Trek III 35th

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by Khan 2.0, Jun 2, 2019.

  1. Khan 2.0

    Khan 2.0 Commodore Commodore

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    earth...but when?...spock?
    35ths a thing right? (although on SM every single year is an anniversary now)

    35th article:
    https://intl.startrek.com/article/facts-about-star-trek-search-for-spock-35th-anniversary
    one interesting thing there is Nimoys talking about III in 2011 - 'I thought the script was workable and did what it had to do, which was to find Spock and get him back on his feet. I thought it was an interesting idea, the whole idea of the Genesis planet evolving and Spock’s remains evolving with the planet. It may not have been as much fun a film as some would like, but I thought it did the job. It did it what it set out to do. Maybe, in retrospect, we might have found a better story or construct, to get that job done. '

    maybe timetravel would've been a fun way to go: :)
    https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/other-ways-to-have-brought-back-spock.276075/
    https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/star-trek-wrath-of-khan-backlash.285042/page-10#post-12103875
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2019
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  2. Armus

    Armus Commodore Commodore

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    Maybe Harve Bennett's original outline would have been the best route. The following is from memory-alpha:

    According to an article on io9.com, [2] Harve Bennett's original outline for Star Trek III would have involved Romulans coming to Genesis instead of Klingons and them finding the world very rich in dilithium. The Romulans then begin to mine the planet until the miners begin being killed by a feral Spock, whose aging was still tied to the aging of the planet. At the same time, Vulcan, upon hearing of the Genesis Device, is so horrified to discover that the Federation created such a potential weapon they want to secede from the Federation. This would have sent Kirk to Vulcan, with the crew of the Enterprise, to face the angry Vulcans. The article states that Robert Meyer Burnett, CEO of the Ludovico Technique and producer of the Star Trek: The Next Generation Blu-ray DVDs, felt like this would have been a more serious, "perilous" and above all epic story than the actual produced and released film – and it would have featured a Romulan commander along the lines of the thoughtful antagonist from the original Romulan story, "Balance of Terror".

    In an early draft of the script, the Klingon Bird-of-Prey was originally to be a stolen Romulan vessel (the red "feather design" of the wings' underside was designed with the original Romulan Bird-of-Prey in mind), but that detail was dropped from the final draft.

    A copy of Bennett's original storyline was leaked to fans in February 1983, forcing him to rewrite the script, changing many of the film's original details and events.
     
  3. Khan 2.0

    Khan 2.0 Commodore Commodore

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    wonder if serial killer Spock was partly influenced by all the 80s slasher movies lol (even Terminator the same year was a SF spin on the genre)
     
  4. Armus

    Armus Commodore Commodore

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    I don't know but it sounds cool!

     
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  5. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    This is one of my favourites. So much adventure and worldbuilding (and by worldbuilding, I mean the ship models were endlessly reused until ENT began in 2001:lol:)!
     
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  6. Cyfa

    Cyfa Captain Captain

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    The Search For Spock is my very favourite Trek film. The adventure and worldbuilding (as @King Daniel Beyond mentioned above), characterisation, humour, suspense (especially the edge-of-my-seat urging of the spacedoors to open during the "Stealing the Enterprise" scene - every time I watch it), the best Saavik (IMO), everyone gets something to do (well, perhaps not Chekov so much) - I could go on. There's just so much to enjoy and get caught up in. Happy 35th, ST III !

    EDIT: In fact, I'm going to watch it again now!
    EDIT2: Actually, it's Sulu who seems to get short shrift screenwise, not Chekov (Uhura probably gets the least amount of time, but what she does get is memorable, quotable, and awesome!).
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2019
  7. JonnyQuest037

    JonnyQuest037 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That's interesting. I'm surprised that treatment hasn't ended up online somewhere.
     
  8. Vger23

    Vger23 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    This is a woefully underrated Star Trek film. I love it...it was a perfect sequel to TWOK, and really the first time in franchise history where a more epic "arc" was incorporated into the storytelling.



    http://www.orionpressfanzines.com/articles/star_trek_iii.htm
     
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  9. Smellmet

    Smellmet Commodore Commodore

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    Solid, underrated Trek film. I have a few problems with it - the premise is a bit preposterous and some bits look really cheap and TV like but the rest is great. I've said it a million times on here but the stealing of the enterprise sequence is just fantastic and remains one of my favourite scenes in the whole franchise, reboots included, Kruge was great and the cast were on form too - this is the last film before they started being portrayed as old buffoons too.
     
