The X-Men Cinematic Universe (General Discussion)

[Turtletrekker]

Also, in the original timeline, Scott's powers activated in '85 (or '79 as Set Harth suggests). Xavier was already bald when he recruited Jean as a child.

I try to look at what we've seen in both timelines and also think about what events would have occurred anyway with or without the timeline changing.

We've seen the stripe in Rogue's hair, which she got while in Magneto's mutant making machine in X1, in both timelines, suggesting that Magneto pulled of some variation of the same scheme in both timelines.

Likewise with Storm's white hair and Xavier's baldness, suggesting that both timelines had an attack by Apocalypse, which makes some sense in that I don't see how the changed timeline would have affected the actions of the ancient Apocalypse cult trying to bring him back.

With Stryker still in play, he could still potentially build his own Cerebro to kill all mutants as in X2.

The confrontation at Alcatraz in X3 may have still happened in one form or another if Warren Worthington II still creates his mutant cure (and I'm with the faction that doesn't believe the Angel in Apocalypse to have been Warren Worthington III. Wings could be a common mutation).

Yashida would still have sought out Wolverine in both time-lines upon his death, instigating the same chain of events from The Wolverine.

The only movie to be completely wiped away is XMO: Wolverine.

 

[Set Harth]

The only movie to be completely wiped away is XMO: Wolverine.

Except for most of the Wolverine backstory in the prologue.

 

[DigificWriter]

As I believe I said earlier, I'm inclined to believe the Empire Magazine timeline's dates for some of the things that happened in the original timeline, which would place the 'present' events of Origins: Wolverine in the mid-80s.

 

[The Mighty Monkey of Mim]

It may be intended to be 1979.

Yes indeed, considering the climax at Three Mile Island seems to imply that this is what was "really" behind the supposed 1979 meltdown there. (Obviously the preceding events in the film cover a span of time leading up to this.)

 

[Set Harth]

I certainly wouldn't go any earlier than 1979.

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

Yes indeed, considering the climax at Three Mile Island seems to imply that this is what was "really" behind the supposed 1979 meltdown there. (Obviously the preceding events in the film cover a span of time leading up to this.)

See, here's the problem that I have with that: If the bulk of X-Men Origins: Wolverine takes place in 1979, then that means that X-Men is set in 1994! Hardly the "not too distant future" of a movie released in 2000. The dialogue in both X-Men & X2 is very consistent in stating that Wolverine's amnesia dates back 15 years. To me, this means that the earliest that Weapon X could have originally occurred was 1985.

Here's my hypothetical timeline for the original films:
1973: Logan & Victor work for some mob boss in New York. Their employment ends abruptly when Logan is caught in bed with the boss' daughter.
1975: Having rejoined the military, Logan & Victor assist with the evacuation of refugees from Vietnam. Victor attempts to rape a local village girl. When a fellow soldier tries to stop him, Victor kills him. The situation quickly escalates and Victor & Logan are sentenced to death. When they fail to die after their execution, Maj. Stryker recruits them for his special mutant team.
1979: Logan quits Stryker's team. Shortly afterwards, Stryker sets up a secret lab for mutant experimentation at Three Mile Island, then fakes a nuclear accident there to frighten away people that might otherwise ask questions.
1979-1985: Logan gets a job as a lumberjack, meets Kayla, and moves in with her.
1985: Victor fakes Kayla's murder so that Col. Stryker can convince Logan to volunteer for the Weapon X experiment.

 

[DigificWriter]

Based on both information from the Empire Magazine timeline and the films themselves, here's my estimation on the dating of certain events:
Late 60s/early 70s - Logan and Victor fight in Vietnam (Origins: Wolverine)

1973 - Logan, having returned to the States, works for the New York city mob as a 'heavy' (extrapolated from Days of Future Past)

1975 - Logan is back in Vietnam, where he and Victor are recruited by Stryker for Team X after surviving execution (Origins: Wolverine)

1979 - Logan quits Team X (Origins: Wolverine)

1985 - Victor 'kills' Kayla, giving Logan motivation to volunteer for the Weapon X program; he subsequently fights Wade Wilson/Weapon XI, but loses his memory when Stryker shoots him in the head with Adamantium bullets; a 'rejuvenated' Xavier - benefiting from the healing qualities of an 'anti-paralysis' drug created by Hank McCoy but not suffering from power-suppression side effects that plagued him during his early usage of it - rescues Scott Summers and other young Mutants, including Kayla's sister Emma, from Stryker's facility on Three Mile Island (Origins: Wolverine, with info extrapolated from Days of Future Past)

Between 1985 and 1987 - Erik is either rescued or freed from imprisonment beneath the Pentagon - after being falsely accused and convicted of assassinating President John F. Kennedy, whom he was actually trying to save on account of Kennedy being a Mutant - and reconciles with Charles (extrapolated from Days of Future Past and The Last Stand)

1987 - Xavier - still using Hank's drug - and Erik recruit Jean Grey (The Last Stand)

2005 - Erik, in response to Senator Kelly's calls for the Mutant Registration Act, plots to transform all of the world's leaders into Mutants, which brings Logan and a young mutant named Marie/Rogue into contact with Xavier and his X-Men (X-Men)

2006 - Stryker uses his son Jason as part of a scheme to destroy all Mutants, forcing Xavier and Erik and their followers/associates to temporarily band together; Jean taps into immense power reserves and sacrifices herself to save her friends (X2)

