I'm pretty stoked about this film! I'll probably see it either tomorrow or Saturday.
Spoilers Thor: Love and Thunder grade and discussion thread
- Thread starter The Nth Doctor
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I'm pretty stoked about this film! I'll probably see it either tomorrow or Saturday.
Just saw it this afternoon, hmm.. I can see why the reviews say it's not as good as Ragnarok. IMO it wasn't great.
I won't put specific spoilers yet but a few thoughts-
Personal criticisms nothing to do with Natalie Portman or that plotline, I enjoyed that. Just the whole OTT cheesy aspect to it, it felt like it was desperately trying to be funny all the times, and a lot of the gags really didn't land.
Worst of all it really felt like a kids movie. Like I was watching Percy Jackson or Shark Boy & Lava Girl or something (tbf I haven't seen those, but you know what I mean, it had that cheap kiddy vibe. And also a lot of literal kids, with their bad kiddy acting)
A lot of usual Marvel "play it safe safe safe" and "best stuff in the trailer" too.
I'm not a Marvel poo-pooer, far from it, but I can see what they mean now. They really need to and should be doing better.
I won't put specific spoilers yet but a few thoughts-
Personal criticisms nothing to do with Natalie Portman or that plotline, I enjoyed that. Just the whole OTT cheesy aspect to it, it felt like it was desperately trying to be funny all the times, and a lot of the gags really didn't land.
Worst of all it really felt like a kids movie. Like I was watching Percy Jackson or Shark Boy & Lava Girl or something (tbf I haven't seen those, but you know what I mean, it had that cheap kiddy vibe. And also a lot of literal kids, with their bad kiddy acting)
A lot of usual Marvel "play it safe safe safe" and "best stuff in the trailer" too.
I'm not a Marvel poo-pooer, far from it, but I can see what they mean now. They really need to and should be doing better.
Interesting.
Ok, now I have to watch it. Any time people use that phrase I find I enjoy the film all the more because kids know how to have fun in a way adults turn up their noses at. Sounds like me and my daughters will enjoy it.
Yeah. Not being snooty, just how I felt. Just my opinion, I hope others like it, just didn’t fully work for me. Wasn’t terrible, just was hoping for more.
Also I was in a mood because this woman in the row in front of me kept talking all the time. I think she wasn’t enjoying it so therefore felt that meant it was fine to have a chat with her friend, and discuss the film. Yeah don’t wait till it’s over and talk about it later, just do it right there and then!
I literally had to shout shut the f up after a while, that seemed to work. It’s amazing how stupid some people are, like they never learn basic respect for others, or still think they’re at home in their living rooms
(/rant)
Not directed at you specifically. More a reaction to the term "kid's movie" as if those things are lesser things. I am biased and I'll own it-I prefer kids film over more adult style fare nowadays. Kids have fun; adults have to justify fun. Kids engage in the moment while adults are dissecting elements that don't work for them. Kids are emotional, while adults will shun their own emotional needs.
A little bit of a generalized rant, not directed at you. More my reaction to the term "kids movie." I encourage everyone who sees something as a kids movie to watch it with kids and view it through their eyes and see if the perspective doesn't change.
In a cinema packed with die-hard fans the film unfolded in almost total silence except for a few scattered laughs, which is problem when 90% of it is supposed to be funny. When Russell Crowe started talking in an accent that would have been more at home in an episode of "Allo Allo" you could hear people groan.
Basically they took everything that worked in Ragnarok and ramped it up so much that it turned from enjoyable to awful.
And even if I hadn't known that it had been drastically cut before release it would have become pretty obvious. Jane becoming Thor, one of the pivotal moments in the story, doesn't get shown to us just relayed in a couple of lines of dialogue. (Ironic considering it was the scene which had the most set photos leaked during shooting.) And speaking of a couple of lines of dialogue, Jaimie Alexander, who gets 4th billing in the credits, gets less screen time than Melissa McCarthy's painfully unfunny cameo as Hela.
No, it's not the end of the MCU. I doubt it'll make as much as Dr Strange but I'm sure it'll still do fine. It's just disappointing.
Basically they took everything that worked in Ragnarok and ramped it up so much that it turned from enjoyable to awful.
And even if I hadn't known that it had been drastically cut before release it would have become pretty obvious. Jane becoming Thor, one of the pivotal moments in the story, doesn't get shown to us just relayed in a couple of lines of dialogue. (Ironic considering it was the scene which had the most set photos leaked during shooting.) And speaking of a couple of lines of dialogue, Jaimie Alexander, who gets 4th billing in the credits, gets less screen time than Melissa McCarthy's painfully unfunny cameo as Hela.
No, it's not the end of the MCU. I doubt it'll make as much as Dr Strange but I'm sure it'll still do fine. It's just disappointing.
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It was pretty good. A lot better than Ragnarok. Mainly due to the villain, who was basically Kratos. Just less brutal.
