Just a question: where are you putting The Center Cannot Hold? Or is that later in 2267, which would place it during TOS's second season?
--Sran
The Great Chronological Run-Through
- Thread starter Deranged Nasat
- Start date
Just a question: where are you putting The Center Cannot Hold? Or is that later in 2267, which would place it during TOS's second season?
--Sran
Good point. At the very least, it will be fun. And I can't let the original Nasat go unglorified, can I?
Except that some tales have to take place a bit earlier. The Delta Triangle incident needs to take place before SCE: Where Time Stands Still, which needs to take place before What Judgments Come.
Second season; it's after the Organian Peace Treaty. It's not too far down from the end of what I posted up there.
This is a thing I don't see a lot of people cite, but I think the events of "The Menagerie" make literally no sense if "Court Martial" just took place. In "The Menagerie," the Enterprise has clearly not been at or even near Starbase 11 for months. ("You don't know? You actually don't know what's happened to Captain Pike? There's been subspace chatter about it for months.") Though in general I prefer production order for TOS, in this specific instance, I place "The Menagerie" out of sequence, a little earlier, after "Miri." (The specifics are somewhat arbitrary.)
I think it would be a good idea to at least append to the relevant episodes discussion of Forgotten History's handling of their events, since they sometimes change how we see those episodes.
Also, I am definitely in favor of including the animated series. Forgotten History interweaves them with its narrative, so it would be a shame to leave them out.
Also, I am definitely in favor of including the animated series. Forgotten History interweaves them with its narrative, so it would be a shame to leave them out.
A piece of info for everyone: the historian's notes for Seekers - Second Nature and Seekers - Point of Divergence say that they take place in August 2269, "a couple of months" after "Turnabout Intruder" (presumably June) and "approximately six months" after the climax of Storming Heaven and the framing story of In Tempest's Wake (presumably February).
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Deranged Nasat, have you considered reading/using the Alan Dean Foster novelizations of TAS in place of watching the actual episodes in your Run-Through?
I thought you may do something similar to this idea when you reached the movie era -- plugging in the movie novelizations of II, III, and IV instead of (or in addition to) watching these movies -- since a lot of modern Treklit uses McIntyre's novelizations as almost "supplemental" canon for Saavik, Starfleet HQ, aliens seen, etc.
I thought you may do something similar to this idea when you reached the movie era -- plugging in the movie novelizations of II, III, and IV instead of (or in addition to) watching these movies -- since a lot of modern Treklit uses McIntyre's novelizations as almost "supplemental" canon for Saavik, Starfleet HQ, aliens seen, etc.
The only other instance was in the Myriad Universes story "The Chimes at Midnight."
--Sran
That's neat to know it makes an appearance even if just in a Myrid Universe story. I have that in my very large to read stack, so I'll get to it eventually.
Oh, on the subject of your upcoming entries, Nasat: the one thing I'd say is that Open Secrets you might want to divvy up across the year. It actually spans most of 2266, referencing events every so often proceeding forward through Kirk's mission (Balance of Terror (chapter 25), River of Blood (chapter 31), and Arena (chapter 51) all get specific mentions at points soon after they happen in the timeline) which might warrant a more divided approach.
Thanks, Idran, good catch. That definitely warrants moving Open Secrets forward a bit (I'll do that rather than try and divide it up like I have Precipice, since unlike that book it doesn't split into pre-determined sections).
