The purpose of Deanna Troi

[Volvic]

I never really had much of problem with Troi despite the fact she was poorly handled by the writers. They couldn't really think of anything for to do other than be a love interest/damsel-in-distress/or an empathic sensor.

Bit of a shame considering that when you look at the character on paper there were a lot of interesting avenues the writers could have explored but didn't.

I think Troi's function works if you fanwank a lot of it:

She was on the bridge not because she has nothing better to do, but because she was in fact evaluating the command team's performance and then reporting to the admiralty. Yes it's a stretch, but it's the only reason I can give as why any ship's counselor would be on the bridge of a galaxy class starship to begin with.

In addition to counselling and evaluating the mental health of crewmembers, liaised between starfleet and civilian crewmen, prepped Picard on first contact missions and maybe helped out in the xenology department once in a while.

When it comes to the secondary characters you really have to work at it. In my head Dr Crusher is pure win.

It's just a shame that TPTB were so against having conflict on the ship. She would have made a decent quasi-villain.

 

[milo bloom]

There were at least a few mentions to her "staff", so I'm pretty sure there were other counselors on the ship, and I believe someone also tells her at one point that other ships' captains don't always have a Betazed counselor, they have to make do with a non-telepathic species in that position.

It comes down to A. the position not being clearly defined in the very beginning and B. not figuring what to do with that position for the next seven+plus years.

This isn't the first time the topic has come up, and they always eventually turn towards ideas like Volvic's. I personally love the idea of her as second officer/diplomatic officer. Lt Commander in command red, and she just happens to also be an empath. This would also add some tension to her relationship with Riker. Old friends, but she still wants his butt out of the way at some point so she can advance to first officer.

 

[DGCatAniSiri]

This is just my guess, but I've come to the conclusion that Troi was meant to be the liasion between Picard and the civilian population, which is why she wore the bunny suits, because she was equal parts Starfleet officer and civilian official and somewhat outside of the regular command structure. But the show never really utilized the civilian aspect, and as a result, we don't get to see Troi in this capacity, leaving the psychologist at the Captain's right hand as a relic of the eighties mindset. Though the role of a counselor is certainly important when dealing with a crew of over a thousand in space for years at a time, I don't think it quite requires the counselor to be at the captain's side as part of the standard duty shift.

I like how the novels have expanded on Troi's role, in that she is now the Diplomatic Officer on the Titan. She often did this for Picard, going over the cultures of aliens and working to help smooth relations between the Federation and the people they encounter. It feels like a natural development of the role she did get to play.

 

[Solarbaby]

I haven't watched many Troi centred TNG episodes for a long long time. I decided to watch a cpl of seaosn 1. The last outpost was one. She was actually quite useful in the few lines she had. Mentioning the planet below when everyone assumed that the Ferengi were holding the Enterprise in a tractor beam. Then I watch 11001101011010101010001111 wotever and she wasn't even in it at all lol. WHich is a bit weird becasue surely all the senior staff would be together when the Enterprise was stolen. Troi would have sensed Picard and Riker on the Enterprise when no one knew were they were. Sometime her telepathetic abilities was a problem to telling the story. Oh and she can sense the Ferengi in the last outpost even though we later learn Betazoids can't read Ferengi minds. I think I might watch some more earlier stuff as it wasn't as bad as I remember. I might see Troi in a new light. I always seem to have one bad memory of Troi when she didnt know what a warp core breach was and that always made me mad.

 

[tharpdevenport]

Her outfit was conservative comparted to TOS women uniforms. Besides, every show needs some sex appeal. At least it wasn't as blatant "hey look I have boobs" as Seven of Nine.

You know, thinking about that ... I find it amusing that Ro gets guff about a fucking earing, while Troi sits on the Bridge with massive clevage.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

You know, thinking about that ... I find it amusing that Ro gets guff about a fucking earing, while Troi sits on the Bridge with massive clevage.

That had nothing to do with the clothes, but the person behind them.

Read between the lines.

Worf also got to wear his sash. Picard et al had few problems with that. It was Ro herself that was the issue. Not the earring.

 

[tharpdevenport]

You know, thinking about that ... I find it amusing that Ro gets guff about a fucking earing, while Troi sits on the Bridge with massive clevage.

That had nothing to do with the clothes, but the person behind them.

Read between the lines.

Worf also got to wear his sash. Picard et al had few problems with that. It was Ro herself that was the issue. Not the earring.

Actually, it was the cloths; regulation uniform and appearence. When Jellico took the Enterprise in "Chain of Command", Troi was forced into uniform. I also recall regulation denying Ro the earing in another episode.

Only reason Worf had his thing on is it's probably no different than an awarded Starfleet officer wearing awards on his uniform. Plus -- don't piss off a member of a race who was at war with you for over a hundred years.

 

[DevilEyes]

You know, thinking about that ... I find it amusing that Ro gets guff about a fucking earing, while Troi sits on the Bridge with massive clevage.

