Timelinegeddon - Grand Universe Unification Theories

[dahj]

We all know that the real truth is that the Prime Star Trek Universe is balanced on the backs of 4 elephant-shaped universes(TMP, TNG, ENT, DSC), which are standing atop a giant turtle-shaped universe(TOS).

This is the REAL Objective TRUTH and anyone who says otherwise is a ninny.

Since there's about 50 threads on how and why this universe is different from that universe, or how this doesn't fit into that timeline, I figured it might be fun to have one thread where we can collect all the theories that unify this supposedly fractured universe.

So, Prime Universe is a homogeneous mass consisting of TOS, TAS, ST I-VI, TNG, ST Gen-Nem, DS9, VOY, ENT and DSC. What are the most common complaints against this, and why are they wrong? What are the more obscure ones, and how are they fun?

(For professionals only: Could we even unify the Kelvinverse with the rest of it? )

 

[Wulfsa]

Or its just a lack of imagination if something don´t fit for someone.

The only thing that bothers me right now ... thousands of bald klingons GRAAAAAAAAHHHH

 

[Jinn]

(For professionals only: Could we even unify the Kelvinverse with the rest of it? )

I'll just start here...

The Enterprise was seen in "The Cage" in 2254, then appeared under construction in 2255 in the ST09, which clearly means that it got seriously damaged while defending the Earth and crashed down in Iowa. For its valiant efforts against the evil doers it was reconstructed by Starfleet on the spot (hence why it is build on the ground and not more logically in SPAAAAAAACE). Then the Klingon War erupts and the Enterprise gets send into space where it defends the sector where Vulcan and Earth are in. The Discovery Season 2 stuff happens. Then since it was never on an actual maiden voyage Starfleet sends the ship, crewed with cadets on one. Then ST09 happens, Kirk becomes Captain, STID and STB happen and we're in 2263. The Enterprise gets destroyed by the bad guys but fortunately a time traveling British chap who just defended the Federation of the 24th century against a combined force of Borg and some other similar group that may or may not start with "Cyber" and end with "men" appears on the ship and uses his regeneration energy on the big E, healing the ship and bringing it back to it's 1960s glory. With his dying breath the Doctor sends the Enterprise on a course to the Federation. He then dies on the Captain's Chair and the Enterprise (and his corpse) will arrive in some years, after the construction of the Enterprise-A is already finished, shortly before TOS. Kirk and company are all happy to see the Enterprise back, even with a fresh and new design so they ask to be instead transferred to the regenerated Enterprise and start TOS.

You never said it had to be in-continuity with Doctor Who

 

[Lord Garth]

We all know that the real truth is that the Prime Star Trek Universe is balanced on the backs of 4 elephant-shaped universes(TMP, TNG, ENT, DSC), which are standing atop a giant turtle-shaped universe(TOS).

This is the REAL Objective TRUTH and anyone who says otherwise is a ninny.

Since there's about 50 threads on how and why this universe is different from that universe, or how this doesn't fit into that timeline, I figured it might be fun to have one thread where we can collect all the theories that unify this supposedly fractured universe.

So, Prime Universe is a homogeneous mass consisting of TOS, TAS, ST I-VI, TNG, ST Gen-Nem, DS9, VOY, ENT and DSC. What are the most common complaints against this, and why are they wrong? What are the more obscure ones, and how are they fun?

This. If it's not causing crazy speculative headaches -- like would Worf have hair in Disco's 24th Century? -- and wild theories, it's not doing its job.

 

[BillJ]

I'm someone who thinks it hurts Discovery trying to tie it to the rest of the franchise as part of the Prime timeline. So many great things you can do and explore if they were unshackled from those chains.

But that's me.

 

[Wulfsa]

There are so many possibilities .... what if the Discovery has another "sporeblem" and erases itself from the timeline .... "Michael Burnham mhhh never heard of" (Spockvoice). They can do whatever they want and in the end it never happend.

 

[Kibbin]

Simple, as I understand in Trek they work on the assumption that time travel over writes the previous universe. Thus everything happened up until First Contact when the time line was reset to Ent with Disco to follow. The reason why we have post First Contact era stuff is that due to laws of drama time travel takes time to take effect as people slowly fade out etc etc. The point of time change is far in the past so its going to take time to reach the voyager era.

 

[dahj]

Simple, as I understand in Trek they work on the assumption that time travel over writes the previous universe.

I don't think there's anything simple about how time travel works on Trek... it always seems to work slightly differently.

As Spock would say "The needs of the plot outweigh the rules of the timetraveling."