Okay, so the updated schedule is this:
"Things Fall Apart" (Mere Anarchy)
"Where No Man Has Gone Before" (TOS 1)
Harbinger
Summon The Thunder
Reap The Whirlwind
"Hard News" (Declassified)
"The Landing Party" (Constellations)
"The Corbomite Maneuver" (TOS 1)
"Mudd’s Women" (TOS 1)
"The Enemy Within" (TOS 1)
"The Man Trap" (TOS 1)
"The Naked Time" (TOS 1)
"Charlie X" (TOS 1)
"The First Artefact" (The Brave and The Bold, book one)
"Balance of Terror" (TOS 1)
"What Are Little Girls Made Of" (TOS 1)
The Edge of The Sword
Killing Blow
River of Blood
"Dagger of the Mind" (TOS 1)
"Miri" (TOS 1)
"The Conscience of the King" (TOS 1)
"The Galileo Seven" (TOS 1)
"Court Martial" (TOS 1)
"The Menagerie", parts one and two (TOS 1)
"Shore Leave" (TOS 1)
"The Squire of Gothos" (TOS 1)
"Arena" (TOS 1)
"The Alternative Factor" (TOS 1)
"Tomorrow is Yesterday" (TOS 1) (Plus relevant fragment of Forgotten History)
Open Secrets, sans prologue and epilogue
"Official Record" (Constellations)
"The Return of The Archons" (TOS 1)
Foundations, chapter 10-16
"The Avenger" (Enterprise Logs)
"A Taste of Armageddon" (TOS 1)
"Space Seed" (TOS 1)
"This Side of Paradise" (TOS 1)
"The Devil In The Dark" (TOS 1)
Seeds of Rage
Where Sea Meets Sky
Demands of Honor
Sacrifices of War
"Errand of Mercy" (TOS 1)
Open Secrets, prologue and epilogue
Precipice, part one and first interlude
"The City on the Edge of Forever" (TOS 1) (Plus relevant fragment of Forgotten History)
"Operation: Annihilate" (TOS 1)
I agree. When I was working on a TOS Chronology, I once arranged the episodes in Stardate order, just to see what it would look like. I gave up on the idea when I saw that "This Side of Paradise" and "Amok Time" were right next to each other. Since both of those episodes depend on the novelty of Spock acting more emotional than usual, putting one right after the other would make the second feel a bit too much like, "Oh, here we go again."
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^Stardates were conceived as a way of giving the impression of a chronological scheme while conveying no actual chronological information of any kind. The makers of TOS wanted to be deliberately vague about when the show was set, so they intentionally used meaningless numbers as their dating system.
There's a bit in The Making of Star Trek where Roddenberry offers a handwave saying that stardates are calculated based on a vessel's position and velocity in space and thus are different at different places -- which is inspired by the real relativistic principle that simultaneity does not exist and time can move at different rates for observers in different parts of the universe, although it doesn't really reconcile with the use of warp drive and the fact that characters in the shows never seem to disagree with each other over how much time has elapsed since a past event.
There's a bit in The Making of Star Trek where Roddenberry offers a handwave saying that stardates are calculated based on a vessel's position and velocity in space and thus are different at different places -- which is inspired by the real relativistic principle that simultaneity does not exist and time can move at different rates for observers in different parts of the universe, although it doesn't really reconcile with the use of warp drive and the fact that characters in the shows never seem to disagree with each other over how much time has elapsed since a past event.
Mere Anarchy: "Things Fall Apart"
For the purposes of this project, this is our introduction to the Federation's Prime Directive, the non-interference law which it trumpets as its highest principle. It was, so far as we can tell, introduced with noble intentions and then embedded deep in the Federation legal bureaucracy in a manner that reduces it to a steely concrete reality with a conservative and reductionist slant, while officers, diplomats and explorers out in the field do their best to accommodate both it and reality. I suppose that's what happens when vague ideals with complex justifications are required to pass into law. The text also introduces some of the differing angles we might take on this idea of the Prime Directive, from the stated desire to protect emerging spacefaring powers from imposition and exploitation (however these are defined or, more frequently, not defined), and what it describes as more cynical interpretations that present the Directive as the official justification for the Federation wringing its hands uselessly and looking sombre when it doesn't really, for various reasons, want to extend itself or get involved. The story doesn't really do much with the discussion, but I suppose as an introduction to the Prime Directive in (in)action it works well enough.
It also, I'll note, draws attention to a inherent and interesting tension within the Federation - between its expanding frontier, dominated by colonists, explorers and entrepreneurs who need the flexibility to meet everything the galaxy presents them with, and the Federation core, which is a stable and prosperous superpower with a comfy life-style and a tendency, it seems, to spit out overbearing commissioners and ministers with nice suits and poor tolerance for deviation from The Rules.
So, the Prime Directive is introduced in all its Primacy. It is (at least since the Federation legal bureaucracy got their hands on it) both a stifling imposition on the Federation's own people and a fearfully hands-off law that seeks to retain an unrealistic and even neglectful sterility in all interactions with other worlds. I suppose people in the Federation leadership, if they're self-aware enough, might view their policy toward less technologically sophisticated cultures in a manner akin to cleaning. One doesn't clean to eliminate dirt and debris, of course, because that's impossible, and life will lead to it accumulating again in no time. Instead, you clean to keep the amount of it down, to prevent it building up to unhygienic or unsightly levels. I imagine a true understanding of the Prime Directive involves an awareness of its futility, that you're undertaking the pretence at opposing having a distorting effect on the peoples you interact with when obviously you know you can't help but have one. Often though, like neurotic housecleaners, some in the Federation think the goal is to eliminate interference and imposition entirely rather than simply keep it manageable, and would rather not speak to developing cultures like the Payav at all.
