspect that he would have found himself a lot less welcome.

I'm not saying that the Bajorans would have had Garak executed. But I suspect that they at least looked into the possibility of deporting him. Maybe Garak could claim asylum but then he'd probably have to come clean about his background to explain why he would be in danger if he returned to Cardassia. And, sure, Garak could lie. But he's not actually as good of a liar as he thinks. He can't say anything without a smug smirk that announces to the world, "I'M HIDING SOMETHING." Even Dr. Bashir guessed that he was a spy from the outset and Season 1 Bashir was a complete blithering idiot!

 

[Kraig]

Well, except for Dowton Abbey, I cannot think of any popular period piece /present day television series shown in the US that are not set in the US.

I mean, I don't even know if the current Dr. Who is shown on a mainstream US channel.

The US exports their shows, not import them. Even shows like The Office and House of Cards were remade and set in the US.

The UK produced shows I have watched recently:
Endeavour prequel to Inspector Morse
Victoria
Vera
Doc Martin
Wallander
The Crown
Inspector Lewis
Sherlock
Grantchester
Van Der Valk
Foyle's War

Most are on PBS stations on local over the air Broadcast TV.

Current Dr. Who is on Cable and Satellite on the BBC America channel.

Epix channel has War of the Worlds, Belgravia, Pennyworth and Britannia.

 

[fireproof78]

If Germany had brutally occupied the U.S. for 50 years, I suspect that he would have found himself a lot less welcome.

I'm not saying that the Bajorans would have had Garak executed. But I suspect that they at least looked into the possibility of deporting him. Maybe Garak could claim asylum but then he'd probably have to come clean about his background to explain why he would be in danger if he returned to Cardassia. And, sure, Garak could lie. But he's not actually as good of a liar as he thinks. He can't say anything without a smug smirk that announces to the world, "I'M HIDING SOMETHING." Even Dr. Bashir guessed that he was a spy from the outset and Season 1 Bashir was a complete blithering idiot!

All he needs is one supporter or something the Bajorans needed.

 

[Shawnster]

The UK produced shows I have watched recently:

What a nice list. Yes, it is possible to watch programs from other countries. I watched "Charlie Jade" a few years ago and that was from South Africa.

Just because it's possible to watch shows set outside the US doesn't mean they are popular in the US. The average, typical, lowest common denominator television viewer in the US does not have much exposure to programs set outside the US.

I would not call out members here typical lowest common denominator.

 

[The Wormhole]

Yes, but how does the Bajoran government know that that's not all an elaborate ruse to give Garak an excuse to stay behind on the station and spy on them? Even if Gul Dukat's hatred for him was genuine, he's just one officer. Garak could still be reporting to the Obsidian Order. WE know that that wasn't the case but the characters on the show circa Seasons 1-2 don't know that.

The Bajoran government figured in the early years there were likely still quite a few spies still in the Bajor system, either Cardassians surgically altered to appear Bajoran or possibly even some actual Bajorans still collaborating with the Cardassians for whatever reason. With Garak out in the open, it's easier to keep tabs on him, and maybe they were hoping to root out some of the other spies in system thinking they would expose themselves by reporting to him or something.

 

[Lady Mondegreen]

I've definitely had my mom refuse to give TV shows I recommended on Netflix a chance because they were set in another country. Not in another language, just set in another country. I don't understand it, but a lot of people feel that way.

 

[Shawnster]

LAST NAME: Garak
FIRST NAME: Plain, Simple

 

[BK613]

@Shawnster one word: anime.

 

[The Wormhole]

I've definitely had my mom refuse to give TV shows I recommended on Netflix a chance because they were set in another country. Not in another language, just set in another country. I don't understand it, but a lot of people feel that way.

You should ask her how she thinks us non-Americans feel when nearly every TV show available to us is set in another country.

 

[Orphalesion]

I can understand not liking media coming or being set in a specific country, but refusing media from any country but your own is less easy for me to understand.
Personally I have seen movies and shows from many countries and I do have certain countries where I will not be very eager to watch media produced by or set in them.
For example, I love a lot of French media. It's very varied, it often has decent production values, it discusses topics that the main stream media in some other countries still wouldn't touch. (not saying all of it is good, especially their mid-20th century stuff is abysmal)
On the other hand, I really don't like Scandinavian movies in general, they are just not my thing and really. I only watched Midsommar after a friend told me it's actually an American movie just set in...was it Sweden?

So if somebody suggest watching a French movie I'll be more likely to agree than if somebody suggest a Swedish film, but those are opinions I have formed after sampling a fair amount of media from both those places.

There's also some places I'm just not interested in seeing on the screen. Like I don't want to insult anybody, but some places on this planet are just boring or even depressing to look at for me. So if a movie or book or show is set there, I'll probably pass on it. But again to me it's not so much which country the place is in, but whether I find the place ugly or boring to look at.