That had nothing to do with the clothes, but the person behind them.

Read between the lines.

Worf also got to wear his sash. Picard et al had few problems with that. It was Ro herself that was the issue. Not the earring.

Actually, it was the cloths; regulation uniform and appearence. When Jellico took the Enterprise in "Chain of Command", Troi was forced into uniform. I also recall regulation denying Ro the earing in another episode.

Only reason Worf had his thing on is it's probably no different than an awarded Starfleet officer wearing awards on his uniform. Plus -- don't piss off a member of a race who was at war with you for over a hundred years.

While OTOH, you don't have to care if you piss off a Bajoran, who gives a frak about them anyway, or about their culture which wearing said earring is a part of. They have to conform to the hu....I mean, Federation dress code.

This looks really bad for Starfleet. I'd rather believe that it was all just about them being pissed off at Ro.

 

[Praxius]

You know, thinking about that ... I find it amusing that Ro gets guff about a fucking earing, while Troi sits on the Bridge with massive clevage.

Massive cleavage?

She had all but an inch at most of it exposed at any given time really.... a heck of a lot less then you'd see just walking down the street today in the summer time.

To use the term "Massive" would be quite the exaggeration.

I mean sure, there was a lot of collarbone and shoulders exposed at a time... and sure... her suits often provided a bit of camel toe.... but massive cleavage?

Oh and one thing I'd like to add to the topic, is that while I see so many question or otherwise trash her presence or usefulness on the show.... imo, she contributed a heck of a lot more then what Neelix ever did for Voyager.

I mean just last night we watched "Hero Worship", "Violations", "Power Play".... and tonight I imagine we'll be moving onto "Ethics".

There's many episodes where she does play a key role.... perhaps sometimes not a big role, but a key role none the less in the overall story.

There's many times where she helps not only the crew in their troubles, but also other alien species.

There was also the episode where she lost her empathic abilities, which the episode revolved around her a decent amount, while also showing her actually helping a no-name crew member in her "office".... she was also in her office when she was helping LaForge after he was brainwashed and made into the Romulan's assassin.

Along with the other episodes I mentioned in my previous post, she also goes undercover as a Romulan, and also helped a great deal in the episode "Timescape"

I have a tendency of not liking a particular character and because of that, I also tend to overlook their contributions to a show.... I feel some might be doing a similar thing here.

Just a thought.

 

[tharpdevenport]

You picked the fluke dress she rarely every wore. Try the common grey number. Also, examine the Bridge crew of EVERY SINGLE BRIDGE CREW we've EVER SEEN.

 

[JRS]

You picked the fluke dress she rarely every wore. Try the common grey number. Also, examine the Bridge crew of EVERY SINGLE BRIDGE CREW we've EVER SEEN.

Actually she wore the green dress quite often, particulary in the 3rd and 4th season(caps from Trekcore):

And here is the grey one you mentioned:

No massive cleavages there either Im not say that she does not look sexy..but I dont really see anything there to complain about
I have seen bigger cleavages out there
But I guess most of us agree, that while the costumes Troi wore during the series where maybe not the greatest..she did look the best in that blue duty uniform

 

[Pauln6]

Troi worked better in season one for me. That severe hairdo made her look a bit more alien and she functioned as the ship's diplomatic officer on several occasions, attending landing parties with Picard. The problem was that Picard is his own man and she was rarely ever allowed to give him advice that led to his decision - maybe they thought it would weaken him as a leader if he was accepting advice from her all the time.

When they dialled it back and focused on her as a counsellor, she became something of a fifth wheel most of the time. They should have left her in a standard uniform though. Once she was back in one the writers finally sussed that she was a senior officer in addition to a psychologist (not a psychiatrist as she isn't a medical doctor) and she was allowed to spread her wings a bit.

Trek telepathy has been handled very poorly since TOS. Vulcan telepathy is cool and Miranda Jones was great. Betazoids are dreadful. If she had the ability to speak telepathically (like Callie in Blake's Seven), with occasional flashes of empathic perception that would have been far more conducive to a decent plot. But setting her up with an emotional (or in the case of Lwaxana fully telepathic) radar just makes them look intrusive and disrespectful. Once they realised what a pain Troi's empathy could be they often just ignored her character for the sake of convenience.

 

[Praxius]

You picked the fluke dress she rarely every wore. Try the common grey number. Also, examine the Bridge crew of EVERY SINGLE BRIDGE CREW we've EVER SEEN.

Granted that one wasn't worn as much as the gray or burgundy suit, but even those didn't have much more cleavage.

Besides, it was the future.... where both men and women wore dresses and religious modesty wasn't the norm..... also, since Betazoids had a tendency of going nude in their weddings, they obviously didn't have an issue with exposing their bodies and considering that notion, imo, Troi was quite conservative

....... Trek telepathy has been handled very poorly since TOS. Vulcan telepathy is cool and Miranda Jones was great. Betazoids are dreadful. If she had the ability to speak telepathically (like Callie in Blake's Seven), with occasional flashes of empathic perception that would have been far more conducive to a decent plot. But setting her up with an emotional (or in the case of Lwaxana fully telepathic) radar just makes them look intrusive and disrespectful. Once they realised what a pain Troi's empathy could be they often just ignored her character for the sake of convenience.