How this uneasy reality came about we're not yet sure of, although hints are being planted, I think, in Rise of the Federation. Still, since the Federation was required to integrate multiple approaches and perspectives in a way that hadn't previously been attempted on anywhere near the scale, I suppose it's no surprise that the results are often awkward. I suppose they did the best they could to apply a uniform standard when everyone wanted to approach things differently.
Moving on, as well as being the first real Prime Directive story, this is the first Mere Anarchy book. If there's a problem with Mere Anarchy, it's that the Payav and Mestiko aren't very engaging in and of themselves. The idea of the series - of following a planet through a devastating cataclysm and its rebuilding attempts, physical and political, as it finds its place in interstellar society - is a good one. It's just that Mestiko has little to recommend it other than the events it moves through. I can only assume that it was decided to make the afflicted race generic so as to emphasise the impact of those events, to make Mestiko an "everyman planet" and perhaps also to suggest a parallel to real-life Humanity (For the nation of Gelta, read USA, for Zamestaad, read UN, etc.). Still, I'd enjoy this series more if the Payav culture was more interesting and defined in greater detail.
Continuity
After being mentioned in A Less Perfect Union (having been annexed by the Klingons in that timeline), Mestiko is properly introduced. I should also note the introduction of Raya elMora, the most important Mestiko inhabitant. Again, she's basically just the generic well-meaning politician, but harmless enough.
Gary Mitchell is introduced.
Dr. Piper has announced his impending retirement. Amazingly, he'll actually manage to do so rather than dying.
Next Time: "Where In Matter Of Fact Some Men Have Gone Before Because You're Investigating And Then Recreating Their Experience In Every Way And In Both Obvious Senses Of The Title's Meaning".
Or in other words: we're here! TOS.
For the purposes of this project, this is our introduction to the Federation's Prime Directive, the non-interference law which it trumpets as its highest principle. It was, so far as we can tell, introduced with noble intentions and then embedded deep in the Federation legal bureaucracy in a manner that reduces it to a steely concrete reality with a conservative and reductionist slant, while officers, diplomats and explorers out in the field do their best to accommodate both it and reality. I suppose that's what happens when vague ideals with complex justifications are required to pass into law. The text also introduces some of the differing angles we might take on this idea of the Prime Directive, from the stated desire to protect emerging spacefaring powers from imposition and exploitation (however these are defined or, more frequently, not defined), and what it describes as more cynical interpretations that present the Directive as the official justification for the Federation wringing its hands uselessly and looking sombre when it doesn't really, for various reasons, want to extend itself or get involved. The story doesn't really do much with the discussion, but I suppose as an introduction to the Prime Directive in (in)action it works well enough.
It also, I'll note, draws attention to a inherent and interesting tension within the Federation - between its expanding frontier, dominated by colonists, explorers and entrepreneurs who need the flexibility to meet everything the galaxy presents them with, and the Federation core, which is a stable and prosperous superpower with a comfy life-style and a tendency, it seems, to spit out overbearing commissioners and ministers with nice suits and poor tolerance for deviation from The Rules.
So, the Prime Directive is introduced in all its Primacy. It is (at least since the Federation legal bureaucracy got their hands on it) both a stifling imposition on the Federation's own people and a fearfully hands-off law that seeks to retain an unrealistic and even neglectful sterility in all interactions with other worlds. I suppose people in the Federation leadership, if they're self-aware enough, might view their policy toward less technologically sophisticated cultures in a manner akin to cleaning. One doesn't clean to eliminate dirt and debris, of course, because that's impossible, and life will lead to it accumulating again in no time. Instead, you clean to keep the amount of it down, to prevent it building up to unhygienic or unsightly levels. I imagine a true understanding of the Prime Directive involves an awareness of its futility, that you're undertaking the pretence at opposing having a distorting effect on the peoples you interact with when obviously you know you can't help but have one. Often though, like neurotic housecleaners, some in the Federation think the goal is to eliminate interference and imposition entirely rather than simply keep it manageable, and would rather not speak to developing cultures like the Payav at all.