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  10. Ar-Pharazon

    Ar-Pharazon Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    Prime Minister Sarek?
     
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  11. XCV330

    XCV330 A Being of Pure Caffeine Premium Member

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    We got to see more of the Federation in ST3 than anything previously. It's the world building star trek movie. Suddenly it's not all about Starfleet and ships.. Kirk has an apartment, and hobbies. People go to bars and play holographic video games. There are smugglers not named Mudd. We see how Vulcans learn, for the first time (I still can't take a test without hearing "CORRECT" now) Fleet regs, stealing a spaceship. Don't call Sulu tiny. Don't make ageist remarks at Uhura. Klingons are dangerous assholes that WILL kill you and not stand around blathering about honor for half a day. And don't disrespect the Enterprise to a chief engineer who once brawled with Klingons when they called her garbage.

    Remains one of my favorite Trek movies.
     
  12. Cyfa

    Cyfa Captain Captain

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    During yesterday's rewatch, I noticed something I'd not seen before: Near the beginning of the film, when the crew are in Kirk's apartment (before Sarek arrives), I noticed a lift/elevator travelling down the left side of the cylindrical building just outside the window. It's only a small thing, and not relevant in any way to the story, but it's still nice to see something new.
    During my previous rewatch, I noticed that this bronze Airiam-a-like guy is wearing the same costume as this handsome, bearded Federation Council member from ST IV.
     
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  13. Smellmet

    Smellmet Commodore Commodore

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    Isn't that The Voyage Home?
     
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  14. XCV330

    XCV330 A Being of Pure Caffeine Premium Member

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    Ah crap, you're right!
     
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  15. Qonundrum

    Qonundrum Commodore Commodore

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    It is a first rate entry!

    Yes, there are plot holes and nitpicks - like that's new to scripting. Some holes are big. But a good production keeps suspension of disbelief and is more than the sum of its parts, which includes all those holes.

    And there are many great scenes and things in TSFS:

    1. It's not trying to copy Trek II's plot as a template, or if there is one it's not screaming itself out to the audience as such
    2. Kirk conspires, all to save his dearest friend, even though the planet is solely for the science team where they might not want any more contamination than absolutely necessary - it's a reminder that Kirk has always been a maverick, doing what's best for people
    3. Steals the Enterprise (where Scotty works his miracles and keeps his reputation, as well as replacing some circuits though in real life it was not long since 1983 when we saw more and more specialized software take the place of specialized hardware chips - which makes fixing bigs a lot faster, allows for easier control rerouting, and so on...)
    4. He ensures he takes responsibility as Admiral
    5. World building for the Federation (as said above by XCV330 - new places, locals, crew doing different things and have a better reason to get back to the ship, quite a few reasons)
    6. Klingons hear of the Genesis torpedo and assume it's a weapon, all during peace negotiations! And Kruge isn't given enough detail to confirm he is acting for or against High Command, there are some nice twists
    7. First rate direction and flow overcome a lot of the flaws (which I'm trying to not get into, for once LOL...)
    8. ^^ and casting
    9. USS Grissom ship design
    10. BIG 80S HAIR that doesn't look bad (or dated, oddly!)
    11. The movie deflects from the obvious (yes, he lives) with enough meat and twists that it's impossible to shrug it off. The planet is unstable, Klingons think it's a device of war (without knowing all the nuances) and want to get it, the world building... there's plenty to keep this movie's plot going despite the obvious and it works. That's not easy to do. )
    12. Captain Stiles has style (and well-groomed fingernails!)
    13. Enterprise's destruction despite the teaser and trailer giving it away is still gripping and compelling, feeling germane and not by-the-numbers but back then nobody formulated the phrase 'warp core breach', even if the warp core would be the most unstable part of a ship, given what it does.
    14. Dan Fielding (John Larroquette) as a Klingon, what's not to like!
    15. The incidental music!!
    16. Deltans seem to make an on-screen return for the Excelsior (albeit sans dialogue)
    17. Even Chekov's LSD-influenced pilgrim-on-crack outfit isn't that bad since his change of clothes... happens to be in the same color scheme!
    18. In 1984 anyway I loved the partial recap to the previous movie. 1986's movie would use a similar recap as part of a theme. By the early 1990s and home video existed, it was pretty obvious why they re-recorded the footage and used it as a recap. And to this day, so many shows and movies still do the "last time on..." motif. ST III was not a mere trendsetter, it was more eloquent and deft in folding in the "last time on" routine but not in a heavyhanded way. If that ain't cool, nothing is.
    19. Saavik's appealing to emotion and ethics rather than logic actually wins (though it is in character for scientists like David to play with shiny new chemicals, it's what scientists have to do - so this is a continuation of the mantra, "like father like son" and that's the real point)
     