 

[Roundabout]

Interesting. The only other officer I remember regularly doing the sleeveless undershirt look was Major Kira. Maybe Bajoran women have arms that get hot very easily?

You're right about that. Kira, like her fellow Bajoran Ro, sported the sleeveless undershirt look at times.

But the sleeveless undershirt look wasn't just a thing with Bajoran women. Your post jogged my memory. I recall that Jadzia went jacketless during her rumble in the jungle in "Change of Heart". It made perfect sense in that jungle heat.

As for her trick of unzipping the front even though the zipper usually seems to be visible in the back, I'm very used to costume's changing for the sake of the scene. Reminds me of the bit in Batman Returns where there's exactly one shot of Michael Keaton wearing the cowl without the black makeup around his eyes because he takes his cowl off in that shot and the character doesn't actually wear black makeup around his eyes. That's just something that they make the actor do because it looks goofy otherwise.

You're right about that too. If the director didn't have Ro pull off that trick, the alternative would have been for Ro to ask Picard to unzip her. Now that would have been goofy to behold, for the viewers; not to mention how awkward it would have been for Captain Picard to undress his subordinate in public.

 

[Kraig]

I can understand not liking media coming or being set in a specific country, but refusing media from any country but your own is less easy for me to understand.
Personally I have seen movies and shows from many countries and I do have certain countries where I will not be very eager to watch media produced by or set in them.
For example, I love a lot of French media. It's very varied, it often has decent production values, it discusses topics that the main stream media in some other countries still wouldn't touch. (not saying all of it is good, especially their mid-20th century stuff is abysmal)
On the other hand, I really don't like Scandinavian movies in general, they are just not my thing and really. I only watched Midsommar after a friend told me it's actually an American movie just set in...was it Sweden?

So if somebody suggest watching a French movie I'll be more likely to agree than if somebody suggest a Swedish film, but those are opinions I have formed after sampling a fair amount of media from both those places.

There's also some places I'm just not interested in seeing on the screen. Like I don't want to insult anybody, but some places on this planet are just boring or even depressing to look at for me. So if a movie or book or show is set there, I'll probably pass on it. But again to me it's not so much which country the place is in, but whether I find the place ugly or boring to look at.

You might like the 2009 Swedish version (with Noomi Rapace) of the Stieg Larsson Trilogy Män som hatar kvinnor a.k.a. The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo, The Girl Who Played With Fire, and The Girl Who Kicked The Hornets Nest. I found it to be better than the later released US versions with Claire Foy.

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

You're right about that. Kira, like her fellow Bajoran Ro, sported the sleeveless undershirt look at times.

But the sleeveless undershirt look wasn't just a thing with Bajoran women. Your post jogged my memory. I recall that Jadzia went jacketless during her rumble in the jungle in "Change of Heart". It made perfect sense in that jungle heat.

I think that there were also some Voyager episodes where Janeway or Torres went with the tank top look but that always looked pretty sloppy to me. (I can't remember any episodes where Janeway had that look except for maybe "Year of Hell" but I'm not sure. Torres I remember specifically in "Blood Fever" & "Juggernaut.")

You might like the 2009 Swedish version (with Noomi Rapace) of the Stieg Larsson Trilogy Män som hatar kvinnor a.k.a. The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo, The Girl Who Played With Fire, and The Girl Who Kicked The Hornets Nest. I found it to be better than the later released US versions with Claire Foy.

There was also the 2011 English language version of The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo starring Rooney Mara. I always wanted to introduce her to the actress from the original films. "Rooney, Noomi. Noomi, Rooney."

 

[fireproof78]

I think that there were also some Voyager episodes where Janeway or Torres went with the tank top look but that always looked pretty sloppy to me. (I can't remember any episodes where Janeway had that look except for maybe "Year of Hell" but I'm not sure. Torres I remember specifically in "Blood Fever" & "Juggernaut.")

I think the one with the giant microbes.

 

[Orphalesion]

You might like the 2009 Swedish version (with Noomi Rapace) of the Stieg Larsson Trilogy Män som hatar kvinnor a.k.a. The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo, The Girl Who Played With Fire, and The Girl Who Kicked The Hornets Nest. I found it to be better than the later released US versions with Claire Foy.

I doubt it, since I don't like any version of that series, not movies, not books and if they'd turn it into a Netflix show, I still wouldn't like it.

 

[FormerLurker]

You might like the 2009 Swedish version (with Noomi Rapace) of the Stieg Larsson Trilogy Män som hatar kvinnor a.k.a. The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo, The Girl Who Played With Fire, and The Girl Who Kicked The Hornets Nest. I found it to be better than the later released US versions with Claire Foy.

I've seen the Swedish films under the blanket title "Millenium". I think they might have aired as a TV miniseries in Sweden at some point.