The one thing about Star Trek II that always irks me...
- Thread starter Quinton O'Connor
- Start date
But McCoy didn't do anything but wave a scanner over Chekov. He was just a spectator to the eel's spontaneous departure.
Are you suggesting that the eel did damage on its way out that would've been fatal if left untreated? That it's normal for the eels to leave on their own and the victims die afterward?
or it left a few babies behind.Khan had no way of knowing that the infamous "Chekov scream" vibrates at frequencies that the eel cannot endure.
It vas Chekov's superior Russian immune system. Ve all know how effective Russians are at repelling inwaders.
I was operating on the assumption that the eel causes damage while inside the ear prior to or during departure that will be fatal if (inadequately) treated (off the top of my head, perhaps it leaves behind slow-acting toxins). In the case of those on Ceti Alpha, medical equipment wasn't available to diagnose and/or repair the injuries. Of course, given that med tech on Ceti Alpha was in short supply, we shouldn't necessarily take Khan's description of how the eel behaves at face value...not that taking anything Khan says at face value is a particularly good idea.
In Chekov's case all we -see- McCoy do is scan him, but there's nothing to suggest McCoy doesn't further treat Chekov. Indeed, isn't Chekov taken to Sickbay as soon as the team's retrieved from Regulus? Even when he shows up on the bridge much later he clearly isn't at 100%. Given the state of medical technology by this point in the future that suggests that under the best of circumstances the Ceti Eels tend to cause extensive damage.
In Chekov's case all we -see- McCoy do is scan him, but there's nothing to suggest McCoy doesn't further treat Chekov. Indeed, isn't Chekov taken to Sickbay as soon as the team's retrieved from Regulus? Even when he shows up on the bridge much later he clearly isn't at 100%. Given the state of medical technology by this point in the future that suggests that under the best of circumstances the Ceti Eels tend to cause extensive damage.
^Well, if you're saying the damage is gradual and death occurs after the eel leaves, then yes, that makes sense that McCoy would've saved him afterward. But the impression I've had all these years is that the eel caused death while inside the body, that fatality was a direct result of its growth within the body crushing the brainstem and it didn't leave until after the host died and ceased providing it with nutrients. So you can see, going from that, how its departure from Chekov before death seemed arbitrary to me. It didn't occur to me to look at it the way you're suggesting, but your proposal does make sense.
I just checked to see how Greg Cox dealt with the eels in his novel To Reign in Hell: The Exile of Khan Noonien Singh. It says that the eels leave the body "only when they are fully developed or when the hosts expire." Based on that, it could go either way. Chekov's eel must've simply reached full maturity before it killed him -- though you could certainly still be right that the damage it caused would be fatal if left untreated.
Still, that's all extrapolation after the fact. If you go strictly by what's in the movie, Khan says the eels kill their hosts, then Chekov's eel spontaneously leaves him and he survives. In strictly in-film terms, it still feels like an arbitrary reversal, saying a character is doomed and then having him survive with no overt explanation. So I still call it a script flaw, even if it can be rationalized away after the fact.
I just checked to see how Greg Cox dealt with the eels in his novel To Reign in Hell: The Exile of Khan Noonien Singh. It says that the eels leave the body "only when they are fully developed or when the hosts expire." Based on that, it could go either way. Chekov's eel must've simply reached full maturity before it killed him -- though you could certainly still be right that the damage it caused would be fatal if left untreated.
Still, that's all extrapolation after the fact. If you go strictly by what's in the movie, Khan says the eels kill their hosts, then Chekov's eel spontaneously leaves him and he survives. In strictly in-film terms, it still feels like an arbitrary reversal, saying a character is doomed and then having him survive with no overt explanation. So I still call it a script flaw, even if it can be rationalized away after the fact.
kkozoriz1
Fleet Captain
Khan wouldn't seem so menacing if he said "You see, their young enter through the ears and wrap themselves around the cerebral cortex. This has the effect of rendering the victim extremely susceptible to suggestion. Later as they grow follows madness and a 50% chance of death."
