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Torchwood: Children of Earth DAY FIVE FINALE grading thread

Day Five: Nut Brown Ale or Squid Vomit?


  • Total voters
    107
Personally I feel a little letdown. It's like Starbuck's "death". Her character arc wasn't finished, so you knew it wasn't over, and she'd be back. And whaddaya know? She came back.

Captain Jack is the same. His arc isn't over. He's in pain from Stephen, Ianto, Tosh, Owen, Suzie and all the others dying. But he'll be back. And with the ratings this year, Torchwood will be back too. I'm sure they'll get all the funding they need now, after, you know, saving the planet!

I'm sure if the ratings had been abysmal, it'd've been an easy way out. But they weren't, so they can continue. But yes, they can retool it/revamp it/re-imagine it now.
 
Just finished it.

Holy crap that was good...and sad. It better be back...altho I miss Owen and Ianto.

There is always Gwen and Jack...fucking brilliant.
 
I really have nothing to say that hasn't already been said, so I'll just say I voted excellent and that I've loved every damn second of this series.

Such a turnaround for a show that gave us "Cyberwoman"!

I really don't understand those who are moaning about The Doctor not showing up to save the day (especially when "deus ex machina" is one of the most common (usually misapplied) criticisms of RTD's work).

They have alluded countless times to the fact that The Doctor isn't always around to save the Earth. That was Harriet Jones's point way back in series 2. And she was right to make it. The Doctor is one man who could be anywhere in the universe and anywhere in time. He's not an omnipotent, omniscient protector, and he's not perfect - the parent show has been drumming this into us since 2005, for fuck sake.
 
After all that, isn't the Rift still open in Cardiff? So who will stop all the weevils etc etc from coming through and running riot in Cardiff?
 
I was also angry at Frobisher for taking the coward's way out of a solvable situation (like that other berk in The Mist).

And considering the critical and ratings success of "Children of Earth", the BBC and NuWho production team cannot just pull the plug on Torchwood. This was the best NuWho related story since "Midnight".

Why? They threatened to take his kids by force to send them to a fate worse than death, they threatened to arrest him so he could do nothing, and the only action he could take was to tell the world and then his kids would still be taken. Better they be dead than face that. I could totally understand his way of thinking.

And of course they can end it there. This is British TV, not American. If the creator/production people don't want to continue it they won't. I'm sure since it's a BBC production and spin off to Doctor Who they own the rights, but RTD created it, and he's off to America, if he doesn't want to continue work on it I doubt it'll happen.
 
I was also angry at Frobisher for taking the coward's way out of a solvable situation (like that other berk in The Mist).

And considering the critical and ratings success of "Children of Earth", the BBC and NuWho production team cannot just pull the plug on Torchwood. This was the best NuWho related story since "Midnight".

Why? They threatened to take his kids by force to send them to a fate worse than death, they threatened to arrest him so he could do nothing, and the only action he could take was to tell the world and then his kids would still be taken. Better they be dead than face that. I could totally understand his way of thinking.

And of course they can end it there. This is British TV, not American. If the creator/production people don't want to continue it they won't. I'm sure since it's a BBC production and spin off to Doctor Who they own the rights, but RTD created it, and he's off to America, if he doesn't want to continue work on it I doubt it'll happen.

I agree...he could have taken the super heroic way out of sacrificing his kids to save millions more--but that was Jack's course to take. They could have run I suppose, but I imagine the bodyguards there to protect his family from Jack would have stopped that. Frobisher was probably the best character in this, and as good as most of the performances were (and Barrowman surprised me) Capaldi sure as hell better win some kind of award. It's funny, obviously people have become so used to heroic/unrealistic telly that they can't comprehend something grounded in reality. Frobisher was a good man trapped within something bigger. If people think there weren't good people working in the concentration camps, that all the Nazis were evil because that makes it easier, then they're mistaken. The thing I liked most of all about this series is that it's shown us what we probably would do, as a species, in this situation. I don't have kids, but in all honesty how many parents would sacrifice their own children to save someone elses?
 
TBH I dont see why Torchwood should come back, could it get any better than this? anything that follows this will be a let down?

in a way it feels like RTDs wrote a story about how a government would react to an alien invasion, and then remembered to include Torchwood, so he could sell it to the BBC, as Torchwood S3.

Good point, and probably what made this so great.

