I have a rather love/hate relationship with STV. It has a good movie buried in there somewhere. I love the relationship elements with the Big Three, and they are allowed some nice mellow time.
But
I have to agree. The characterizations have some great moments, but the story is largely appalling.
But
I have to agree. The characterizations have some great moments, but the story is largely appalling.
It's funny that this movie is now in the love it or hate it category.
Originally dispised for it's obvious flaws and now with a renaisance where people extoll it's virtues.
The movie is average--which is what nobody wants to hear.
It gets many things right and just as many wrong.
The script is terribly uneven and unpolished.
FX are a clear step back.
Humor misfires more than it scores.
Very weak climax.
Not enough action for the type of movie it wanted to be.
BUT----
The series needed a 'one-off' adventure
IT had a teaser
Multiple adversaries/problems
Fantastic 'BIG 3' interplay
Interesting sci-fi concepts (that didn't pay off)
It turns out to be not a great or even a good movie but a fantastic story about the big 3.
Too bad they coundln't have delayed it 6 months and got the script/FX/action parts worked out, but left in most of the interplay.
Originally dispised for it's obvious flaws and now with a renaisance where people extoll it's virtues.
The movie is average--which is what nobody wants to hear.
It gets many things right and just as many wrong.
The script is terribly uneven and unpolished.
FX are a clear step back.
Humor misfires more than it scores.
Very weak climax.
Not enough action for the type of movie it wanted to be.
BUT----
The series needed a 'one-off' adventure
IT had a teaser
Multiple adversaries/problems
Fantastic 'BIG 3' interplay
Interesting sci-fi concepts (that didn't pay off)
It turns out to be not a great or even a good movie but a fantastic story about the big 3.
Too bad they coundln't have delayed it 6 months and got the script/FX/action parts worked out, but left in most of the interplay.
Balls. For once all the characters had something to DO. And Shatner realized they could be best seen by having them play off each other.
When Scotty got piss drunk and failed to bring Kirk the Kelvan piece of equipment, did anyone accuse Jermoe Bixby of making him look foolish?
Scotty broke our guys out of the brig. That's what he does - get our heroes out of trouble.
And I for one admire the pratfall Doohan took, at that age and weight.
DeForest Kelly once said Star Trek is made up of moments. I think STV had some of the best moments in Trek. The scene where Bones euthanizes his father, and Sarek's line when Spock is born are both gut wrenching. Spock's expression at that moment is perfect and just sells it all.
Except for the singing part (yes, I could have done without that) the dialogue at the campfire sums up the relationship of the big 3.
Kirk quoting Sea Fever.
While I agree, not the best film by any stretch, not really worthy of the flack it got. Like a highschool kid who wasn't cool enough, it was just in the wrong clique.
Except for the singing part (yes, I could have done without that) the dialogue at the campfire sums up the relationship of the big 3.
Kirk quoting Sea Fever.
While I agree, not the best film by any stretch, not really worthy of the flack it got. Like a highschool kid who wasn't cool enough, it was just in the wrong clique.
I always liked this one. It's a fast paced adventure. Some of it was a little overdone for my taste though. The humor was juvinile and the friendship of the Big Three was a little in your face. Kirk was actually going to hug/kiss or something Spock in front of people? Really?
Shatner, also, was a little out of control. He's not good at directing himself and it felt more like a parody of Kirk than the actual character. And Kirk was indeed quite out of character here. The whole "let's bring Sybok and his guys up to the Enterprise without any pressuring" was rediculous. What happened to the "death before taking my ship" thing that made Kirk such a tough bastard? Still, had Sybok melded with Sulu and Uhura before lift off, this could have been easily forgiven. Since they were going to go anyway, you know Kirk would go with them to look for a chance to get his ship back.
What I did like: Sybok was not a black hat bad guy. He was a complex and sympathetic character. The crew familiarity was outstanding and they all acted like real people. And real people do rediculous things. Like bumping into shit and getting lost in the woods.
They actually pulled of a feeling of awe as the four of them went to meet God. Still, I would have loved to see the Enterprise on top of her game instead of being simply as transport and joke fodder. The whole "ship is a piece of crap" was not all that necessary and something could have been worked in to explain the transporter failure.
Like this a lot, but that stuff really bugs me.
