These are the voyages...

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by Papermoon, Jul 25, 2017.

  1. Papermoon

    Papermoon Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    Why in this final episode did the writers decide that Trip had to, you know. [Spoilers]

    I was so heartbroken
     
  2. Bry_Sinclair

    Bry_Sinclair Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    They were giving the finger to the fans.
     
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  3. Noname Given

    Noname Given Vice Admiral Admiral

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    TATV or as it's better known: "This Ain't The Valentine" (to the fans). ;)
     
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  4. Mach5

    Mach5 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I have it on good authority that Discovery might decanonize TATV, if we asked them nicely.
     
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  5. Prax

    Prax Commodore Commodore

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    I think they wanted to kill off a main character in the next season, if they got another season. He must have been it. I think there is a much clearer choice of who to kill off if they just had to do it.
     
  6. Kor

    Kor Admiral Admiral

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    The easier route would have been to kill a character who didn't really do much on the show. They took the less easy route.

    Kor
     
  7. Prax

    Prax Commodore Commodore

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    Well you know what they say, "Work smarter, not harder."
     
  8. Dukhat

    Dukhat Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I don't think you need a spoiler for an episode that was shown 12 years ago.

    The real answer: Berman and Braga legitimately thought killing Trip would provide good drama. It wasn't a "finger to the fans" or some such nonsense. They actually thought TATV was a good sendoff. It was only much later that they realized just how wrong they were.
     
  9. Mattadd

    Mattadd Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Honestly I don't mind that they offed Trip (doesn't hurt that he was my least favourite character on the show) by they should have done it in a better way.
     
  10. Shikarnov

    Shikarnov Rear Admiral Premium Member

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    I know it seems like it has nothing to do with TATV, but I promise this is related:

    Pick up this book. You'll be glad you did. And the Enterprise Relaunch books that followed were equally excellent, including the wonderful Rise of the Federation series by @Christopher Bennett which came after.

    ETA: Oh, I see there's a new Rise book coming out next month. I'm so excited. :biggrin:
     
  11. Reanok

    Reanok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I've read all the Enterprise relaunch books and really like them alot.. I'm looking forward to reading Pattern of Interference in a few weeks .
     
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  12. M.A.C.O.

    M.A.C.O. Commodore Commodore

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    Thing about TATV, is that it originally slated to be a season 3 episode. The idea was (as Berman described in an interview) to have the TNG characters look back on the past and see things through their eyes. However, the Xindi arc was in full swing and the threat of cancellation was hanging above their heads. Doing an inconsequential episode to the current arc would've been bad. However, the episode was still slated to be inconsequential. Berman said he planned to ignore the forecasted future events (Trip dying) had ENT gone on to a 5th, 6th and 7th season. Just use time travel or some other method to change Trip's fate, so he made it all the way to the end.

    Things didn't go that way, unfortunately. Berman and Braga still decided to close on killing off Trip. This after killing his sister in season 2 and killing his daughter in the preceding episode of TATV. The Tucker family line died, with no one to carry it on.

    What were they thinking?
    #valentineforthefans
     
  13. Borg King

    Borg King Ensign Red Shirt

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    A boring episode that should be retconed. Pick up the Enterprise Relaunch books and your'll be satisfied 100%. Hopefully one day Paramount will make the books into films.
     
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  14. Reanok

    Reanok Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Latest Enterprise book Patterns of Interference by Christopher Bennett:bolian::) is a really good book. There's several mentions of different tv episodes mentioned in the book and characters you'll recognize when you read the Relaunch books.
     
  15. Dukhat

    Dukhat Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    1. It's not going to be retconned. You'll have to deal with it just like the rest of us do.

    2. Paramount will never, ever make a Star Trek novel into a film.
     
  16. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Admiral Admiral

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    For some reason, they thought randomly killing off their most popular character in a finale centred around characters from another series that was popular a decade or more earlier was a good idea.
     
  17. LoyaulteMeLie

    LoyaulteMeLie Lieutenant Junior Grade Red Shirt

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    An opinion that I'm still trying to make sense of. I've listened to / read all the interviews on the subject that I can get hold of, and somehow I still can't get my head around it. It would make more sense if anything in the plot even referred to Riker's dilemma in 'Pegasus', or even if the ten years weren't so painfully obvious in both Riker and Troi. As it was, the whole thing was just agonisingly inept. I don't know whether there was any malice intended to the fans or not, but if anyone can explain to me how making the Enterprise characters bit part players in their own show finale could possibly be interpreted as other than incredibly insulting to them, I'd be edified.

    For me, the worst thing of all was that it followed an episode that was one of the best in the series, and showcased what Enterprise could have been. There, but for a combination of fatal circumstances, went a show that at its best really did have some enormous potential.
     
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  18. Prax

    Prax Commodore Commodore

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    I think they just had this interesting concept for an episode that kept getting pushed back, and then at the end they wanted to have that tie in to mark the end of their tenure. Star Trek was going off the air for the first time in almost 20 years. Rick Berman was saying goodbye to a big chunk of his life.

    I heard an interview with the actor who plays Lt Reed, and he thought it was awesome getting to have scenes with Frakes.
     
  19. Willow

    Willow Captain Captain

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    Yes. I've heard Dominuc mention that - several times. He also is apparently friends with Sirtis. But I've also heard him say, on the heals of stating how great it was working with TNG cast, that the show was rather "clunky". And he uses that very word in several interviews, making me think it's his standard "go to" polite answer. How he really FEELS about the finale literally making his crew secondary to TNG may remain a mystery. I'm actually am okay with the cast not making disparaging or angry comments about a series that was a boost to their careers. (And, as Dominic says, he continues to "draw annuities " from that gig in the form of the Trek Cons)
     
  20. Prax

    Prax Commodore Commodore

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    I think of it more as a bonus episode or crossover epilogue than Ent. finale. Since they had 2 finales, it seems reasonable.
     
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