The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

[mswood]

Let's just hope they go back and eliminate all footage with the 4 foot model... replacing it with a CGI model they used for the saucer seperation, the shot with the BoP and the Warp out scene from "The Inner Light".

I've read things like this from some people here, and all I have to ask is, why would they do that? That's WAY more work than they are supposed to be doing for this project. Unless it's VFX that needs to be recomposited or a damaged scene that needs to be reshot, they're not just going to replace the four-footer just because they think some fans didn't like it. I don't like all the re-uses of the movie models, but they're not going to replace those just because I don't like them.

Well, because the 4 foot model simply looks bad on screen. It looked bad in SD and will look horrible in HD. It's almost as bad as the Playmates Toy which was released in 1992...

It's really not a big deal to replace those shots. They can keep the pacing and the dynamic, just redo it with a CGI model that matches the 6 foot model in shape (I do not count missing windows ).

I have to disagree. I hated, hated the six foot model until the film generations, because that was the first time that I could actually see real detail on that filmed model. With Generations, especially the new footage, I could appreciate shape and detail, that I couldn't in the first 7o or so episodes.

This project, besides Generations is the first real time I enjoy the six footer more then the four footer because I can actually see the detail that was on the original film elements that I couldnt see before.

 

[RAMA]

Higher res copy of the new German trailer up at TrekCore!

http://tng.trekcore.com/bluray/index.html#s1trail_de

Plus - full translation into English, and some points of commentary!

Great work as always!! Thanks for posting

Love the dubbing on Geordi, "Fire!!" Should get that guy to redub LeVar in english just for yucks!

The Batris explosion does look pretty damn good in motion.

And my god, do I love the look of the 6-footer... such a shame that the realities of TV production left us with the 4-footer for so much of latter-day TNG

Can't wait to see more!! I'm way more excited by this then I ever thought I would be!!!

Yeah the explosion looks even better in motion!

 

[gaghyogi49]

Most likely the last comparison shot before the Blu-ray is released tomorrow/on Tuesday:

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/105450

The image of the village from the Blu-ray is from the amazon.de page, it's not an HD image, however. The final image quality will be much better, this shot only serves to illustrate how the Ressikan village, the river and the mountains in the background were recreated for the BD release.

 

[Jefferies]

Geez, all this vitriol over different models of the Enterprise. Does this really matter that much to you? Some hate, the 4fter some hate the 6fter some hate the CGI version. It's all just hate hate hate. Same with the stupid explosions! Can't you just be grateful they are re-mastering this show in the face of all those odds people were moaning on about just a few months ago? Just get a grip already. Seriously!

(To those who aren't bashing and whining just ignore my post.)

 

[Jefferies]

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/105450

Interesting screen-compare gaghyogi49. They seem to have replaced the matte painting of the village as well as the valley and even some of the cliff Picard is standing on or is this due to a shift in camera perperspective from two not exactly alligned frames?

 

[mswood]

Geez, all this vitriol over different models of the Enterprise. Does this really matter that much to you? Some hate, the 4fter some hate the 6fter some hate the CGI version. It's all just hate hate hate. Same with the stupid explosions! Can't you just be grateful they are re-mastering this show in the face of all those odds people were moaning on about just a few months ago? Just get a grip already. Seriously!

(To those who aren't bashing and whining just ignore my post.)

Perhaps dislike would be a more appropriate term.

But Like I mentioned above as much as I disliked the 6 ft based on my viewing experience at home. Here (so far) it looks really quite good. As for the 4 footer that I generally really liked when viewing originally, there are going to be certain angles that do really highlight the change in design (and unfortunately one of them is reused a lot). While many others are shot from far, more flattering angles.

 

[trekker670]

My amazon order just updated. Expected delivery, Feb. 2...

 

[RAMA]

My amazon order just updated. Expected delivery, Feb. 2...

Mine still says Jan 31st

 

[22 Stars]

Ya mine shows shipped, 1/31 expected deliery. If it comes tomorrow I'll be happy.

 

[RAMA]

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/105450

Interesting screen-compare gaghyogi49. They seem to have replaced the matte painting of the village as well as the valley and even some of the cliff Picard is standing on or is this due to a shift in camera perperspective from two not exactly alligned frames?

Yeah before it was from a vacation still of Dan Curry's, quickly cobbled together. It was the first "digital" matte they used on the show. This new one looks more polished.

Note the huge difference in the foreground...looks like they changed that original plate a lot to fit in the rest of the matte.

 

[Trekker4747]

Well, because the 4 foot model simply looks bad on screen.

It looks different. It doesn't look bad. If you had gotten the 4 footer first and the 6 foot second you'd complain that the 6ft was too smooth and plain.

No, the 4-footer looks bad. It's noticeably thicker on its edges (particularly around the deflector housing) and the raised panel lines on the saucer and around the lifeboats makes the ship look an uneven and like it was put together with Legos.

