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Spoilers TOS: Agents of Influence by Dayton Ward Review Thread

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I wonder about that though. Was Janeway really violating the PD or was that just Kashyk's interpretation of it for his own benefits? Part of the issue may be that Captain Janeway was at a distinct disadvantage since they were just one ship against a fleet basically. She may have been 'playing' along because of that disadvantage.

If so, it was for the reason you and I said (that she wasn't actually changing the culture, just helping people get away from it), certainly not because they were warp-capable.



Hmm, that's interesting. Is it a PD violation to interfere with a more superior society. That would make for an interesting debate. Can you violate the PD with a society that's higher on the evolutionary ladder? Something to think about.

Yes, hell, yes, that's the whole point. There IS no "evolutionary ladder." Evolution isn't upward, it's outward, ever branching and diversifying along so many different paths that it's meaningless to attempt to rank them one-dimensionally. There is no "higher" or "lower" level for a species or a civilization, just different adaptations to different needs and environments. The entire point of the Directive is to counteract the temptation to assume that our society is superior in some way to another society just because it's different from us, to remind us that all peoples are equal regardless of technology and have an equal right to make their own independent choices. The entire point is to remove any notion of superiority or inferiority from the question altogether, because that's a corrupt, toxic way of looking at the relationship between civilizations. (Which is why TNG: "Homeward" is so hideously wrong in the way it warps the PD into "Oh, the poor widdle primitives are too stupid to understand so we superior beings have the right to condemn them all to death.")
 
The benefit of the Prime Directive is that a warp capable society isn't necessarily more "mature" but it is when said species ceases to be their own problem and becomes everyone's problem.
 
The benefit of the Prime Directive is that a warp capable society isn't necessarily more "mature" but it is when said species ceases to be their own problem and becomes everyone's problem.
Not exactly the way I'd put it (I'd lean more towards ". . . when said species can no longer avoid knowing about other sentient life.") Which can of course happen without the species becoming warp-capable.
 
Not exactly the way I'd put it (I'd lean more towards ". . . when said species can no longer avoid knowing about other sentient life.") Which can of course happen without the species becoming warp-capable.

I admit to a fan of the pragmatic interpretations of the Federation's many rules as well as the idealistic. Probably why I love DS9 the most.

:)
 
"Wink of an Eye" is one that quickly comes to mind as well.
I'd completely forgotten about Deela. Or actually, I'd somehow conflated Deela with Odona. It was, of course, with Deela in WE, that we saw Kirk pulling on his boots while she brushed her hair. Rather risky, having sex under those circumstances, although it does give new meaning to the word, "quickie."

Then again, like most of the third season of TOS, WE suffers from a really weak concept. "Accelerating" living beings to a point where they become invisible, and can dodge phasers? With something ingested? And the transporter somehow works, at a rate that appears normal from the "accelerated frame of reference"?
 
Just completed this book. I almost rated it "above average" but on further thought I couldn't think of anything I would change. Usually I consider a book above average when it has a good, riveting story and I care what happens, but perhaps it lacks one or two things, or something that pulls me out. This book had none of that. I found no faults with it. So I went ahead and gave it an 'excellent'.

Good story, check. Good characters, check. Good plot development, check. I also liked that it was linked to the Vanguard/Seekers stories, basically a sequel to that plot line. It gave us some insights into the Klingon High Council and Kesh in the mid 23rd century, it included some references to the war in Discovery, and it was a thriller to boot.

Also Dayton Ward tidied things up in an orderly fashion. I'm not a big fan of getting toward the end of the book, then suddenly everything is fixed. For instance, in "The Unsettling Stars" everything just was abruptly fixed, almost like Foster realized he was running out of pages and had to conclude the story. And I've seen it happen in a number of novels.

But in "Agents of Influence" each problem is taken care of in an orderly fashion. For instance, the problems with the Orions were actually settled pretty early on, the latter half of the book of course, but maybe 2/3 of the way in. Then the issue with the Klingon disruption field a little further on. Then the rescue of the Endeavor to conclude the story (there were other elements as well). He didn't rush anything to conclusion, and that was a strong point for me.

While it's probably unlikely we'll see any further "Seekers" novels, it was nice to give that series a bit of a coda.
 
If so, it was for the reason you and I said (that she wasn't actually changing the culture, just helping people get away from it), certainly not because they were warp-capable.





