Enlighten me
Spoilers The Flash - Season 2
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
It was just a bad joke on my part about how often she gets quoted in time travel threads. Don't mind me.
"Time travel. Since my first day on the job as a Starfleet captain I swore I'd never let myself get caught in one of these godforsaken paradoxes - the future is the past, the past is the future, it all gives me a headache."
"I figured from the beginning that my job was what they said it was: to play Henry Allen; to sort of graft my following onto Grant [Gustin], which was a joy and a pleasure to do; and to be a tool in Grant’s tool box, a place where Barry could come when the special effects stopped and really bare his soul to the audience, through Henry Allen. I figured once that was completed, and Barry had fully accepted his role as a superhero, my job was done. So, I have to say that Henry’s death this season was not a surprise to me; I was fully anticipating it. What I wasn’t anticipating was what comes next, and that blew my mind. Blew it right off its hinges." - John Wesley Shipp
Minor nitpick, I am surprised that was not the real Jay's helmet. Does that mean he was the Flash without a helmet at all?
Thanks for sharing that Commander Richard! Obviously Johh will back as Jay. Clearly that is plan, why else introduce him.
I am not surprised the writers felt limited in how to use Henry. It's been obvious they did not know what to do with him once he got out of prison.
I am glad that Barry said it gives him some confront in knowing a version of his father is alive, BUT knows he is not his father. While great casting it would cheapen Henry's life if he can just be replaced emotionally. Same goes for any dopplegangers of other dead characters.
I am not surprised the writers felt limited in how to use Henry. It's been obvious they did not know what to do with him once he got out of prison.
I am glad that Barry said it gives him some confront in knowing a version of his father is alive, BUT knows he is not his father. While great casting it would cheapen Henry's life if he can just be replaced emotionally. Same goes for any dopplegangers of other dead characters.
It would appear so. At first, I thought that he'd put on a cowl and we'd find out that what we thought was the 90s Flash in the montage was actually this Jay Garrick.
Agreed. He will probably return to the present and find himself without powers. It certainly puts a different spin on that speed force episode. Barry literally has to accept his mother's death in order to be the Flash at that stage in his life. It wasn't just about trying to make Barry more at peace with his decision.
And who's the first person he'd go to for help in getting his powers back in this altered timeline?
Thomas Wayne!
OK, besides him.
Harrison Wells!
And this HW won't know him from Adam.
Legends of Tomorrow spoiler...
Now we know how Captain Cold can appear next season.
Now we know how Captain Cold can appear next season.
Or in this universe, Robert Queen
Wow, that was... that was terrible. Just awful in pretty much every way.
What a perfect jumping off point. Barry has saved his mother, undone the damage caused by Reverse Flash, and they all lived happily ever after.
There's absolutely no reason to come back. They really needed to have Barry come back to a changed "present" to establish an actual cliffhanger, instead of just an ending to their story. Also, if they wanted to do Flashpoint, why not do it last year, when the entire thread of the season built to it and it had actual meaning?
Zoom? He literally spent the episode running in circles until the Deus Ex Speedforce showed up to put the writers of this show out of their collective misery. His plot to destroy the multiverse? It came out of nowhere, it went nowhere, it was resolved with absolutely no emotional or plot purpose, and was completely and in every way irrelevant to the episode except to pad out the running time and give Zoom a "reason" to run in circles until the Deus Ex Speedforce could show up and put the audience out of it's misery. And Barry's "time remnant" dies, but nobody cares because it's glossed over in two seconds and has absolutely no impact, consequences, or relevance beyond tying off the nonsensical plot the writer's concocted to make Zoom run in circles until the Deus Ex Speedforce showed up to put this show out of it's misery.
Arrow has nosedived from greatness in Season 2 right into the garbage of complete stupidity over the last two seasons. Flash has clearly been marked out for the same trajectory. So I'm taking the jumping off point the writers have offered.
Barry wins, the Reverse Flash is undone, Nora Allen lives! Happy endings for everybody!
What a perfect jumping off point. Barry has saved his mother, undone the damage caused by Reverse Flash, and they all lived happily ever after.
There's absolutely no reason to come back. They really needed to have Barry come back to a changed "present" to establish an actual cliffhanger, instead of just an ending to their story. Also, if they wanted to do Flashpoint, why not do it last year, when the entire thread of the season built to it and it had actual meaning?
Zoom? He literally spent the episode running in circles until the Deus Ex Speedforce showed up to put the writers of this show out of their collective misery. His plot to destroy the multiverse? It came out of nowhere, it went nowhere, it was resolved with absolutely no emotional or plot purpose, and was completely and in every way irrelevant to the episode except to pad out the running time and give Zoom a "reason" to run in circles until the Deus Ex Speedforce could show up and put the audience out of it's misery. And Barry's "time remnant" dies, but nobody cares because it's glossed over in two seconds and has absolutely no impact, consequences, or relevance beyond tying off the nonsensical plot the writer's concocted to make Zoom run in circles until the Deus Ex Speedforce showed up to put this show out of it's misery.