How this uneasy reality came about we're not yet sure of, although hints are being planted, I think, in Rise of the Federation. Still, since the Federation was required to integrate multiple approaches and perspectives in a way that hadn't previously been attempted on anywhere near the scale, I suppose it's no surprise that the results are often awkward. I suppose they did the best they could to apply a uniform standard when everyone wanted to approach things differently.
Moving on, as well as being the first real Prime Directive story, this is the first Mere Anarchy book. If there's a problem with Mere Anarchy, it's that the Payav and Mestiko aren't very engaging in and of themselves. The idea of the series - of following a planet through a devastating cataclysm and its rebuilding attempts, physical and political, as it finds its place in interstellar society - is a good one. It's just that Mestiko has little to recommend it other than the events it moves through. I can only assume that it was decided to make the afflicted race generic so as to emphasise the impact of those events, to make Mestiko an "everyman planet" and perhaps also to suggest a parallel to real-life Humanity (For the nation of Gelta, read USA, for Zamestaad, read UN, etc.). Still, I'd enjoy this series more if the Payav culture was more interesting and defined in greater detail.
Continuity
After being mentioned in A Less Perfect Union (having been annexed by the Klingons in that timeline), Mestiko is properly introduced. I should also note the introduction of Raya elMora, the most important Mestiko inhabitant. Again, she's basically just the generic well-meaning politician, but harmless enough.
Gary Mitchell is introduced.
Dr. Piper has announced his impending retirement. Amazingly, he'll actually manage to do so rather than dying.
Next Time: "Where In Matter Of Fact Some Men Have Gone Before Because You're Investigating And Then Recreating Their Experience In Every Way And In Both Obvious Senses Of The Title's Meaning".
Or in other words: we're here! TOS.
Hahaha, man, that is the first time I ever really thought about that title.
"Where No Man Has Gone Before"
While I didn't think it quite as good as "The Cage", this was still a strong story. It had purpose and a depth of meaning that elevates it considerably beyond the shallow piece it could have been going by the story outline. It's obvious that there was a thematic intent behind this. It's a thoughtful speculative piece first and a mad superman threat story a distinct second.
It would be interesting to speculate precisely what was happening in Mitchell's mind and in the minds of those who change. Was their human brain structure leading them to retain their original social and emotional connections to their fellows, while the ability or capacity of those fellows to provide stimulation or input on anywhere near the level they need is now non-existent? That might mean that rather than simply ignoring or discarding his former comrades as unimportant, Mitchell retains a focus on them and is sensitive to their means of relating to him; therefore he takes their limitations, it would seem, as an affront. He's now unable to see them as anything other than useless irritations and targets
of resentment, even before they try to kill him. (After they start trying to kill him, he seems to take it personally in spite of agreeing with Spock's assessment that it's a dispassionate logical decision). Seeing someone as an insect doesn't mean you want to squash the insect, after all - it means you won't shed any tears if you do, and won't hesitate should it serve your interests (you also won't take it personally when it bites you) - but there shouldn't be any reason why you'd particularly want to. But seeing someone to whom you're irrevocably bound to (wired to socially) as an insect; that must be quite intolerable. Who are you, insect, to buzz around in my conceptual space, in my sense of self and its relation to the wider universe that has just blossomed into something a thousand times more complex and sophisticated? All this knowledge has opened up to him, and yet his vision and power is contained, as Kirk stresses, within a human vessel, and that human brain is wired in certain ways with certain priorities. And it's very clear that this energy/power is to all intents and purposes "possessing" Mitchell and Dehner; when it recedes, their original selves remerge. The beings they become are both an explosive expansion of their personality refracted through a medium of great power and knowledge, and a lodging of that power within them - it's as though they are inside it and it is inside them simultaneously.
