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Trek Returning to TV in 2017!

I don't believe that Paramount could've been happy with what Darkness, with it's $190m budget, took globally.

Uh huh. :rolleyes:

Whether Paramount is happy or not is irrelevant. What's relevant is that CBS has realized that people still want to see Trek, so they decided to create a new series. They wouldn't have done that if Paramount's movies were a dismal failure.

So Into Darkness didn't do for Star Trek what The Avengers did for Marvel, or The Fellowship of the Ring did for Middle Earth?

I know thats a high ambition for Star Trek to set it's eyes upon - but Star Trek is no mereB-list franchise - it's of incredible cultural importance - what other damn franchise has physicists and astronauts telling people it inspired them to be who they were?
 
I don't believe that Paramount could've been happy with what Darkness, with it's $190m budget, took globally.

They were happy enough to do a third movie.

Yes, because Trek still makes Paramount money. Some money. And along with Mission Impossible, it's one of its few franchises.

When you look at what the Marvel movies make, some of them with considerably smaller budgets (Ant Man, budget of $130m, taken nearly $514m global), JJ Trek's takings as a ratio of budget have been small fry. Avengers Age of Ultron cost $250m and has taken over $1.4bn. I'll be surprised if Star Trek Beyond comes in much under $200m, and what's it likely to take? Probably no more $450m.
 
When you look at what the Marvel movies make, some of them with considerably smaller budgets (Ant Man, budget of $130m, taken nearly $514m global), JJ Trek's takings as a ratio of budget have been small fry. Avengers Age of Ultron cost $250m and has taken over $1.4bn. I'll be surprised if Star Trek Beyond comes in much under $200m, and what's it likely to take? Probably no more $450m.

But Star Trek simply has never been in that league. Anyone expecting those numbers from a Trek movie is delusional.
 
When you look at what the Marvel movies make, some of them with considerably smaller budgets (Ant Man, budget of $130m, taken nearly $514m global), JJ Trek's takings as a ratio of budget have been small fry. Avengers Age of Ultron cost $250m and has taken over $1.4bn. I'll be surprised if Star Trek Beyond comes in much under $200m, and what's it likely to take? Probably no more $450m.

But Star Trek simply has never been in that league. Anyone expecting those numbers from a Trek movie is delusional.

Given what you've said, and I agree with you, do you think Paramount should be spending $200m on a Trek film?
 
Good. I wonder what starship will be the setting, if the movies are continue on the 1701? :vulcan:

Huh. That's very interesting. I hadn't even considered they'd go back to another Enterprise. I have a feeling, though, they won't this time; however they'll be smart to continue using the 'vehicle' of a starship, though. DS9 took two seasons before they realized that Trek needs a starship to propel the crew into stories we wanna see. :cardie::klingon::rommie:
 
When you look at what the Marvel movies make, some of them with considerably smaller budgets (Ant Man, budget of $130m, taken nearly $514m global), JJ Trek's takings as a ratio of budget have been small fry. Avengers Age of Ultron cost $250m and has taken over $1.4bn. I'll be surprised if Star Trek Beyond comes in much under $200m, and what's it likely to take? Probably no more $450m.

But Star Trek simply has never been in that league. Anyone expecting those numbers from a Trek movie is delusional.


I'm sure if a "Star Trek" movie verse had at least 3 series gathered in one movie it could generate the revenue needed.


J.J verse

TNG

Shatner


The J.J movie would make the most money while TNG and Shatner bring in decent amounts.


It's the same thing with the marvel movies. Some underperform but when you get all the characters in one movie it's guaranteed to make money.
 
Given what you've said, and I agree with you, do you think Paramount should be spending $200m on a Trek film?

That isn't my call to make, because it isn't my money.

But a movie with a $60 million dollar budget would've been quickly forgotten. People just aren't interested in going to theaters to watch stilted, TV style dialog delivery and TV level special effects.

Paramount had to up their game to make Star Trek a going concern. Considering that we now have a fourth movie confirmed and a new TV series coming, that investment has probably paid off for them.
 
Well, I for one am already looking forward to being disappointed in the new show for vaguely defined failures to be what I want!
 
I am sure that a great Star Wars film could be made, that utterly ignored the philosophy of Star Wars - it would gain box office acclaim - but would it actually bode well for the health of the franchise if the special spirit that brought about such loyalty in the first place was disregarded?

I know my opinion doesn't matter, only been a fan since 1975. But, I still don't see where the Abrams films ignored the philosophy of Star Trek? Not even a little bit.

Okay, a few brief ideas:

1). Watch an episode like say "The Doomsday Machine". Note how professional everyone behaves (except the man who is under psychological stress). Note how Starfleet is an organization in which hard work, earnest careers, and respect for the chain of command are all important. Note that these are aspects that professional historians argue make or break a successful civilization - it's institutions and organizational capacity. Then compare this composed behavior to the behavior of Kirk and co. in the new films - when taken purely as entertainment, they are alright - but they make Starfleet look like "The Last Starfighter" - a man promoted to Captain right out of the academy - people arguing over each other on the bridge of a starship (a piece of hardware, which like a nuclear submarine, is capable of leveling a planet).