Just checked Amazon, mine doesn't show that it has shipped yet but the EDD is still Tuesday but checking, it looks like there's a "fulfillment center" in Coffeville, KS (a literal blip on the) which is about a 3 hour drive from where I am so, I guess, it doesn't need to leave too soon in order for it to get to me in time.

On the discussion above, it looks to me like the village matte has been replaced with a CGI matte to make the village more realistic and has obviously shifted the perspective down to perhaps a more realistic angle.

 

[Hober Mallow]

God, I don't even have the sampler yet and I'm already thinking about how long the wait for season one is going to be.

 

[Trekker4747]

I know, I'm all excited for this but then I realize I'm only getting a handful of episodes! I'll have blown my wad on this thing in one afternoon like a teenager first discovering masturbation!

 

[Mark 2000]

No, the 4-footer looks bad. It's noticeably thicker on its edges (particularly around the deflector housing) and the raised panel lines on the saucer and around the lifeboats makes the ship look an uneven and like it was put together with Legos.

It's certainly your right to pick apart the minor details of something that for most people would go unnoticed and proclaim it "ugly". I still think in the absence of the 6 foot model from the canon you would love the 4 foot one just fine.

 

[Gepard]

I still think in the absence of the 6 foot model from the canon you would love the 4 foot one just fine.

You're probably right. That's not the reality we live in, however, and since we do have the 6-footer for comparison, I agree that the 4-footer doesn't quite measure up.

That said, I don't want CBS-D to replace it. All that CGI would look worse than the model shots.

 

[GNDN]

Once again it seems that making comparisons and having a preference is being labeled 'vitriol' and being rather blown out of proportion.

In my opinion, the 6-foot model was built and photographed beautifully. In comparison, the 4-footer, while perhaps filmed to demonstrate more maneuverability, simultaneously lost much of the grace and elegance of the original model. It too, however, will look much more impressive in HD.

I will personally appreciate both on their merits and look forward to enjoying seeing ALL of TNG in HD while always preferring the look of ILM's 6-footer for all the reasons stated.

 

[mswood]

Yet neither does the two footer match the 6ft model, yet almost no one ever really complains about its use in the production.

Which frankly just seems odd, for the number of posters who strongly dislike the 4ft for not being a match for the 6ft model.

I know, I'm all excited for this but then I realize I'm only getting a handful of episodes! I'll have blown my wad on this thing in one afternoon like a teenager first discovering masturbation!

Seriously, so true.

Remember when Voyage Home came out on VHS and we got the preview for TNG? How many times did you watch that?

Probably a thousand times here.

 

[mswood]

I still think in the absence of the 6 foot model from the canon you would love the 4 foot one just fine.

You're probably right. That's not the reality we live in, however, and since we do have the 6-footer for comparison, I agree that the 4-footer doesn't quite measure up.

That said, I don't want CBS-D to replace it. All that CGI would look worse than the model shots.

While I also don't want original shots replaced with CGI (unless necessary), I don't agree that CGI makes them look worse. It can, and we have had examples of this with TOS for example, but I actually prefer the shot at warp to the original footage (so far), and I also strongly prefer the ship with the Bird of Prey (no matter how it was created) far better then the original creation.

I hope, that with them apparently (based on what we have heard and what little we have seen of the 178 hours of TNG) with them not having to churn out full episodes of CGI, that the rendering (a huge, huge problem with TOS remastered) will be given a proper amount of time.

Hell even the heads of the Special FX departments will admit some episodes had poor work done on them.

Really so far I only have a few minor complaints about what we have been told and shown.

I was really hoping to get improved Matte Painting (something TOS did exceptionally well at).

That we would see some replacement of scenes that were previously fully used (full stock shots).

And that the occasional glaring scale errors would get tweaked.

But the vast majority of what I have seen I love, love, love.

 

[davejames]

I have to disagree. I hated, hated the six foot model until the film generations, because that was the first time that I could actually see real detail on that filmed model. With Generations, especially the new footage, I could appreciate shape and detail, that I couldn't in the first 7o or so episodes.

This project, besides Generations is the first real time I enjoy the six footer more then the four footer because I can actually see the detail that was on the original film elements that I couldnt see before.

Yeah I was kind of the same way. I always thought the 6-footer looked way too plain and simple compared to the later, more detailed model. Now that I see it in HD, I have a whole new appreciation for it.

Although I still don't see how anyone can hate the 4-footer with incredible shots like these:
http://ds9.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/6x06/sacraficeofangels091.jpg
http://trekcore.com/gallery/albums/ds9ships/jemhadar_261.jpg

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Although I still don't see how anyone can hate the 4-footer with incredible shots like these:
http://ds9.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/6x06/sacraficeofangels091.jpg
http://trekcore.com/gallery/albums/ds9ships/jemhadar_261.jpg

Because it's an ugly model that doesn't match the actual design of the ship. Because someone found an inoffensive angle on it when its moving fast and blowing shit up doesn't change that.