What I hope is that we get something similar in future if this has done well (and it seems to have) mature adult science fiction, and if we do we have Torchwood to thank for that...who would have thought that a few years ago :wtf:
 
I LOVED these episodes, and until I decided to sit down and watch it, I wasn't very keen on Torchwood. I felt really sad when Ianto died because I was actually starting to like him as a character (didn't think much of him in the Doctor Who series finales). But I honestly thought these episodes would bring more people in to the Torchwood team, but instead it's been effectively shut down. Gwen is pregnant, Ianto is dead, and Jack has gone.

I've seen people a bit annoyed that The Doctor wasn't featured in these episodes, and I sort of have to agree. I see The Doctor as a "last resort" defence, when the Earth is in so much trouble, and the suffering of the Human race is so great, he has to get involved. In the last two episodes I felt that this was the case. Earth sacrificing 10% of it's children and there are two people on Earth that can just call The Doctor and ask him to come back to Earth to lend a hand. He certanly wouldn't have sacrificed Jack's grandson. (I was sort of hoping we would get a cameo from him at the end of the episode, which would explain why Jack is in the final episodes).

But other than that, I really enjoyed it, I would watch a series four if they commission it.
 
I'm gutted because it looks like there won't be any more Torchwood now.:(
Unless now's the time to bring in the Torchwood Two spin-off set in Glasgow...

There was a guy in this little cult of fans I have who caught me on a train and babbled non stop about how I should use my 'BBC contacts' to make that happen. Apparently I'd be brilliat as a Scottish Jack :confused:

Frobisher's fate disappointed me - he could have had some redemption, but crapped out like the little shit he ultimately was.

Dekker wasn't as mysterious after all. I laughed like a loon when wotsername kneecapped him to stop him yapping. Best thing she did in the whole series.

So Jack sacrificed his own grandson, eh? Not that there was much choice, but it's impressive that the production team went that far in prime-time, rather than write the story to have some more palatable choices.

Forbishers fate... I liked that. Not the most honorable thing to do, but the fact he'd rather kill his family than let his boss turn him against them.

The Dekker moment... I was hoping to get something creepy from him, I mentioned in the day 4 thread that the breathing against the glass reminded me of Brad Dourif in Alien Ressurection and when I saw he survived I expeced something more from him than being a weasly twat, but... that gushot amused me. And made my girlfriend laugh manically. Good stuff.

The killing of the grandson. Wonderful decison to make. I was trying to explain to my GF the similarities and differences beteen Jack and the Doctor, that Jack would go to places the Doctor wouldn't. I think that made my point.
 
Everyone likes to rave on about nuBSG and its so-called 'realism' and its 'dark, gritty, depressing' nature. This shat all over BSG.

Magnificent. That show is what I pay a license fee for. Well done, RTD, well done BBC Wales.

10/10
 
Everyone likes to rave on about nuBSG and its so-called 'realism' and its 'dark, gritty, depressing' nature. This shat all over BSG.

Magnificent. That show is what I pay a license fee for. Well done, RTD, well done BBC Wales.

10/10

Couldn't have put it better myself. Last night was phenomenal, and this whole series has been the best thing I've seen on TV in years. I am absolutely blown away. Bravo to everyone involved.

Entirely by the way, the PC in charge of the Custody suite where Lois and Jack are held - anyone have any clue who played him? He's not in the credits and he is either a real life Sgt. I know or his frickin body double!
 
I'm gutted because it looks like there won't be any more Torchwood now.:(
Unless now's the time to bring in the Torchwood Two spin-off set in Glasgow...


I'll have to go and double check, but I think that one of the Torchwood files that Lois reads says that Torchwood Two no longer exists,

Mind you, it also says that there maybe more TW assets out there that the government doesn't know about.

Incidentally, there's been some speculation that the weird Scottish guy running TW2 could have been the seventh Doctor (how he could be part of an organisation that he doesn't hear about for a few lifetimes is another matter).
 
I still don't get why people are nitpicking the fact that the Doctor didn't turn up. To those on that side of the fence, do you not think that happening would have completely cheapened (and ruined) this story?! Not to mention, again, the fact that it would have been a stupid Deus Ex Machina.

That happening would have put me in mind of "These Are The Voyages", and how the final episode of Enterprise - which should have celebrated Enterprise - became a retconned sub-plot to an old TNG episode. Something which not only cheapened IT, but the TNG episode it was linked to.