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  16. WarpFactorZ

    WarpFactorZ Commodore Commodore

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    TSFS was the first Trek movie I saw as a full-on Trekkie, so it holds a special place in my heart. In fact, it's my second favourite TOS movie, behind TUC. I loved the Excelsior from the moment it appeared on the screen, and like others thought the universe building was awesome. For the first time, we see real 23rd century city life, real apartment living, real human / Earth stuff.
     
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  17. Damian

    Damian Commodore Commodore

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    This was the very first Star Trek movie I recall seeing. I was not yet a Trekkie, I just happened to go with my grandmother. I was 11 at the time. It would be at least another 2 years before I became a Trekkie (when I first saw TMP on video).

    But I've of course watched it multiple times since then, more times then I can count.

    It's a bit of an underrated film, I'll agree. In some ways it's a bridge between TWOK and TVH, but an extremely important one. It resolved the open questions left after TWOK first of all. Bringing Spock back is just one of many plot points it has. It's a great character movie, and you see even the 'also starring' case of Scotty, Sulu, Chekov and Uhura make what would otherwise be career ending sacrifices to save their friend. We also get to see Sarek back, Mark Lenard makes a great movie presence here. We do see a bit of an unflattering side to Starfleet, more interested in galactic politics then in recognizing the awful loss experienced by the command crew of the Enterprise. You'd kind of think Starfleet would be more open minded, esp. with Sarek backing them up. Now maybe they wouldn't necessarily give Kirk everything he wanted. But you'd think with his history and that of the Enterprise, and Sarek's support that they'd at least investigate the possibilities. Hell, while I may not send the Enterprise I'd probably send Admiral Kirk as an envoy to meet up with the Grissom to help in determining what was going on. He is, after all, an Admiral. But then it would have been a totally different movie and we would have gotten to see the theft of the Enterprise in all its glory along with the sad destruction of the Enterprise.

    Other high points include Christopher Lloyd as Kruge. I still remember reading something stating Kruge was cruel even by Klingon standards. You do see just a bit of that honor code that would become much more prevalent in the Empire a century later. He's treacherous and cruel though.

    I'd rate it among the upper half of Star Trek films. There were a few points that dragged a bit for me. But in general I liked the film and watch it, usually as part of a trilogy re-watch with TWOK and TVH--or when doing a 6 film original series movie rewatch. Each of the 3 was a perfect continuation of the previous. TSFS completed TWOK while TVH was a much needed respite of the heavier TWOK and TSFS. TVH was a definite continuation of the narrative, but in such a way that allowed you to relax a bit and just enjoy.
     
  18. Kor

    Kor Admiral Admiral

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    Depending on which sector of the greeting card industry you ask, this is either TSFS's jade anniversary or coral anniversary. :techman:

    I enjoyed the use of the Klingons here. Unfortunately, this began a trend of overusing the Klingons. :shrug:

    Kor
     
  19. XCV330

    XCV330 A Being of Pure Caffeine Premium Member

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    Klingons in the movies

    TMP: First scene
    TWOK: not scene but part of simulation and discussion. ships were seen in simulation
    TSFS: antagonists
    TVH: diplomatic drama and stolen ship
    Tff Klaa, Korrd. Unprovoked attack on Pioneer 10. Blah
    TUC: can't shake a stick without hitting a klingon
    TUC to Nemesis: some kind of Worf will be on screen.
    2009: Deleted scene
    ID: badass bald klingons
    Beyond: totally Klingonless

    It seems only Abrams was able to avoid Klingons, and then 2 out of 3 times.
     
  20. Armus

    Armus Commodore Commodore

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    I just rewatched ST III: TSFS with the Ron Moore commentary. He is a big fan of the film, and he pointed out just how effective TSFS is as movie. When I was younger I didn't like it because it was so somber, then up until recently I dismissed it as uncreative and by the numbers. But I have enjoyed rewatching it twice in the last month. My favorite scene is the when the Enterprise approaches Genesis after the Grissom has been destroyed. That moment has an incredible amount of tension and the audience sees the situation between the three POVs- David and Saavik on the planet, Kruge on his ship, and Kirk and his crew on The Enterprise. It's very edge-of-your-seat.
     
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