TOS in the 29th century...

[Potemkin_Prod]

Clarke's Laws:

1) When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong.

2) The only way of discovering the limits of the possible is to venture a little way past them into the impossible.

3) Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

This is set 600 years in Star Trek's future. No need for turbolifts. There's no energy restrictions because the tech is 600 years further advanced.

 

[Tim Walker]

History suggests that a technological revolution takes some time. The earliest versions of a tech lack refinement, may be glitchy, and may be only marginally superior to what is to be replaced.

 

[Potemkin_Prod]

Are you suggesting that in the 29th century, we'll still be using elevators? Really?

 

[Albertese]

^^^
Well, we're still using stairs 10,000 years or so after they were invented. If elevators are still practical, why not keep using them far into the future?

--Alex

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Lots o' site-to-site beaming got nixed.

 

[Tim Walker]

I became aware of the concept of Programmable Matter when I read "Hacking Matter." Quantum dots may still be a couple technological revolution in the future. Wikipedia lists a number of concepts. A macroscopic version has appeared in the Transformers movies.

 

[Warped9]

From what I understand and what we've seen turbolifts are not like the elevators we're familiar with involving cables and only capable of up-and-down motion. I see no problem or reason not to use turbolifts as it is a much simpler solution than sit-to-site beaming.

I like to think using a transporter, while convenient in many circumstances, is still an involved process.

I also can't get away from the idea that if people were beaming dote-to-site practically at will I'd feel like I was watching something akin to Bewitched.

 

[Warped9]

Initially I didn’t imagine getting into this, but here goes. What you see might look a bit strange, but this is the inner hull, or inner hulls, of the saucer’s 10 decks. On average the decks vary from 8-9 ft. It might also look odd that the decks don’t appear to follow the exact contours of the exterior hull. Actually they do, but considering the angles of some of the exterior hull it’s pointless to have habitable space that extends into areas you can’t use in practical terms. You also notice what looks like blank spaces between decks that vary between an average of 2 ft. to one spot that’s even about 4 ft. Following Matt Jefferies idea that as much as possible that could need repair is kept accessible within the ship rather than on the outside hull I think this leaves enough plausible space for all the systems, mechanicals, guts and stuff that would be required for the ship to function. Most everything is accessible between hulls while also much of it would be cleanly unobtrusive as seen from within.

Of course there remain many things to be added such as certain facilities, the two main crew lounges, where the impulse section fits and the turbo lift shafts. Obviously I also have to continue downward with the dorsal and the secondary hull decks.

 

[Warped9]

Here's a number for curiosity's sake. Just for the hell of it I calculated the area or square footage of the saucer and dorsal decks. It's in excess of 980,000 sq. ft. I haven't yet calculated the deck area of the secondary hull. Strikes me as quite a bit of room.



Note how Decks 7 and 8 extend into the dorsal as complete decks without interruption. The lowermost dorsal deck will actually be merged with the first deck of the secondary hull.

 

[Ptrope]

Great stuff in this thread! I like these latest images of the decks, esp. the extensions of 7 & 8 into the dorsal - as interior sets, I'd really like to see how those would look at the junction, and hope that they won't be cut apart - shame to lose an interesting floorplan like that .

 

[Warped9]

Decks 7 and 8 are meant to be accessible straight through. I'm thinking that at least one if not both of those decks allow for the turbolift shafts to go back into the dorsal before descending to the secondary hull. And there should still be sufficient space on either side of the horizontal turbolift shafts for other things to placed in there.

Seeing as how I designed the dorsal to be proportionately much larger than on the TOS and TMP designs it resulted in quite a lot of spce on those decks--more than enough room for facilities besides glorified observation lounges. The second lowermost dorsal deck could be a reception facility since there is a TMP style docking port on both sides of the dorsal at that level.

 

[BK613]

thoughts about deck 1:
damage control locker
"sea cabin(s)" for the captain and/or officers
backup eqpt. like life support and shields

 

[BillJ]

Perhaps the bridge should detachable and able to serve as a lifeboat/escape pod?

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Perhaps the bridge should detachable and able to serve as a lifeboat/escape pod?

You mean like in Galaxy Quest?

 

[Warped9]

Perhaps the bridge should detachable and able to serve as a lifeboat/escape pod?

That sounds unnecessarily complicated when I already plan to have lifeboats on that level.

A simple reality of deep space travel distantly removed from any familiar territory, bases or other ships: if something catastrophic happens to the ship then unless you are right next door to a planet you're probably going to die. Unless you manage to escape by shuttlecraft (which have decent warp capability) lifeboats are simply short term affairs in the hopes you are either going to be picked up soon by other ships or you can land on a nearby planet.

