Spoilers The Flash - Season 6
- Thread starter Christopher
- Start date
I don't understand why this is a problem. Maybe there are some younger people, or kids, who are going to be watching the movie, and don't have the awareness to fully understand why the way things portrayed in the movie is wrong. Putting the kind of introduction or warnings they are adding to older shows and movies is a good to help them understand the context of what they are seeing.
Nobody is taking them away, they are still there.
Now, I'll give you Sawyer not having been hired yet, but the problem with "being on the clock" is that when you are in as high profile and public a job as acting, you're pretty much always on the clock. This is especially true with social media, where most actors heavily promote the projects they are working on. The people making the shows and movies probably aren't going to want to see their content being promoted on a Twitter or Intsagram account filled with racist, sexist, or homophobic content. Or to have a person who has said that kind of stuff on a very public platform associated with their product. Again, I disagree with Sawyer's firing because of the amount of time involved, but in general I can understand firing someone for saying the things he did.
And to go back to the whole rights issue again, nobody is taking away people's right to say racist or sexist or homophobic things, all that's being done is that the people who don't approve of that kind of behavior are simply letting their disapproval be known in the best way that they. Freedom of speech does not mean that you will never face consequences when you say things people disagree with. You have every right to be as sexist or racist or homophobic as you want, but at the same time people don't like that kind of behavior also have the right to not have anything to do with you after you do.
Now Sawyer is a different story since he said the stuff years ago, but if people are stupid enough to say that kind of stuff or behave like the "Karen" in Central Park, or at the apartment pool did, then everything that happened after that is their own fault. We have seen enough of this kind of stuff happen lately, that you'd have to be pretty fucking stupid to act that way in public.
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I’m confused? Pretty much everything I watch costs me money on some level. Where is this magic land where things are free?
Because he said nothing to them. He didn't do these jokes at work. He didn't even do them recently. It's years in the past. Also I am not saying they have to shut up. If they want to call him out then that is fine. People don't have to like each other. They just have to do their jobs and go home and be around people they want to be around. Why should anyone care about what their coworkers think about anything? Do you worry about who you work with about what they think about when it comes to issues of today or who they voted for or what kind of sense of humor they have? Do you really care what Joe Wilson who works in the next cubicle or fixes the computers etc does when he gets off work at the end of the day and heads off this life?
Jason
It isn't about co-workers, it is about the public perception of the company.
Problem is what is offensive changes with time so you got to look at things in the context of when they were said. The whole point of this stuff is to create purity tests that people can arbitrary use to silence people in order to control them. Obama has spoke about the dangers of this with the circular firing squad. It becomes less about rooting out truly bad people but more about creating a environment where no matter what you do you will never be good enough for people. They create impossible standards to live up to since they constantly move them. I would rather have some offensive language sometimes happen than people to just accept this kind of big brother attitude were we are constantly judging each other making sure they think just good thoughts and bad thoughts will be punished. Punishment is suppose to be on our behavior in society and not what we say and think about.
Jason
Here's 25 million reasons why an employer has to be concerned about whether they are hiring racist, sexist asshole bullies.
https://www.akingump.com/en/news-in...employee-s-hostile-work-environment-case.html
I know but the fact that perception is now built off people wanting to cancel people just because they don't like them means that while the company is just doing it's job it says something about the actual people that we would be trying to force their hands over things that don't come close to meriting someone being fired. It's really the people that has gone bad in modern society and these corporations are just responding to that. Social Media has robbed people's ability to really look at issues in any kind of thoughtful way. It's just knee jerk reactions and having pun being a online bully. It's just unthinking anger IMO.
Jason
Tell me when this one would've been appropriate...
https://screenrant.com/flash-hartley-sawyer-tweets-racist-explained/
Or this one...
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/09/entertainment/hartley-sawyer-tweets-flash-fired/index.html
I get it I guess. Civil liberties take a back seat to a , for the greater good concept. It's just not what I grew up thinking as a Democrat. The idea that a individual had rights that can't be taken away so easy especially by a Corporation which was a thing we use to see as bad.
Jason
Wow. You really don't get it. What about the rights of folks to not have to put up with that garbage?
1. He's a flawed human being.
2. More Democrats in the primaries and caucuses wanted him than any of the other candidates.
3. He won.
Next?
I don't like the jokes so I don't think they were appropriate but I would still defend his right to say them. Why he found them funny I don't know. Has anyone asked why he thought they were funny? I do know bad behavior as a comedy troupe is very popular so maybe that was what he was going for but I am not him so you would have to ask him.
Jason
They don't have to put up with it. They don't have to be his friend or read his tweets. People can disengage from people who they feel is doing toxic behavior. It's like ignoring a troll here. We simply block them or ignore them but we don't search them out online and try and destroy their lives. People can get angry at him and call him out but firing someone is kind of a big deal that is worst than bad jokes.
Jason
Do you even understand Freedom of Speech? What it is? It protects you from the government censuring your speech or punishing you for it. Hartley Sawyer can post the offensive tweets again tomorrow with no pushback from the government.
Here's a hint for people that don't want their lives ruined: think before you put your "funny" tweet out there. Because your future employers are not likely to think your tweet about cutting off women's breasts are as funny as you do. And it wasn't like this man was a child when he made the tweets, he would've been around 26 or 27 years old.
If you were female, would you feel comfortable working with someone that made those tweets?
To go back 20 years(which is kind of one of my calling cards because, hey, I'm both a pop culture nerd and trapped in the past) John Rocker of the Atlanta Braves exercised his Constitutional freedom of speech and eventually lost his job because his employers did not want to deal with his extreme toxicity. Rocker was not a victim of anything but his own mouth. The nation continued to march forward, First Amendment intact and with celebrities and athletes retaining the choice to say anything they wanted under the protection of said First Amendment.
The problem is: the government can't prosecute and silence someone for saying something bigoted or incredibly offensive. But your private sector employer and those whom contract with you to perform a job and generate products, services and revenue can. And there's not a damn thing illegal nor really wrong about that.
The problem is: the government can't prosecute and silence someone for saying something bigoted or incredibly offensive. But your private sector employer and those whom contract with you to perform a job and generate products, services and revenue can. And there's not a damn thing illegal nor really wrong about that.
Have you listened to stand up comedians in the past? Blue humor and Dark humor is called that because well it can be some really dark and twisted stuff. Being inappropriate is not just a end result it's the goal. Comedy is art. So even if it's not on a stage you still got to sort of see in the same vein. It doesn't really represent a person's ethics just their sense of humor. Just like if you watch a movie about a serial killer it doesn't mean your like killing people.
Jason
Why? Did he proclaim it as humor when he made the comments on Twitter? If I go to a comedy show or movie by an out there performer, then there is an expectation of getting lewd, crude or violent material. That isn't the case when I pop open my Twitter app.
Well if I was Lisa Lampanelli then maybe yes. It really depends on the individuals you ask. You can't just assume everyone is going to line up to some racial or gender stereotype as to the reaction they would have. It really depends on personality and their views on humor and maybe what they think of the guy in general if they know him as a person already.
Jason