Arrow has nosedived from greatness in Season 2 right into the garbage of complete stupidity over the last two seasons. Flash has clearly been marked out for the same trajectory. So I'm taking the jumping off point the writers have offered.
Barry wins, the Reverse Flash is undone, Nora Allen lives! Happy endings for everybody!
The finale like season 2 as a whole feel short of season 1, there was just too much that didn't hold up to scrutiny like the whole time remnant thing that for me is a cheap cop out and is one of those things that gets used and then your like well why not always use it, the same with the time travel. Barry can just time travel when he likes which will have the whole Hiro effect like on Heroes and starts cool and then just becomes a issue for the writers cause you can't come up with a good idea why he wouldn't always use it.
Also I don't get the team's plan at the start? They wanted to send Zoom back to Earth 2 but he can just come back? the guy creates portals at ease right?
The wraiths killing Zoom was interesting but the time force really sucks at its job. Season 1 was exciting but had the payoff that for me held its ground when looked into it from you know making dam sense. The final scene leaves me a little numb as it leaves an interesting door for season 3 to open but also makes Barry look like a total fucking idiot knowing he's just put the entire timeline at risk.
Also I don't get the team's plan at the start? They wanted to send Zoom back to Earth 2 but he can just come back? the guy creates portals at ease right?
The wraiths killing Zoom was interesting but the time force really sucks at its job. Season 1 was exciting but had the payoff that for me held its ground when looked into it from you know making dam sense. The final scene leaves me a little numb as it leaves an interesting door for season 3 to open but also makes Barry look like a total fucking idiot knowing he's just put the entire timeline at risk.
Looks like next season will be a continuation of this one in many ways.
Which still doesn't address the point in what you quoted. And which still doesn't change the choices made in this episode.
I was a little underwhelmed by the finale. It wasn't terrible, just disappointing.
We went into the final two episodes with a) Zoom leading an entire army of metas and b) the promise of Wally and Jesse getting powers. But both of those things were taken away within the first five minutes of the next episode. It was quickly just Zoom and Black Canary... and then in this episode it was just Zoom. And the kids never got their powers.
I was looking forward to Barry and Wally and Jesse and Masked Man fighting off an entire army of metas led by Zoom.
I'm still not really following the "time remnant" bit. Did Barry have a conversation with his other self before he offed himself? Did that other Barry have a mind, a soul?
In this episode we learn that Zoom is constantly being chased by the time wraiths. Have we ever seen that on the show before? I remember the episode where they chased BARRY, but have they ever been after Zoom? Would have been nice to have seen this earlier...
Jay Garrick looked awesome in that costume. It was the painfully obvious answer all along, but oh well. Look forward to seeing him next season, hopefully with the JSA on Legends of Tomorrow.
We went into the final two episodes with a) Zoom leading an entire army of metas and b) the promise of Wally and Jesse getting powers. But both of those things were taken away within the first five minutes of the next episode. It was quickly just Zoom and Black Canary... and then in this episode it was just Zoom. And the kids never got their powers.
I was looking forward to Barry and Wally and Jesse and Masked Man fighting off an entire army of metas led by Zoom.
I'm still not really following the "time remnant" bit. Did Barry have a conversation with his other self before he offed himself? Did that other Barry have a mind, a soul?
In this episode we learn that Zoom is constantly being chased by the time wraiths. Have we ever seen that on the show before? I remember the episode where they chased BARRY, but have they ever been after Zoom? Would have been nice to have seen this earlier...
Jay Garrick looked awesome in that costume. It was the painfully obvious answer all along, but oh well. Look forward to seeing him next season, hopefully with the JSA on Legends of Tomorrow.
and time remnants 
My guess is that when Barry returns to his "present" he'll still have his powers, but no one will remember him. Instead, Jesse (of Earth-1, since Wells would be alive) will be the famous speedster in this version of the timeline. Barry(Flash) will have reduced himself to a time remnant. The "current" Barry will be someone completely normal.
My prediction - Fan predictions are usually wrong. I am going to wait to see what happens. 
People have guessed alot of things right.
That was an ok finale, but I can't help but think they pushed the major reset button on the season. I was expecting something big to happen, but all the reveals were pretty much predicted in this thread so it didn't feel like a big finale. This may sound dumb, but I was hoping something unexpected would have happened, like Supergirl showing up somehow. Yeah, it probably doesn't make sense, but it would be mind blowing and better than hitting the reset button on the series. It wasn't a terrible finale, mainly because the scene around the magnatar was awesome (I love when two speedsters race, that effect is really impressive) but I was expecting something more.