 

[Tuskin38]

Simple, as I understand in Trek they work on the assumption that time travel over writes the previous universe. Thus everything happened up until First Contact when the time line was reset to Ent with Disco to follow. The reason why we have post First Contact era stuff is that due to laws of drama time travel takes time to take effect as people slowly fade out etc etc. The point of time change is far in the past so its going to take time to reach the voyager era.

Star Trek time travel isn’t consistent.

 

[dahj]

The Enterprise was seen in "The Cage" in 2254, then appeared under construction in 2255 in the ST09, which clearly means that it got seriously damaged while defending the Earth and crashed down in Iowa. For its valiant efforts against the evil doers it was reconstructed by Starfleet on the spot (hence why it is build on the ground and not more logically in SPAAAAAAACE).

 

[Kibbin]

I don't think there's anything simple about how time travel works on Trek... it always seems to work slightly differently.

As Spock would say "The needs of the plot outweigh the rules of the timetraveling."

Star Trek time travel isn’t consistent.

Only exception I can think of is when you have a predetination paradox. So either this is part of the universe or will be when it overwrites it. Either way the universe is the universe

 

[TrickyDickie]

My theory is that at some point in the future TPTB will reverse their stand on Axanar and everything else that is fan-made and fully embrace it all....and make it all canon.

Not to be generous, but just the opposite....to get everyone so hopelessly confused that they collapse and shut up once and for all.

 

[dahj]

My theory is that at some point in the future TPTB will reverse their stand on Axanar and everything else that is fan-made and fully embrace it all....and make it all canon.

Also, bookverse.

As a sidenote, it's funny how the books were never considered canon and they often take way more effort to be consistent with "the canon" than the episodes themselves do.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Simple, as I understand in Trek they work on the assumption that time travel over writes the previous universe.

That's not how it worked in ST09. Nero's interference caused the Kelvin timeline to branch off in 2233, but the original wasn't erased. Both exist alongside each other.

Thus everything happened up until First Contact when the time line was reset to Ent with Disco to follow.

Also not true. Whatever your feelings regarding DSC, it's indisputable that ENT is part of the original timeline (otherwise, please explain the Defiant).

That said, I admit I'm amused by the sheer volume of people who seem to think they know more about DSC than its own creators do. You don't have to like DSC if you don't want to, of course. But if the people making it, say that it's part of the prime timeline (which they have)...then who are we to question them? Nobody can know more about something than those making that thing.

 

[Lord Garth]

Sliders is one of my favorite shows. Every episode, they go into another reality. Another universe. A different version of our world. For all we know we were following different versions of the same group of characters episode-to-episode.

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Likewise, Star Trek we're watching can be 99.99999% similar to other Star Trek and that explains the 0.00001% difference. Or, radical thought: it's all just a bunch of productions strung together that form an imperfect larger narrative.

 

[F. King Daniel]

While I'm all for a sticky Ongoing, Never-Ending Continuity Argument™ thread, it's the other one and this (and the other one and maybe the Enterprise one too by this point) should be merged into it.

 

[Groppler Zorn]

it's indisputable that ENT is part of the original timeline (otherwise, please explain the Defiant).

Since the “mirror darkly” episodes took place entirely in the mirror universe I dispute that ENT is part of the original timeline (for the sake of debate) as there’s no direct evidence that the Defiant, which came from the same timeline as TOS, exists in the same timeline as prime ENT.

DSC only recorded that the Defiant existed in their timeline - the only visual evidence we have of the Defiant in DSC is from the MU.

So there’s no reason that ENT couldn’t be its own separate timeline - even though I prefer to believe that it isn’t.

 

[dahj]

While I'm all for a sticky Ongoing, Never-Ending Continuity Argument™ thread, it's the other one and this (and the other one and maybe the Enterprise one too by this point) should be merged into it.

If you're gonna look at it like that might as well merge the entire forums...

I do hope the tone of my first post made it clear that I expect this one to be irreverently silly, thereby making it rather distinct from the turgid messes that the others devolve into.

 

[Jinn]

While I'm all for a sticky Ongoing, Never-Ending Continuity Argument™ thread, it's the other one and this (and the other one and maybe the Enterprise one too by this point) should be merged into it.

Really, all threads should be merged into two threads: The Discovery Quality and The Dicovery Continuity thread, those are prety much 99% of all posts, with maybe an additional The Discovery News thread.

 

[Jinn]

I do hope the tone of my first post made it clear that I expect this one to be irreverently silly, thereby making it rather distinct from the turgid messes that the others devolve into.

Oh, you wanted joke posts? I'm sorry, I'm gonna delete my Doctor Who/Kelvin Trek theory post.