Yes, hell, yes, that's the whole point. There IS no "evolutionary ladder." Evolution isn't upward, it's outward, ever branching and diversifying along so many different paths that it's meaningless to attempt to rank them one-dimensionally. There is no "higher" or "lower" level for a species or a civilization, just different adaptations to different needs and environments. The entire point of the Directive is to counteract the temptation to assume that our society is superior in some way to another society just because it's different from us, to remind us that all peoples are equal regardless of technology and have an equal right to make their own independent choices. The entire point is to remove any notion of superiority or inferiority from the question altogether, because that's a corrupt, toxic way of looking at the relationship between civilizations. (Which is why TNG: "Homeward" is so hideously wrong in the way it warps the PD into "Oh, the poor widdle primitives are too stupid to understand so we superior beings have the right to condemn them all to death.")

There ARE higher species! Spock himself pointed this out in my beloved TOS when he surmised that Organians are to humans, on the evolutionary scale, as humans are to microbes. (Rough paraphrase.)
 
There ARE higher species! Spock himself pointed this out in my beloved TOS when he surmised that Organians are to humans, on the evolutionary scale, as humans are to microbes. (Rough paraphrase.)

Yeah, and if you pit microbes against humans, the microbes often win. People who believe in nonsense like evolutionary "scales" and "ladders" forget that humbling reality at their peril.
 
(Copy of review I just posted on my personal Facebook timeline.) Just finished reading Agents of Influence, a Star Trek novel by Dayton Ward that just came out earlier this year (2020). (And I do discuss the plot some, so moderate Spoiler Warnings.)

For those only vaguely familiar with Star Trek (the original 1960s television series), Captain Kirk, first officer/science officer Spock, Doctor McCoy, and the other Starfleet officers aboard the USS Enterprise were serving out a “five year mission to explore strange new worlds, seek out new life and new civilizations, to boldly go where no man has gone before”. The tv series was cancelled after only three seasons (although they did come back a few years later to do a couple additional seasons of stories in “Star Trek: The Animated Series” which can be considered to represent some of “years four and five” of the mission.

There have also been loads of Star Trek tie-in novels (as well as comic books) set explicitly during that original five year mission time frame. Agents of Influence is another of those. However, of some small interest, Agents of Influence has been counted by at least one longtime fan to be the one hundredth original Star Trek tie-in novel published to take place during the five year mission time frame of the original tv series. (I will take his word for that. And there have been lots of novels released over the past few decades starring Kirk, Spock, and company that take place after the original five year mission, all the way up to and beyond the movies, as well as some that take place prior to the five year mission.)

All of that said, what did I think of Agents of Influence? It was all right. A bit slow at times. Dayton Ward begins the story on three undercover Federation agents that have been living in secret as spies on the Klingon home world surgically as altered to appear as Klingons. They are extricated and picked up by the USS Endeavour (a ship and crew featured in another couple sub-series of Star Trek tie-in novels, the Star Trek: Vanguard and Star Trek: Seekers series, both of which Ward contributed to). The Endeavour becomes heavily damaged in an encounter in an asteroid field with the Klingons and the Enterprise is routed to assist them. Over the course of the novel, the focus constantly shifts not only between the Enterprise and Endeavour captains and other notable crew members like Spock (left in command of the Enterprise while Kirk is away from the ship) but also 1) the reactions back on the Klingon home world to the discovery of the escaped spies and what vital secrets they may have taken with them, 2) another group of Klingons operating in secret within the asteroid field developing an new energy draining weapon to be used against enemy vessels, and 3) a group of Orions “space pirates” that are in league with the Klingons in the asteroid field.

The jumping around keeps the story from building up as a lot of the non Enterprise and non Endeavour scenes seem expository and not as interesting (and they also were a bit repetitive at times, reflecting someone else’s reactions to events that had just transpired in the previous scene). I felt at times like this should have been a book entirely focused on Captain Katami and the Endeavour working to hold off the Klingons until assistance from the Enterprise can reach them rather than having it jump so much from one set of characters to another.