I never really saw it as intrusive, anymore then one of us reading facial expressions.... perfect example of the comparison would be the show "Lie to Me" which they show many of the tell tale signs of how to read someone.

Most of the time when she detected someone's emotions, their emotions were pretty blatantly obvious based on their expressions, wording and body movements.... and there were many times when she'd say something like "I sense that you're upset" where I'd think to myself, "No sh*t Sherlock, they're yelling and tossing things, wtf was your first clue?"

 

[Volvic]

Trek telepathy has been handled very poorly since TOS. Vulcan telepathy is cool and Miranda Jones was great. Betazoids are dreadful. If she had the ability to speak telepathically (like Callie in Blake's Seven), with occasional flashes of empathic perception that would have been far more conducive to a decent plot. But setting her up with an emotional (or in the case of Lwaxana fully telepathic) radar just makes them look intrusive and disrespectful. Once they realised what a pain Troi's empathy could be they often just ignored her character for the sake of convenience.

The main problem with trek telepathy is that outside of Vulcans, the tpb never really went into detail about how each species used their gift.

I mean was Troi's empathic sense something that she could even switch off? Was it like one of us accidently overhearing something and not being able to do anything about it? Did she have mental shields that blocked some of the emotions of others out? How could she tell what was going on in the head of another ship that was sitting a few killometres away from the enterprise?

I really like the idea of Betazoids but they were terribly underwritten. I still think that they would have been best served if Betazed had been either netural or hostile. Scary angelic people, that know what you're going to do before you do. Brrrrr.

Makes a nice change for the constant swaggering of the usual suspects.

 

[jadzia_dax2369]

hey fellow trekkers


i liked troi,


my fave moment was in skin of evil, when she was a romulan spy. (Looks good as a romulan)

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

my fave moment was in skin of evil, when she was a romulan spy. (Looks good as a romulan)

"Skin of Evil"? She wasn't a Romulan in that episode. Maybe you mean "Face of the Enemy"?

 

[milo bloom]

When they dialled it back and focused on her as a counsellor, she became something of a fifth wheel most of the time. They should have left her in a standard uniform though. Once she was back in one the writers finally sussed that she was a senior officer in addition to a psychologist (not a psychiatrist as she isn't a medical doctor) and she was allowed to spread her wings a bit.

You know, I've never really paid attention to the changes in the writers, and now you've got me wondering if that knowledge actually slipped out of the collective consciousness of the writing staff until someone remembered so Jellico would have a reason to yell at her. So after that reminder, that's when they started writing her a smidge better?

 

[Smellincoffee]

I remember reading somewhere -- the TNG Companion, maybe -- that the Enterprise-D was intended as a ship operating in the furthest reaches of the Federation, exploring the unknown on an extended mission. As they could expect few returns "home", having a counselor on board to tend to emotional crises would come in handy for the same reason having a medical staff is useful.

 

[Unicron]

I mean was Troi's empathic sense something that she could even switch off? Was it like one of us accidently overhearing something and not being able to do anything about it? Did she have mental shields that blocked some of the emotions of others out? How could she tell what was going on in the head of another ship that was sitting a few killometres away from the enterprise?

While I'd have to rewatch the ep again and listen to the exact dialogue, "Tin Man" suggested something along these lines. It's stated that the telepathy isn't switched on at birth, coming into force around puberty so the child has a chance to learn how to use it. Tam Elbran was a rare exception, having been forced to spend his life without the means (either biological or mental discipline) to shut out the thoughts of others. No way to turn it off. "Dark Page" also established the concept of the "metaconscious" in the Betazoid psyche, as a shield to protect their minds from psychological trauma.

I remember reading somewhere -- the TNG Companion, maybe -- that the Enterprise-D was intended as a ship operating in the furthest reaches of the Federation, exploring the unknown on an extended mission. As they could expect few returns "home", having a counselor on board to tend to emotional crises would come in handy for the same reason having a medical staff is useful.

Yes, in the early conceptualizations that was one role for the ship. That is why there were families aboard initially, and the role that eventually became Troi's was more of a political officer. If the captain encountered an unusual culture or situation and was not entirely sure how to proceed, this officer was to be the Federation's voice and offer their assumed perspective. "Conspiracy" seems to reference this idea, with Picard stating the ship has been on the outer rim of explored space and the admirals saying it was "unusual" for the ship to return to Earth.

 

[A beaker full of death]

None of the ship positions (other than helm, captain and XO) were particularly well thought out at the time the show started. Ops? wtf is ops? Why does the security guard run communications? Who was down in the boiler room making the ship go?