2007 - Warren Worthington II develops a Mutant 'cure', prompting Erik to launch an all-out war on humanity in order to destroy said cure and stop it from ever being forcibly administered; Jean, having returned from the dead inhabited by the essence of a psychic 'double personaliry' called the Phoenix and aligned herself with Erik after killing Charles, unleashes her full powers and is ultimately killed by Logan as a last-resort measure (The Last Stand)

2013 - Logan, now living in the Yukon wilderness and plagued by 'visions' of Jean, is found by Yukio, the mutant ward of a man named Ichiro Yashida - whom Logan met and saved during the bombing of Nagasaki, Japan in 1945 - and taken to Tokyo to ostensibly say goodbye to Yashida before his death, but becomes caught up in a plot by Yashida to steal his immortality and healing abilities, meeting and falling in love with Yashida's grandaughter Mariko in the process (The Wolverine)

2015 - After two years of traveling the world with Yukio, Logan is disembarking through airport security when he's approached by Erik and a resurrected Charles, who warn him of an escalating threat to Mutantkind and ask for his help (The Wolverine)

 

[Kor]

I find that the continuity flows much better if you basically disregard Origins: Wolverine.

Kor

 

[Skywalker]

The continuity must flow!

 

[DigificWriter]

The continuity flows just fine without ignoring any of the existing movies, including Apocalypse.

 

[Skywalker]

Much of this thread is proof that it doesn't. Heck, Days of Future Past was proof that it didn't.

 

[DigificWriter]

Much of this thread is proof that it doesn't. Heck, Days of Future Past was proof that it didn't.

I said this earlier, but the films are actually not as problematic, continuity-wise, as they're perceived to be, and Days of Future Past didn't actually 'fix' much of the things that were genuinely wrong with them, as it didn't actually ignore any of the films that came before it even though it's perceived to have done so.

 

[Skywalker]

You said it earlier, but the continuity that exists in your head is not the same as the continuity that actually exists.

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

My hypothesis regarding how things played themselves out in the original timeline is that Xavier eventually snapped out of his depression and rescued Erik himself after learning the truth about what had really happened back in 1963.

At first, I had a hard time believing this. But I suppose it would help explain why the two of them are so buddy-buddy again in the late 1980s in the X-Men: The Last Stand prologue.

 

[M.A.C.O.]

UGH!!! Please no!
Singer wants a solo Mystique film and Fox allegedly wants JLaw to be face of the franchise going forward.

http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2016/05/x-men-jennifer-lawrence-mystique-spin-off

 

[kirk55555]

UGH!!! Please no!
Singer wants a solo Mystique film and Fox allegedly wants JLaw to be face of the franchise going forward.

http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2016/05/x-men-jennifer-lawrence-mystique-spin-off

That's what I was afraid of. Hopefully the poor response to Apocalypse will either convince Lawrence to move on, or at least make the people in charge rework the franchise and not make her the main character. They could try having a franchise where there is no main character, and the X-Men themselves get to share the spotlight. But, this being FOX we're talking about I'm pretty sure they don't want that and, based on how many X-Men characters they use in poorly developed throw away roles, I don't think they could do it. At least, not the people currently working on the movies.

I don't know why they don't just focus on the newly introduced younger X-Men. Give them a few movies and focus on them. If they need a new focus character though, just anyone but Mystique. Use one of the younger X-Men (like young Jean Grey), use Professor X, heck use Colossus or Negasonic Teenage Warhead or Deadpool or Channing Tatum's Gambit (if that character ever debuts). Just anyone but Lawrence's Mystique.

 

[DigificWriter]

You said it earlier, but the continuity that exists in your head is not the same as the continuity that actually exists.

My statement is BASED ON the "continuity that actually exists".

Regarding J-Law and Mystique continuing to be a focal character in the franchise, there is nothing stopping the filmmakers from creating a solo film or films for her AND building on what they have set up with Apocalypse and the younger generation of X-Men characters, nor is there anything stopping them from building a Mystique franchise around J-Law and continuing with the other stories (New Mutants, Deadpool and Cable, etc.) they've already got planned. This is not an either/or situation.

 

[Reverend]

As a rule of thumb I've found it's never worth expending any more energy thinking about the continuity of a series of film thans the creators did at the time.

In the case of the X-Men, it clear they didn't really bother all that much beyond a few surface details and didn't think more than one movie ahead (because who does besides Marvel & Star Wars?) And that's fine.

Things that were thrown in as fun little nods and easter eggs in one movie, ends up being brought to the forefront in another but doesn't really line up because they didn't plan it ahead of time. And that's fine too.

It's why we got at least three versions of Kitty, two Emma Frosts, 2.5 versions of Angel, I don't know how many Jubilees and all kinds of little easter eggs references that don't really hold up to scrutiny (because they weren't meant to.) Oh and anyone who thinks Origins Wolverine is still in continuity, even in the pre-DoFP timeline clearly hasn't seen Deadpool yet. And good riddance I say. That movie was terrible.

 

[DarthPipes]

Of all the great female X-Men characters like Storm, Kitty, Jean, Emma, Rogue and Psylocke, it's a non-member and villain like Mystique that Fox wants to develop as the face of the X-Men. But that's only because they want J-Law to be there star and I seriously doubt that's going to happen.

Singer has done a very poor job developing the female X-Men, who has always been such a great strength of the X-comics.

 

[Set Harth]

It's why we got at least three versions of Kitty

Three different actresses for Kitty, certainly, but hair color aside, isn't it all the same version of Kitty continuity-wise?

Oh and anyone who thinks Origins Wolverine is still in continuity, even in the pre-DoFP timeline clearly hasn't seen Deadpool yet.

To paraphrase one Dr. Leonard McCoy ( son of David ):

It's really not dead... as long as this timeline's Xavier remembers it.