Shatner, also, was a little out of control. He's not good at directing himself and it felt more like a parody of Kirk than the actual character. And Kirk was indeed quite out of character here. The whole "let's bring Sybok and his guys up to the Enterprise without any pressuring" was rediculous. What happened to the "death before taking my ship" thing that made Kirk such a tough bastard? Still, had Sybok melded with Sulu and Uhura before lift off, this could have been easily forgiven. Since they were going to go anyway, you know Kirk would go with them to look for a chance to get his ship back.
What I did like: Sybok was not a black hat bad guy. He was a complex and sympathetic character. The crew familiarity was outstanding and they all acted like real people. And real people do rediculous things. Like bumping into shit and getting lost in the woods.
They actually pulled of a feeling of awe as the four of them went to meet God. Still, I would have loved to see the Enterprise on top of her game instead of being simply as transport and joke fodder. The whole "ship is a piece of crap" was not all that necessary and something could have been worked in to explain the transporter failure.
Like this a lot, but that stuff really bugs me.
I fully agree. It was so wonderful to see De Kelley ACT again!
I agree. While he really nailed the other characters, Shater just didn't get Kirk right. Kirk wasn't that petty and wasn't prone to bickering like that. And he'd never have said something as ridiculous as "I fear nothing."
The "I need my pain" speech, on the other hand, was very good, well delivered and characteristic of Kirk.
Well, he kind of did pick death before losing his ship. Or at least he supposed that in the chaos of a deliberate shuttle crash his people would probably have a better chance of getting the upper hand than Sybok's would. If Spock didn't have this thing about killing his siblings it would've even worked.
I know Kirk probably didn't have a ``deliberate crash'' plan in mind when they left Nimbus's surface. But he did have some idea roughly how long it'd take for the Klingon response to arrive, so he may well guessed his timing would be right or they could make the approach to the Enterprise long enough to force an ``emergency'' landing.
And it's not unreasonable to give a bit of ground -- even to taking the enemy aboard -- if it's the way out of a standoff. Kirk used a roughly analogous approach in ``Day of the Dove'', except there he could be sure he could arrive aboard first.
No this is one of those moments when you need to see the cigar for the cigar. Kirk was speaking metaphorically here and simply making the point that Spock had become like a brother to him.
He wasn't dissing his own flesh and blood - only pointing out that yes he lost one brother but the universe gave him another.
Sometimes reading to much into the intent ruins things....
Sharr
Here's a slightly related question:
I remember some mention about a promotional thing, or maybe it was an actual toy for sale - a "Marshmellon Dispenser" - that came out around the release of the movie. Some say it looked just like the prop that Spock used at the camp site. Is there any truth to this and, if so, where could one find such a thing?
I remember some mention about a promotional thing, or maybe it was an actual toy for sale - a "Marshmellon Dispenser" - that came out around the release of the movie. Some say it looked just like the prop that Spock used at the camp site. Is there any truth to this and, if so, where could one find such a thing?
To me this movie was not the worst of them all (Insurrection has that dubious distinction for me). It's major problem was that it was uneven. There were some great moments that really cut to the heart of a lot of the characters and their relationships. There were also horrid bits of humour that just ruined the moment.
I think that there was a lot of potential that could have been brought out in this movie and that potential means it could have been one of the best but it just falls well short of the finish line.
Ranked against the other movies, I would give Final Frontier a respectable 6.5/10.
I think that there was a lot of potential that could have been brought out in this movie and that potential means it could have been one of the best but it just falls well short of the finish line.
Ranked against the other movies, I would give Final Frontier a respectable 6.5/10.
Sharr, I think you're right... In a way, Jim has three brothers... Sam, his blood brother, and Spock and Bones the brothers of his heart.
Well it had some continuity gaffes...just like the series. And then there were some sub-standard FX...kind of like the series. And some crazy story about a bad guy hi-jacking the ship...kind of like the series. Add to that the characterizations that were more like the series than the other movies...and the ship was on a mission, kind of like the series...plus some series sound FX and series references in the script. All in all, I guess people can complain that, of all the movies, it was most like the series.
I can live with that.
I can live with that.
I've loved the movie since the first time I saw it on opening night June 9th, 1989. I never did understand why the movie got such a bad rap. Perhaps its because it didn't do well at the box office, but that was mostly due to the stiff box office competition. It wasn't a perfect movie, but it certainly wasn't horrible. Hands down it had the best character moments of any TOS film.
Unfortunately, that's too true.
Yep. It would be nice to see Shatner's originally intended ending, if possible. It was quite grand in scale.
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