That stood out quite a lot for me - although I am aware that Kirk didn't always behave professionally in the TOS movies.

2). To really write well for a given franchise, you have to respect the philosophical ideals of the franchise. In the case of Star Trek, whether people like it or not, those are the ideals of humanism, secularism, rationality, respect for intellect, respect for civilization, problem-solving, progressiveness, and yes, even a little atheism.

The ideals are not dark and gritty space opera (as much as I enjoy that too), so for example, the dreary cynicism of Battlestar Galactica would be out of place. And, in the case of JJ Abrams, I feel like the franchise was consciously taken away from its humanist and secular roots, and made into something more along the lines of 'Lost'.

Gone was the (often quite good) science present in many previous iterations of Star Trek - in it's place, Doctor Who style Harry-Potter-in-Space techno-magic. Gone was the very sober view of our place in the universe, and instead Kirk "was destined to command Enterprise", despite a butterfly effect of massive proportions having happened.

People imbibe themes whether they notice them or not; and Star Trek, like Star Wars, or Tolkien, was so successful because people 'got' the message it was delivering, and agreed.
 
When you look at what the Marvel movies make, some of them with considerably smaller budgets (Ant Man, budget of $130m, taken nearly $514m global), JJ Trek's takings as a ratio of budget have been small fry. Avengers Age of Ultron cost $250m and has taken over $1.4bn. I'll be surprised if Star Trek Beyond comes in much under $200m, and what's it likely to take? Probably no more $450m.

But Star Trek simply has never been in that league. Anyone expecting those numbers from a Trek movie is delusional.

What do you mean, not it that league?

How can people say this?

Marvel Comics were something that didn't seriously exist outside of paper, once upon a time, then didn't exist outside of cartoons, and now, they are the most successful cinema franchise of all time.

And people are telling me that Star Trek, a show which featured guest appearances by Professor Stephen Hawking (for god sake), and inspired astronauts, and which has a massive cultural presence, can't have a blockbuster movie on the same level as Marvel?

I have some doubts about this line of argument.
 
Gone was the (often quite good) science present in many previous iterations of Star Trek - in it's place, Doctor Who style Harry-Potter-in-Space techno-magic.

For example, in the Original Trek, we have the quite sensible idea that a planet got so old it was crumbling in on itself like an abandoned house, which naturally caused water to become an infectious agent making people act drunk. Whereas in Abrams Trek, we have the ridiculous and positively anti-scientific conceit of the Enterprise crew being able to put together a device that prevents a volcano from erupting.
 
Well, I for one am already looking forward to being disappointed in the new show for vaguely defined failures to be what I want!

:lol:

I look forward to cherry picking examples from previous iterations of Trek that prove my completely subjective opinion on some minor point of contention that no one cares about is absolutely correct!
 
1). Watch an episode like say "The Doomsday Machine". Note how professional everyone behaves (except the man who is under psychological stress). Note how Starfleet is an organization in which hard work, earnest careers, and respect for the chain of command are all important. Note that these are aspects that professional historians argue make or break a successful civilization - it's institutions and organizational capacity. Then compare this composed behavior to the behavior of Kirk and co. in the new films - when taken purely as entertainment, they are alright - but they make Starfleet look like "The Last Starfighter" - a man promoted to Captain right out of the academy - people arguing over each other on the bridge of a starship (a piece of hardware, which like a nuclear submarine, is capable of leveling a planet).

A man who saved a planet and, probably, the Federation. The rules seem to be a bit looser in Starfleet. We watched Spock steal the Enterprise, Kirk ignore orders. They were never exactly a military machine. The entire lot of them would've been tossed out of a real military a dozen times over.


2). To really write well for a given franchise, you have to respect the philosophical ideals of the franchise. In the case of Star Trek, whether people like it or not, those are the ideals of humanism, secularism, rationality, respect for intellect, respect for civilization, problem-solving, progressiveness, and yes, even a little atheism.

Which Abrams missed how exactly?

The ideals are not dark and gritty space opera (as much as I enjoy that too), so for example, the dreary cynicism of Battlestar Galactica would be out of place. And, in the case of JJ Abrams, I feel like the franchise was consciously taken away from its humanist and secular roots, and made into something more along the lines of 'Lost'.

I disagree. For me, the Abrams films feel like an extension of the original Star Trek. Warts and all.

Gone was the (often quite good) science present in many previous iterations of Star Trek - in it's place, Doctor Who style Harry-Potter-in-Space techno-magic. Gone was the very sober view of our place in the universe, and instead Kirk "was destined to command Enterprise", despite a butterfly effect of massive proportions having happened.

Good science? :lol:
 
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