I finally finished it. I found it just all right. The last sentence might have been the most important in the novel.
Spoilers TOS: Elusive Salvation by Dayton Ward Review Thread
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.... and keeps me brooding what happened from 1996 on regarding the formation of secret organizations on Earth, including their agendas and personnel.
I really liked the book overall, but am I the only one that kind of rolled their eyes at that last sentence?
I really don't see any reason why that was either necessary or interesting from a narrative or thematic perspective. We didn't need this group to also be Section 31, it doesn't really add anything to know "oh geez they started in the US government"?
And I don't see any way how it makes sense in-universe either. I mean, let's ignore the fact that they kept a reference to the name for 400 years even though espionage organizations with erstwhile government support still regularly change their names as things reorganize and there's no reason for name continuity with them. I can't even picture how that would have gone logistically when Starfleet was getting together. "Let's make sure that we get the line secretly justifying our existence in a numbered part of the Starfleet Charter that just happens to reference where our office used to be, because we can't just not leave clues, that wouldn't be fair." I mean, is Section 31 secretly run by the Riddler? Why would they want to keep the same reference for centuries? The name made much more sense for a secret organization when it was just an arbitrary reference to a document with no real meaning outside knowing that context. It was almost a book cipher, that was perfect for them.
And I don't see any way how it makes sense in-universe either. I mean, let's ignore the fact that they kept a reference to the name for 400 years even though espionage organizations with erstwhile government support still regularly change their names as things reorganize and there's no reason for name continuity with them. I can't even picture how that would have gone logistically when Starfleet was getting together. "Let's make sure that we get the line secretly justifying our existence in a numbered part of the Starfleet Charter that just happens to reference where our office used to be, because we can't just not leave clues, that wouldn't be fair." I mean, is Section 31 secretly run by the Riddler? Why would they want to keep the same reference for centuries? The name made much more sense for a secret organization when it was just an arbitrary reference to a document with no real meaning outside knowing that context. It was almost a book cipher, that was perfect for them.
Perhaps it was not needed.. Still from the late 20th century to the mid 22d century is enough time to get the Section 31 of Harris.
But espionage organizations don't work like that. The entire point of Section 31 is that it was sanctioned by the government. That it wasn't some secret society that was manipulating the government, but that it was allowed to exist by the Federation. Otherwise there would be no point for Article 14, Section 31 to exist, since it would operate whether or not the Charter allowed it. There wouldn't need to be this hidden vague line justifying its existence. It's not some shadow organization floating around in history bending the government to its will: it's a blot on the Federation because the Federation accepts it and looks the other way. It's a blot because it's part of the Federation, as much as the Tal Shiar is part of the Romulan Star Empire or the Obsidian Order is part of the Cardassian Empire.
This just turns it from the KGB or the Stasi into something more like the Illuminati.
This just turns it from the KGB or the Stasi into something more like the Illuminati.
I don't agree. I don't believe for a second that Article 14, section 31 was actually written with the intention of authorizing an organization like this; I think it was just a vaguely worded clause that some people chose to interpret as permission to found an organization whose entire purpose for existing was to break the law with Earth or Federation security as their excuse. Just because Section 31's members claim that their existence is justified, that doesn't mean we should believe them, because they obviously have a vested interest in that interpretation.
And no, it isn't sanctioned by the government, not in any legal or legitimate sense. Some government officials who learn of it may tolerate its existence in the belief that it serves a purpose, especially in desperate times like the Dominion War, but they're doing so extralegally.
No, espionage organizations don't work like that, but Section 31 is not an espionage organization. People keep forgetting that Starfleet Intelligence is the Federation's actual espionage organization. Section 31 is an extralegal cabal within Starfleet. It's a conspiracy, not an agency.
Here I'l agree, because there's no way that Section 31 could've remained hidden for centuries if it were constantly imposing its will. There was a recent scientific study that demonstrated mathematically how impossible it is for a large conspiracy to maintain its secrecy for a great length of time. The larger the conspiracy needs to be, the shorter the length of time that it can plausibly avoid being discovered. In order to last a century, a conspiracy could have no more than 125 participants. Imagine how tiny it would have to be in order to go undiscovered for three centuries.
So the only way Section 31 could work is if, most of the time, it keeps its head down and does nothing. If it only activates its operatives at times of extreme need, like after the Xindi crisis or during the Dominion War. I actually had Harris say that in Tower of Babel, I think it was -- that they needed to be the recourse of last resort when all else failed, rather than constantly meddling and risking exposure. And really, it's during such extreme times that the superiors in Starfleet and the Federation would be most inclined to tolerate their existence. It doesn't make sense to think of it as an unchanging constant throughout history, because nothing in government is that invariant.