If, god forbid, Tennant had popped up and sent the aliens packing, right out of the blue, you'd all be complaining.
 
What he said.

If RTD did have a moment where he wanted the Doctor to show up, the only way it could possibly go down would have the Doctor to show up after it all happened and for Jack to turn his back on him for not showing up when he was needed.

But it would still be a shite crossover. He doesn't belong in Torchwood for so many multiple reasons.
 
Between this and Psychoville I'm ready to say I got this years worth of Licence fee already, anything else is a bonus.

As to what were Sarah Jane and the Doctor doing, doubtless the Doctor was too busy dying and regenerating somewhere, and Sarah Jane was busying herself trying to make sure her son, and his friends, his school, etc. were ok. Why does there need to be an explanation. The Doctor can be any where and any when in the entire history of the entire universe getting in to his own trouble, no explanation needed.
 
I agree...he could have taken the super heroic way out of sacrificing his kids to save millions more--but that was Jack's course to take. They could have run I suppose, but I imagine the bodyguards there to protect his family from Jack would have stopped that. Frobisher was probably the best character in this, and as good as most of the performances were (and Barrowman surprised me) Capaldi sure as hell better win some kind of award. It's funny, obviously people have become so used to heroic/unrealistic telly that they can't comprehend something grounded in reality. Frobisher was a good man trapped within something bigger. If people think there weren't good people working in the concentration camps, that all the Nazis were evil because that makes it easier, then they're mistaken. The thing I liked most of all about this series is that it's shown us what we probably would do, as a species, in this situation. I don't have kids, but in all honesty how many parents would sacrifice their own children to save someone elses?

I tell you now, as someone who does have two kids, that there would be no way in hell i'd sacrifice them to save anyone. The entire human race could be threatened and i would still not do it.

I LOVED these episodes, and until I decided to sit down and watch it, I wasn't very keen on Torchwood. I felt really sad when Ianto died because I was actually starting to like him as a character (didn't think much of him in the Doctor Who series finales). But I honestly thought these episodes would bring more people in to the Torchwood team, but instead it's been effectively shut down. Gwen is pregnant, Ianto is dead, and Jack has gone.

I've seen people a bit annoyed that The Doctor wasn't featured in these episodes, and I sort of have to agree. I see The Doctor as a "last resort" defence, when the Earth is in so much trouble, and the suffering of the Human race is so great, he has to get involved. In the last two episodes I felt that this was the case. Earth sacrificing 10% of it's children and there are two people on Earth that can just call The Doctor and ask him to come back to Earth to lend a hand. He certanly wouldn't have sacrificed Jack's grandson. (I was sort of hoping we would get a cameo from him at the end of the episode, which would explain why Jack is in the final episodes).

But other than that, I really enjoyed it, I would watch a series four if they commission it.

I've held off on posting anything because i'm conflicted on how i feel about the final episode. On the one hand, its quite possibly some of the best television i have ever watched, never mind sci-fi. RTD et al finally showed the guts that they have said they had since the start of Torchwood, and finally proved it was a more adult show. THIS is what we have wanted from the beginning, THIS is adult drama, with nary a lesbian alien or cyberwoman in sight. Torchwood should continue.

But plot wise, i'm saddened by how it ended. I dont know about anyone else but i spent the entire episode actually hoping The Doctor would turn up and save the world again, save Jack from making the decision he did. It says alot about how gripping the story was and how much emotion it stirred up that people were hoping for the Deus Ex Machina ending just to save the characters we love from anymore heartbreak. But The Doctor was absent, and Jack made his choice.

I cant see how Torchwood can go on, at least with Jack in charge. Remember his speech back in Series 3 of Doctor Who, how he had rebuilt Torchwood in the Doctors name. Jack crossed the line, he did something the Doctor would never have done. It made him much less of a hero to me, but far, far more human. He's certainly lost any moral high ground he had over everyone else.

Overall this was the best Torchwood so far, and one of the best drama's ever made. If anyone slags off Torchwood again, i will certainly be shoving this serial in their faces. If this is the end of Torchwood, then by god we went out on a high point, albeit an incredibly depressing one.
 
^

Exactly. He's busy. Is that so hard to accept?
If you get in to "Where was he?" you then have to ask where was he for the Trickster's attacks? where was he for the asteroid? Where was he for the Bane? Where was he for the Slitheen attack? Where was he for Abadon? etc. etc.
 
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