The Shadow Realm stuff was cool looking but he really should have brought Yugi with him. That’s his domain.
They missed a gag at the end. They should have shown Sif’s (welcome back BTW) arm in Valhalla.
The Shadow Realm stuff was cool looking but he really should have brought Yugi with him. That’s his domain.
They missed a gag at the end. They should have shown Sif’s (welcome back BTW) arm in Valhalla.
Blumming heck. Did no one else notice that the film opens on Nimbus III?!
I was expecting Laurence Luckinbill to pop up to ask Gor to share his pain and laugh into the sky as we fade to titles.
Really good. A couple of beats (Korg's face) fell flat and I almost wished there'd been a co-director to help focus it a bit more.
Shame that the location BTS snaps showing Jane's initial transformation were cut, though the film worked without it.
It did feel slightly encumbered by having to get the Guardians stuff in and out of the way, which made Act One feel a little overlong.
But these criticisms are slight. It was really enjoyable (especially the homage to Shazam! at the end) and it had heart with a non-violent resolution, which I really liked.
I was expecting Laurence Luckinbill to pop up to ask Gor to share his pain and laugh into the sky as we fade to titles.
Really good. A couple of beats (Korg's face) fell flat and I almost wished there'd been a co-director to help focus it a bit more.
Shame that the location BTS snaps showing Jane's initial transformation were cut, though the film worked without it.
It did feel slightly encumbered by having to get the Guardians stuff in and out of the way, which made Act One feel a little overlong.
But these criticisms are slight. It was really enjoyable (especially the homage to Shazam! at the end) and it had heart with a non-violent resolution, which I really liked.
I highly enjoyed the movie and I would say it definitely improved on all the issues I had with Ragnarok (which I also enjoyed, but not as much as everyone else). That makes it the best Thor movie for me, though I still don't rank it at the top of the MCU.
I did really like how character driven and low-key most of the humor was. Yes, there were some random bits which is just Korg's shtick and some over the top moments like Zeus flicking too hard, but 90% of the humor in this movie is just people who are sad or in pain looking for something to laugh about or offering compassion to other people who are sad or in pain. I think that's probably a part of why the humor isn't landing for a lot of people because too many are going into this expecting it to just be a mindless laugh riot when it's far more a very bittersweet and human type of comedy. Most of the jokes have some sad or painful undertones that, yes, make them somewhat less funny than what people were probably expecting but also make the characters way more engaging and sympathetic.
Also, the visuals were incredible, especially in the shadow realm and around Gorr. Bale is visually one of the coolest villains in the MCU, way better done than Hela's generic rain of swords and such. That moment where he interrupts the kids telling stories about Thor is one of the creepiest things I've ever seen in a comic book movie (it reminded me of Michael Keaton's speech in the car, but the fantasy version). I do wish we could've seen the next few minutes of that scene though, because I feel like they cut quite a bit out there that would've been interesting characterization for Gorr.
And I have to disagree with any hating on Russell Crowe's performance. His accent isn't any weirder or dumber than Thor's trademark pompous shakespearianisms and his combination of total buffoon mixed with completely petty bastard who will casually slaughter anyone who pisses him off feels like exactly what I would expect a character like Zeus to be (the mythological Zeus was not in any way a likeable or charismatic guy, imo). Especially if, as the movie later hints, he's going to be a serious Thor/Asgard villain in the future. If the MCU delivers on that promise, I expect Crowe to come out of it with a much more interesting performance overall than Anthony Hopkins was ever allowed. (Nothing against Hopkins, the MCU just never gave Odin any decent material until his literal death scene.)
I did really like how character driven and low-key most of the humor was. Yes, there were some random bits which is just Korg's shtick and some over the top moments like Zeus flicking too hard, but 90% of the humor in this movie is just people who are sad or in pain looking for something to laugh about or offering compassion to other people who are sad or in pain. I think that's probably a part of why the humor isn't landing for a lot of people because too many are going into this expecting it to just be a mindless laugh riot when it's far more a very bittersweet and human type of comedy. Most of the jokes have some sad or painful undertones that, yes, make them somewhat less funny than what people were probably expecting but also make the characters way more engaging and sympathetic.
Also, the visuals were incredible, especially in the shadow realm and around Gorr. Bale is visually one of the coolest villains in the MCU, way better done than Hela's generic rain of swords and such. That moment where he interrupts the kids telling stories about Thor is one of the creepiest things I've ever seen in a comic book movie (it reminded me of Michael Keaton's speech in the car, but the fantasy version). I do wish we could've seen the next few minutes of that scene though, because I feel like they cut quite a bit out there that would've been interesting characterization for Gorr.