The mystery as to what's occurring psychologically is of course more important to the story than any explanation for the barrier (the physics of which is Space Magic, of course); especially so given that Dehner is a psychiatrist. I like that the precise balance of the multiple explanations for her retaining more of her original ethics than Mitchell is uncertain. We can easily comprehend the factors that play into it, but not the balance. It's likely in part because she received a lesser dose and a delayed blossoming, and clearly partly because her character is more resistant, and her personality traits allow her to keep herself at a remove; among those traits are what we can assume to be strong and detached self-analytical tendencies (Kirk and co note several times that she's a highly trained psychiatrist, so science and psychology are her specialties). I also like how her earlier passionate defence of Mitchell's change - and the possibility of it being a good thing rather than something to be feared - takes on additional meaning in hindsight, when it's made obvious that she must have already known she was starting to undergo the shift herself. There's a fair amount to unpack with this character, and I found her a worthy inclusion (Mitchell too).
In keeping with my idea that Mitchell's problem isn't the vast scope and vision that renders his crewmates inconsequential but the tussle between that vision and a brain that remains latched onto more intimate concerns, it's likely that part of the reason Dehner doesn't lose herself as fully as Mitchell did is that she retains her detachment - both from her own mind (so enabling her to engage still in self-analysis where Mitchell can't or won't) and from others, enough of a detachment to lack any particular desire to squash the bugs.
(Another part of it is because she hasn't known Kirk for 15 years, of course, so naturally she'd be more detached anyway. Still, in general it's clear that she has some of her faculties still engaging in self-reflection and ethical feedback whereas Mitchell has lost himself, or been lost, in the invasive power).
Continuity
Of course, we know what happened to the Valiant, because we saw its final mission unfold back near the beginning of this chronology.
I might have assumed that the blond lab technician Mitchell got Kirk involved with was Carol Marcus, but Inception made it clear that it wasn't, referring to the incident and naming the woman in question as someone else.
Spock is still shouting every now and then.
His character wasn't fully formed yet, of course, though the devotion to logic and efforts to quash emotion in both expression and reasoning are there (plus the obvious fact that he does indeed possess the emotions). Apparently his telepathy wasn't conceived yet, though, which leads to a rather blatant oddity: why isn't Spock either dead or, more likely, conjuring Kaferian apples while informing Kirk that he's looking for worlds to use? I guess we have to assume Vulcan minds can block the effects entirely or for some reason they're not affected, though it still seems strange now that Spock makes no mention of his own immunity.
The Canopus Planet is mentioned for the first time. Its history, interpreted through all that's come since, is a little difficult to understand. Tarbolde sounds human to me (his first name is apparently Phineas, which basically confirms it), yet there's no way Humans are on Canopus in 1996 writing about nightingales and/or their love for their airplanes. We can disregard the (non-canonical?) Phineas and assume that Tarbolde is non-Human, but that leaves it uncertain who originally colonized Canopus. We know Humans live there in some numbers by the 24th Century, but it hasn't ever been confirmed as majority-Human, so far as I know.
We've already seen Kaferia (Tau Ceti III). Dimorus I don't think appears at any point in this chronology at present, although I know the system has shown up in Star Trek Online. (I think it's Romulan? S'Harien Station is there).
Next Time: Harbinger. Speaking of space stations, have they finished that starbase yet?
While I didn't think it quite as good as "The Cage", this was still a strong story. It had purpose and a depth of meaning that elevates it considerably beyond the shallow piece it could have been going by the story outline. It's obvious that there was a thematic intent behind this. It's a thoughtful speculative piece first and a mad superman threat story a distinct second.