Again, no. Those are both overtly known agencies that answer to the state. They're the equivalent of Starfleet Intelligence, or whatever civilian intelligence agency the UFP government operates.
Yes, exactly -- or SD-6 from Alias, except it's a conspiracy that operates inside the military.
Well, okay, that's fair, Christopher. You're right that I probably overspoke in terms of its position in the Federation. But it still felt to me that, even if Article 14, Section 31 wasn't intended to create it, it was still used as justification for it.
I'm specifically arguing about the final sentence of this book and what it implies, though. I'm not sure if you've grabbed this particular book yet; if not, I'll put the final sentence in a spoiler tag and you can check it if you'd like. It's not really related to the plot of the book at all, so in that sense it's not really a spoiler, but it is I guess a setting spoiler, or a foreshadowing-for-a-sequel spoiler?
I'm specifically arguing about the final sentence of this book and what it implies, though. I'm not sure if you've grabbed this particular book yet; if not, I'll put the final sentence in a spoiler tag and you can check it if you'd like. It's not really related to the plot of the book at all, so in that sense it's not really a spoiler, but it is I guess a setting spoiler, or a foreshadowing-for-a-sequel spoiler?
This sentence is in reference to a successor organization to Majestic 12 that was formed shortly before the events of "Future's End" in 1996. "Because if the people of Earth possessed a single line of defense, then that line began where Daniel Wheeler now stood: Pentagon Sublevel B14, Section 31."
Dayton Ward mentioned on Literary Treks that he's hoping to write a book off of that last sentence. I'm hoping he gets that chance!
Yes I heard that. I would want to see the era of the 21st Century covered, maybe ending the story right after First Contact.
Dayton,
Just wanted to drop a note here to let you know how much I enjoyed the book! You mentioned in an earlier post that the reason this exists was due to the overwhelming response to From History's Shadow (which I loved.)
I, too, would love to see at least one more sequel to this story involving Gary Seven, Roberta Lincoln, Kirk & Crew, Mestrel, and the beginnings of Section 31. These are some of my favorite Star Trek books currently being released - the only caveat to that is I don't see many more being written as it suggests our intrepid crew seems to have Ms. Lincoln and Mr. Seven ready to jump in at the sign of any major/threatening occurrences. Kinda takes the adventure out of it eh? Does that makes sense?
One question I had about the resolution:
Overall, a top notch Trek story. I enjoyed the many Easter Eggs, the face time with Nogura, and the new species (Iramahl/Ptaen) introduced. The third act was a bit derivative of contemporary thrillers, but served the plot just fine. I hope we'll get to see that 'revelation' in the final sentence blossom with another novel! LLAP!
Just wanted to drop a note here to let you know how much I enjoyed the book! You mentioned in an earlier post that the reason this exists was due to the overwhelming response to From History's Shadow (which I loved.)
I, too, would love to see at least one more sequel to this story involving Gary Seven, Roberta Lincoln, Kirk & Crew, Mestrel, and the beginnings of Section 31. These are some of my favorite Star Trek books currently being released - the only caveat to that is I don't see many more being written as it suggests our intrepid crew seems to have Ms. Lincoln and Mr. Seven ready to jump in at the sign of any major/threatening occurrences. Kinda takes the adventure out of it eh? Does that makes sense?
One question I had about the resolution:
One thing I may have glossed over while reading it, was the result of bringing the Iramahl forward to Kirk's time in order to get the cure for their genetic disorders. Assuming they lived out their lives on Earth of the past, then died seemingly in a secret, quiet corner of the globe - wouldn't it be just as dangerous to bring them forward in time, thereby removing them from the past and any influence (albeit small) they may have had? Was is deemed worth the risk in this case in order to save the population of a potential ally in Kirk's time? Forgive me if this was covered or assumed by the text. Just curious. I guess one could argue "this is how it was always going to happen" - paradoxes, etc
Overall, a top notch Trek story. I enjoyed the many Easter Eggs, the face time with Nogura, and the new species (Iramahl/Ptaen) introduced. The third act was a bit derivative of contemporary thrillers, but served the plot just fine. I hope we'll get to see that 'revelation' in the final sentence blossom with another novel! LLAP!
The comments to George went beyond negative, some of the posts were downright distasteful.
I know he did, but I thought Dayton something similar happened with Dayton too, after a bunch of bad reactions to his Seekers books and the last The Fall book.
The last two words of the book totally blew my mind.
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