And I have to disagree with any hating on Russell Crowe's performance. His accent isn't any weirder or dumber than Thor's trademark pompous shakespearianisms and his combination of total buffoon mixed with completely petty bastard who will casually slaughter anyone who pisses him off feels like exactly what I would expect a character like Zeus to be (the mythological Zeus was not in any way a likeable or charismatic guy, imo). Especially if, as the movie later hints, he's going to be a serious Thor/Asgard villain in the future. If the MCU delivers on that promise, I expect Crowe to come out of it with a much more interesting performance overall than Anthony Hopkins was ever allowed. (Nothing against Hopkins, the MCU just never gave Odin any decent material until his literal death scene.)
Forgot to say too this is the best (newly released in 2022) film I've seen Sam Neill in all summer.
I also liked this movie more than I thought I would. I liked it better than Ragnarok, which I needed to look at a second time to actually "get" it. I'm not a big fan of Waititi's humor, so I was dreading him going really overboard in Love & Thunder, and while there's a lot of humor, or attempts at it, it wasn't as wacky as I was dreading. Love & Thunder, while stuffed, didn't feel as bloated/padded as Ragnarok. I do think Ragnarok was a better-looking film. None of the action scenes in Love & Thunder looked as artistically rendered.
I liked that Thor didn't get lost in the story of Love & Thunder like I felt happened with Dr. Strange in Multiverse of Madness. That film had a hard time keeping the focus on Strange's journey. And the attempts made in that movie felt more tacked on.
I don't think the movie was groundbreaking, even for the MCU, but it was a good popcorn film. However, I do feel the potty, saucy/salacious, and creepy aspects of it don't make it a suitable family film.
Russell Crowe's accent was a bit much,
I liked that Thor didn't get lost in the story of Love & Thunder like I felt happened with Dr. Strange in Multiverse of Madness. That film had a hard time keeping the focus on Strange's journey. And the attempts made in that movie felt more tacked on.
I don't think the movie was groundbreaking, even for the MCU, but it was a good popcorn film. However, I do feel the potty, saucy/salacious, and creepy aspects of it don't make it a suitable family film.
Russell Crowe's accent was a bit much,
but I took it as him attempting to channel Don Corleone from The Godfather (the "God" father, which basically is the role Zeus plays as the most powerful god in the film).
I’ve been thinking of this and I’m not so sure Waititi or the location accounts aren’t Final Frontier fans. Opening on Nimbus III followed by the finale where they must go to the centre of the universe, on an impossible journey no one’s ever survived before, to meet the Eternity God of GodsI thought I was the only one reminded of Star Trek V.
Not going to read any posts in this thread until later, but I'm currently in the theater waiting for the movie to start.
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I think the base story was stronger than Ragnarok's, and Gorr was a more interesting villain than Hela, but this had the same problem Ragnarok had in that it was trying way too hard to be funny when the story they were trying to tell doesn't really mesh very well with humor, the only difference is most of the jokes in Ragnarok landed a lot better.
The movie also really could have used another ten minutes or so to breathe. The pacing was pretty wild. And I was originally sold on Gorr's threat, but...
I actually wasn't super pleased with one of the post-credits scenes, either:
The movie also really could have used another ten minutes or so to breathe. The pacing was pretty wild. And I was originally sold on Gorr's threat, but...
Once he kidnapped the Asgardian kids, he just hung back and chilled, waiting for Thor to come for him. I know his plan was reliant on getting Stormbreaker but I was really expecting him to show up at the city of the gods and lay waste to it, and he didn't.
I thought it was really cheap having Zeus take his own lightning bolt through the heart and then still survive. Yes, I know, he's a god, but he took a godly weapon to the heart. And since the whole point of the scene was to send Hercules after Thor, why not instead have Hercules swear vengeance for the murder of his father?
For my part (I saw it today and generally enjoyed it), there are aspects of the humor that just seemed a tad too silly for me, and some other writing elements that could have been paced and fleshed out a bit better. Ragnarok has its share of silliness as well, but for me it's a bit more coherent overall.
I know very little about Jane's Thor arc in the comments, but I do seem to recall it being mentioned there that using Mjolnir was an aspect interfering with her normal treatment. Was there a specific explanation for that, as it's a point the film mentions but just sort of glosses over IMO?
I thought Russell did fine myself, although the accent did make it slightly hard to understand his dialogue at times.
I liked the idea of all the various deities having their own communal dimension, for lack of a better term, but I also feel like there was a missed opportunity in terms of how Zeus was handled. I mean, why would he (and perhaps by extension, the Greek pantheon) have so much authority when Earth alone has had dozens of pantheons, and there's probably hundreds or thousands of non-human pantheons represented as well (a few of which we see)? Wouldn't it be more logical for such a vast array of high-powered beings to cooperate in council or committee versus a single leader? Plus, how would Zeus deal with gods that don't like orgies or sex? 
I kind of felt like there should have been more deities willing to support Thor's arguments, if only to keep discussing the threat, and it would have been cool to perhaps see some of them confronting Gorr, either to fight him or try reasoning with him, and getting killed. Just my two cents.
Sounds very Hebrew.
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