It would be interesting to speculate precisely what was happening in Mitchell's mind and in the minds of those who change. Was their human brain structure leading them to retain their original social and emotional connections to their fellows, while the ability or capacity of those fellows to provide stimulation or input on anywhere near the level they need is now non-existent? That might mean that rather than simply ignoring or discarding his former comrades as unimportant, Mitchell retains a focus on them and is sensitive to their means of relating to him; therefore he takes their limitations, it would seem, as an affront. He's now unable to see them as anything other than useless irritations and targets
of resentment, even before they try to kill him. (After they start trying to kill him, he seems to take it personally in spite of agreeing with Spock's assessment that it's a dispassionate logical decision). Seeing someone as an insect doesn't mean you want to squash the insect, after all - it means you won't shed any tears if you do, and won't hesitate should it serve your interests (you also won't take it personally when it bites you) - but there shouldn't be any reason why you'd particularly want to. But seeing someone to whom you're irrevocably bound to (wired to socially) as an insect; that must be quite intolerable. Who are you, insect, to buzz around in my conceptual space, in my sense of self and its relation to the wider universe that has just blossomed into something a thousand times more complex and sophisticated? All this knowledge has opened up to him, and yet his vision and power is contained, as Kirk stresses, within a human vessel, and that human brain is wired in certain ways with certain priorities. And it's very clear that this energy/power is to all intents and purposes "possessing" Mitchell and Dehner; when it recedes, their original selves remerge. The beings they become are both an explosive expansion of their personality refracted through a medium of great power and knowledge, and a lodging of that power within them - it's as though they are inside it and it is inside them simultaneously. The mystery as to what's occurring psychologically is of course more important to the story than any explanation for the barrier (the physics of which is Space Magic, of course); especially so given that Dehner is a psychiatrist. I like that the precise balance of the multiple explanations for her retaining more of her original ethics than Mitchell is uncertain. We can easily comprehend the factors that play into it, but not the balance. It's likely in part because she received a lesser dose and a delayed blossoming, and clearly partly because her character is more resistant, and her personality traits allow her to keep herself at a remove; among those traits are what we can assume to be strong and detached self-analytical tendencies (Kirk and co note several times that she's a highly trained psychiatrist, so science and psychology are her specialties). I also like how her earlier passionate defence of Mitchell's change - and the possibility of it being a good thing rather than something to be feared - takes on additional meaning in hindsight, when it's made obvious that she must have already known she was starting to undergo the shift herself. There's a fair amount to unpack with this character, and I found her a worthy inclusion (Mitchell too).
In keeping with my idea that Mitchell's problem isn't the vast scope and vision that renders his crewmates inconsequential but the tussle between that vision and a brain that remains latched onto more intimate concerns, it's likely that part of the reason Dehner doesn't lose herself as fully as Mitchell did is that she retains her detachment - both from her own mind (so enabling her to engage still in self-analysis where Mitchell can't or won't) and from others, enough of a detachment to lack any particular desire to squash the bugs.
(Another part of it is because she hasn't known Kirk for 15 years, of course, so naturally she'd be more detached anyway. Still, in general it's clear that she has some of her faculties still engaging in self-reflection and ethical feedback whereas Mitchell has lost himself, or been lost, in the invasive power).
Continuity
Of course, we know what happened to the Valiant, because we saw its final mission unfold back near the beginning of this chronology.
I might have assumed that the blond lab technician Mitchell got Kirk involved with was Carol Marcus, but Inception made it clear that it wasn't, referring to the incident and naming the woman
in question as someone else.Spock is still shouting every now and then.
His character wasn't fully formed yet, of course, though the devotion to logic and efforts to quash emotion in both expression and reasoning are there (plus the obvious fact that he does indeed possess the emotions). Apparently his telepathy wasn't conceived yet, though, which leads to a rather blatant oddity: why isn't Spock either dead or, more likely, conjuring Kaferian apples while informing Kirk that he's looking for worlds to use? I guess we have to assume Vulcan minds can block the effects entirely or for some reason they're not affected, though it still seems strange now that Spock makes no mention of his own immunity. The Canopus Planet is mentioned for the first time. Its history, interpreted through all that's come since, is a little difficult to understand. Tarbolde sounds human to me (his first name is apparently Phineas, which basically confirms it), yet there's no way Humans are on Canopus in 1996 writing about nightingales and/or their love for their airplanes. We can disregard the (non-canonical?) Phineas and assume that Tarbolde is non-Human, but that leaves it uncertain who originally colonized
Canopus. We know Humans live there in some numbers by the 24th Century, but it hasn't ever been confirmed as majority-Human, so far as I know.We've already seen Kaferia (Tau Ceti III). Dimorus I don't think appears at any point in this chronology at present, although I know the system has shown up in Star Trek Online. (I think it's Romulan? S'Harien Station is there).
Next Time: Harbinger. Speaking of space stations, have they finished that starbase yet?
From what I can remember, the Dimorus incident is depicted in the third My Brother's Keeper novel by Michael Jan Friedman (Enterprise), and the sector containing it lies mostly within UFP space, but overlaps slightly with the Romulan Neutral Zone (at least according to the MMO).
Is anyone else seeing some odd hyperlinks embedded in Nasat's post seemingly at random, with green arrow-ish symbols after them? I've seen that sort of thing before as some sort of popup ad infection, but when I mouse over them, it shows that the link is just to "www.trekbbs.com/#".
Yes, I'm getting that too.
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