I liked the inclusion of Admiral Nogura, a character mentioned briefly in Star Trek: The Motion Picture (1979) as the one who gave command of the then completely refit Enterprise back to Kirk to confront the threat of V’ger and used in many of the Star Trek tie-in novels. As in the Vanguard and Seekers novels, here again Nogura is head over covert and highly sensitive Starfleet Intelligence actions. In this case, he accompanies the Enterprise in its mission to find and assist the Endeavour and to recover the three Federation spies (although once the bulk of the novel’s setting shifts to the crippled Endeavour, Nogura’s role and “screen time” is greatly diminished from that point forward as he remains with Spock aboard the Enterprise).

One thing that bugged me a bit as someone who has not yet read the Star Trek: Vanguard or Star Trek: Seekers novels is the “spoiler” (mentioned not once but at least three times, I think) of the fate of an important member of the USS Endeavour’s crew in those previous novels who did in one of them, leading to one of the other characters serving in their present position in Agents of Influence. From a standpoint of character background information, it makes sense that this character might reflect back on how he or she got to this point. However, again, as someone who plans to eventually read the Vanguard and Seekers novels I can’t help but think to myself that when I eventually do that I will then remember, “Oh, here’s that character who is going to die at some point”.

That’s only a minor quibble, though. Again, I found the pacing of this one to be a more uneven and that a lot of time went to peripheral characters that turned out not to be very important, story time that could have been focused on further developing the lead characters aboard the Endeavour (or on Kirk and the Enterprise regulars, although much of the time they seem only there to reflect upon the events transpiring around them, Kirk and his team assisting the Endeavour and Spock, McCoy, and Nogura back aboard the Enterprise).

I enjoyed Agents of Influence well enough, though not as much as I have some of Ward’s others (From History’s Shadow, Drastic Measures). I found it to be a pretty average quality Star Trek novel. I give it three stars on GoodReads.
 
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One thing that bugged me a bit as someone who has not yet read the Star Trek: Vanguard or Star Trek: Seekers novels is the “spoiler” (mentioned not once but at least three times, I think) of the fate of an important member of the USS Endeavour’s crew in those previous novels who did in one of them, leading to one of the other characters serving in their present position in Agents of Influence. From a standpoint of character background information, it makes sense that this character might reflect back on how he or she got to this point. However, again, as someone who plans to eventually read the Vanguard and Seekers novels I can’t help but think to myself that when I eventually do that I will then remember, “Oh, here’s that character who is going to die at some point”.

That’s only a minor quibble, though

Although I respect your right to this opinion, I don't fully understand why you are annoyed by a writers decision to use their own long established continuity.

The events you refer to were first published 14 years ago, the information has been about for some time.
 
Although I respect your right to this opinion, I don't fully understand why you are annoyed by a writers decision to use their own long established continuity.

The events you refer to were first published 14 years ago, the information has been about for some time.
I know. It’s just that I didn’t really see the need for that character’s death to have been referred to like two or three different times in this one.

Plus, I’d asked Dayton on Facebook prior to reading it if Agents made reference to stuff that has happened in other novels and he said, “It's a largely standalone story, though if you've read the Vanguard and Seekers novels you'll appreciate the use of the Endeavour crew a bit more. :)” He either forgot about the references to the death I’m referring to or like you also felt that enough time had passed to not even think about issuing a spoiler warning.

I did say it was a minor quibble of mine. It alone didn’t really effect my overall enjoyment of the book. I just wouldn’t have read it out of sequence in hindsight.

Honestly, I hadn’t actually planned on reading it yet but when my public library purchased a copy for their collection based on my requesting/recommending they do so, it somehow put me on placing a hold for it once it came in. When I got the notice, I figured, what they heck, I’ll go ahead and read it now (since Dayton said it was a pretty much stand alone story).
 
As a general rule, if I'm trying to avoid spoilers, I don't read or watch anything involving the futures of characters who's fates I don't want spoiled. Even if the story isn't directly connected to the events of earlier stories, there's always a chance there may be a passing reference like the one you ran into.
 
They aren't just about her, but Khatami and the Endeavor crew are the focus of the 2nd and 4th Seekers books. The series was split, with the 1st and 3rd featuring the Sagittarius, and the 2nd and 4th featuring the Endeavor.
The Endeavor is named for DCI Morse. :whistle:
 
I enjoyed the book. Lots of interesting spy action but it did feel a bit minor in the grand scheme of things. I wish we'd gotten more into the mindsets of the spies involved.
 
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