Lifeboats, due to their size, a simple affairs with very limited propulsion ability. If you're near enough to a planet then the boat should get you planetside. And hopefully it's a habitable planet or it will be a short stay unless help shows up.

Also by "near enough" I mean well within a star system. anything more than that and it's unlikely you'll reach a planet. A possibility, of course, is if the lifeoat could support you in stasis or hibernation. That would increase your chances of making it planetside (if it's some distance) or being picked up by another ship.

 

[Warped9]

Wow. This definitely touches on ideas I was having and visualizes things I've read about. In particular it illustrates some of what I was talking about for the shuttlecraft design.

Follow the link, read, and watch the short video near the bottom of the link: http://www.visualnews.com/2014/08/13/windowless-jet-concept-gives-unparalleled-views-outside-world/

 

[aalenfae]

This sort of thing will only REALLY be cool once we have holographic displays that can simulate real windows (not a problem for Star Trek obviously, as it's been hinted as early as TNG).
I'm just not sure how soon we'll have that tech in the real world.

 

[Warped9]

So this is what you'd see if you peeled the exterior hull away as well as the structural members. You can see the spaces for the navigational deflector, the impulse drive and the forward and aft torpedo launchers. I've yet to add the bow navigational sensor array. The large deck in the secondary hull will be where Main Engineering is located.



Eventually I want to slip this (when finished) into the exterior hull model and then have a rather nice cross-section showing how everything fits together...assuming I didn't screw up somewhere.

I have an idea in mind that might be a bit tricky to fashion. I'm thinking of a pair of shafts that run up the nacelle support pylons from Main Engineering. One shaft will be the power conduit. The other would be an access tunnel from the secondary hull to a small chamber nestled just inside the nacelle. This chamber would allow direct access to the nacelle main systems and even the nacelle interior. Something similar suggesting that is also seen in Matt Jefferies' cross-section seen in The Making Of Star Trek.

Of course access up the support pylon and to the nacelle proper would be possible only under extreme conditions or when the nacelle is powered down.

 

[Warped9]

I became aware of the concept of Programmable Matter when I read "Hacking Matter." Quantum dots may still be a couple technological revolution in the future. Wikipedia lists a number of concepts. A macroscopic version has appeared in the Transformers movies.

I have a copy of this book, having picked it up some years ago. It was a fascinating read.

Wil McCarthy, the author, also writes novels that explore such ideas.

 

[Warped9]

I've just been reflecting on the fact I've never fleshed out a design to this extent before. Yes, my TOS shuttlecraft drawings were similar, but that was one small craft and nowhere near this complex. Doing it in 3D is a help. In 2D you work on one view at a time which might later conflict with something in another view, which definitely happens. In 3D you can consider all sides at the same time which can prevent later possible conflicts. It can still happen, but I find less frequently and it's often easier to spot and fix.

With what I'm learning here I can see myself applying it to later designs as well as perhaps some of my earlier designs. Indeed I might even go back and use this to revisit my TOS shuttlecraft design. Regarding that shuttlecraft I think I will wait until the Round2 model kit is released and then I will have the benefit of using a product of Gary Kerr's work as a credible reference point.


Now that I have the decks laid out I’m going back to detailing. I still have to place the housing (or space) for the navigational sensor array at the bow of the saucer. I’ve just put the twin turbo lift shafts extending down from Deck 1 to Deck 10 in the saucer. From that I’ll plan where they'll extend aft along Deck 7 or 8 and then down the dorsal into the secondary hull. There is plenty of room width wise in the dorsal for the turbo lift shafts to run the same distance from each other as they are on the Bridge and down through the saucer (with 6 ft. or so to spare on either side) or I can put the two shafts immediately side-by-side to go down the dorsal and into the secondary hull. I think this is a better solution because it makes it easier to utilize the deck space in the dorsal more effectively. I’m also glad I have the room because having twin shafts allows for more efficient freedom of movement for the crew. If there was only one turbo lift shaft through the dorsal it would be more restrictive in terms of moving crew about the ship.

Another thought about turbolifts: except for the Bridge or the bottom decks in the saucer and secondary hull every turbo lift port tucks in off the main shafts, be they horizontal or vertical. This allows the computer to shunt turbo lift cars past access where another car might already be present. It’s rather like pulling onto the shoulder to stop to keep the roadway clear.

Before I start adding additional rooms I want the turbolift shafts in place to give me a clearer idea of where to place other rooms more precisely. I also want to give some thought to where the main companionways could be in the saucer, the dorsal and the secondary hull.