Notice the the original quote that he doesn't directly say anything about the eel having to be in the body to cause death. Madness follows their growth and then death follows after that. Seeing the blood that leaked out of Chekov's ear when the eel left I can imagine that there's a fair bit of damage. McCoy does stay with Checkov through the rest of the scene until David takes everyone to the cave. Perhaps he stopped the bleeding temporarily. During the chat between Kirk and Carol Chekov is seen to be holding a cloth to his ear, indicating that he's conscious.
Once they beam back to the Enterprise McCoy says that he's taking "this bunch" to sickbay. Presumably he performed surgery on Chekov at that point. Chekov was walking under his own power when he left the transporter room. I can imagine that McCoy did manage to temporarily halt the damage until he could fix it properly.
Notice the the original quote that he doesn't directly say anything about the eel having to be in the body to cause death. Madness follows their growth and then death follows after that. Seeing the blood that leaked out of Chekov's ear when the eel left I can imagine that there's a fair bit of damage. McCoy does stay with Checkov through the rest of the scene until David takes everyone to the cave. Perhaps he stopped the bleeding temporarily. During the chat between Kirk and Carol Chekov is seen to be holding a cloth to his ear, indicating that he's conscious.
Once they beam back to the Enterprise McCoy says that he's taking "this bunch" to sickbay. Presumably he performed surgery on Chekov at that point. Chekov was walking under his own power when he left the transporter room. I can imagine that McCoy did manage to temporarily halt the damage until he could fix it properly.
THe "KHAN" shout struck me wrong even when I saw it in a theater during its initial release.
But I get tired of people riffing on Shatner. The simple fact is that the director must have wanted such a performance. Meyer could have just said, "Bill, no. Let's do another take, and take it down a notch."
There obviously were ample opportunities for retakes, and Meyer further emphasized it with a dolly-out from the planet, plus a reverb repeat in post.
I blame Meyer for not understanding Kirk, not Shatner.
But I get tired of people riffing on Shatner. The simple fact is that the director must have wanted such a performance. Meyer could have just said, "Bill, no. Let's do another take, and take it down a notch."
There obviously were ample opportunities for retakes, and Meyer further emphasized it with a dolly-out from the planet, plus a reverb repeat in post.
I blame Meyer for not understanding Kirk, not Shatner.
Yeah. What makes that scene doubly odd is that what you're describing there is exactly how Meyer did operate everywhere else in the film. According to him, Shatner kept overplaying everything, so he did take after take after take until Shatner got tired, stopped trying so hard, and gave a more natural, understated performance. In that context, something as overplayed as "KHAAAAAANNNN!!!!" seems deeply incongruous.
If it weren't for "Kh-a-a-a-n!" would anyone other than hardcore fans remember this movie at all? 
If it weren't for "Kh-a-a-a-n!" would anyone other than hardcore fans remember this movie at all?
I dunno, those naval bell bottoms were pretty memorable...
I always thought it had to do with Chekov fighting the eel's influence to be susceptible to influence. This caused a change in his brain chemistry that was distasteful to the eel so that is why it left.
One man's incongruous is another man's deeply awesome. I personally love the fact that Kirk's head vibrates for several seconds before he erupts into the scream, and the fact that his scream echoes into space. That's how badass James T. Kirk is. Let's see Chuck Norris (or Captain Robau) top that.
Nicholas Meyer is a big opera fan, so it's not surprising to me that he has big, operatic moments in the film. It gives the quieter moments some nice contrast.
And as to why Chekov's Ceti Eel left his ear canal while Terrell's killed him, it obviously read Walter Koenig's contract.
Honestly, I'd say that the truth was probably something closer to this. Who knows? Maybe if Terrell hadn't phasered himself into oblivion, his eel would have left him a minute later.
^It's a nice idea, but I can't buy it. I mean, Khan's people were genetic superhumans, bred for their strong will and "superior ambition" as well as physical superiority. If Ceti Eels could be driven out simply by willpower, then Khan's people would've suffered a far, far lower fatality rate than the 100 percent implied by Khan's dialogue.
I suppose you could say that Khan was lying about the "death" part to scare Terrell and Chekov, but that seems arbitrary.
I suppose you could say that Khan was lying about the "death" part to scare Terrell and Chekov, but that seems arbitrary.
Brilliant.
Similar threads
