Doing this reminds me why I was glad that Voyager's pilot was Tom Paris and NOT Nick Locarno. Deep down, Nick was a creep. The ep, however, was a winner.
"The First Duty" Line-by-Line
- Thread starter CoveTom
- Start date
Nick wasn't a creep. He was young and was trying to prove himself through questionable means. When he knew he'd screwed up, he didn't man-up.
Isn't it sad that Wesley Crusher man'ed up before Nick did?
Isn't it sad that Wesley Crusher man'ed up before Nick did?
It's the same character for me. Tom Paris was responsible for three deaths due to his error, an error he tried to cover up. Worse than what Locarno did, really, when you think about it.
If it had been Nick Locarno piloting Voyager, he would have had the same redemption in our eyes that Tom Paris had, IMO.
If it had been Nick Locarno piloting Voyager, he would have had the same redemption in our eyes that Tom Paris had, IMO.
I don't think so. Tom was man enough to come forward on his own. He wasn't exposed by someone else and he didn't convince others to conspire with him. He did the cover up on his own and then he admitted to it on his own. That's why, even though he killed more people, he was a more redeemable character
But, it was Locarno's manipulation of the situation that lead to the "group decision". It wasn't really their choice. They got caught up in his hubris.
And he manipulated Nova Squad to cover it up, lie to the inquiry, tried to manipulate Wesley into leaving the Academy to save his own neck or to call Picard a liar (I'm sure there must be some regulation against things like that.), and only admitted to the truth when Wesley turned him in.
Again, Wesley turned out to be the better man here.
Paris also tried to cover it all up, but her realized it wouldn't work, and he turned himself in.
That's the difference between the two. Paris was redeemable because he recognized his failure all on his own. Nick had be shoved. It was only after there was no where left for him to turn that he realized he'd been completely in the wrong.
My impression of Nick doesn't lead me to believe he ever thought he was wrong. I think Nick believes the only wrong he did was let Wesley into Nova Squad.
Edited to add: Hey, Covetom, who won?
Oh, dear. I've missed quite a bit haven't I? You see, I've been away on special assignment for the federal government, investigating some photos of alien-looking creatures in Nazi uniforms that have just been discovered from World War II...
Anyway, lemme go through the thread and get us going...
Anyway, lemme go through the thread and get us going...
Okey-doke, I've read through the whole thread and am ready to proceed. But before I do, I just wanted to post a little something about the issue that came up around Picard's speech. Nothing bad happened there, but people seemed to get a little annoyed, and I just wanted to address it.
Please remember that this is not a contest. I know that there are only so many classic lines and speeches to be had in the episodes, and that it's fun to get to be the one to post them. But no one should be getting upset if they don't get to post a particular line. There will be plenty more to come. As I said, nothing bad happened in this thread. No one got out of line or anything like that. But I saw some tensions bubbling up at that point in the thread, and I just don't want anyone to get upset in the future.
As far as I'm concerned, the "big lines" should be treated no differently than any other line. The person who gets to them first gets to post them. Just let the chips fall where they may. But if anyone has any suggestions on how to better handle those situations, I'm all ears.
Above all else, however, everyone please just remember it's all for fun!
Thanks!
Please remember that this is not a contest. I know that there are only so many classic lines and speeches to be had in the episodes, and that it's fun to get to be the one to post them. But no one should be getting upset if they don't get to post a particular line. There will be plenty more to come. As I said, nothing bad happened in this thread. No one got out of line or anything like that. But I saw some tensions bubbling up at that point in the thread, and I just don't want anyone to get upset in the future.
As far as I'm concerned, the "big lines" should be treated no differently than any other line. The person who gets to them first gets to post them. Just let the chips fall where they may. But if anyone has any suggestions on how to better handle those situations, I'm all ears.
Above all else, however, everyone please just remember it's all for fun!
Thanks!
With that out of the way, on we go...
As before, I compiled a list of everyone who participated in this thread and then numbered the list.
Here's what I came up with:
1. CoveTom
2. LeadHead
3. JanewayRulz!
4. Rett Mikhal
5. leandar
6. Ziz
7. brian
8. Vulcan Princess
9. Skrain Dukat
10. Adm_Hawthorne
11. Mojochi
12. Vanyel
Excellent participation once again!
Those names should be in the order in which each person first posted to the thread. No "weight" is given for who posted more or less often.
(If I inadvertently left anyone off the list of participants, please let me know and I'll try to make it up on the next go-around.)
I then used a random number generator -- www.random.org, to be specific -- and had it pick a number between 1 and 12. This is completely and totally random. There is no favoritism of any kind shown.
And the winner is...
*drumroll*
Ziz!
Congratulations, Ziz!
So, Ziz, the next move is yours. Would you like to select the next episode we are going to do line-by-line? You are free to select the next episode or pass and I will re-run the randomization. You can pick any episode from any of the Trek series that you like. For reference, the ones we've done so far, ordered by series, are:
Where No Man Has Gone Before (TOS)
The Man Trap (TOS)
The Menagerie (TOS)
Measure of a Man (TNG)
Yesterday's Enterprise (TNG)
Peak Performance (TNG)
The First Duty (TNG)
The Visitor (DS9)
Trials and Tribble-ations (DS9)
Bride of Chaotica (VOY)
Dark Frontier (VOY)
Scorpion (VOY)
Counterpoint (VOY)
Once a new episode has been chosen, I will fire up the next line-by-line thread in the appropriate forum and post the link here.
As before, I compiled a list of everyone who participated in this thread and then numbered the list.
Here's what I came up with:
1. CoveTom
2. LeadHead
3. JanewayRulz!
4. Rett Mikhal
5. leandar
6. Ziz
7. brian
8. Vulcan Princess
9. Skrain Dukat
10. Adm_Hawthorne
11. Mojochi
12. Vanyel
Excellent participation once again!
Those names should be in the order in which each person first posted to the thread. No "weight" is given for who posted more or less often.
(If I inadvertently left anyone off the list of participants, please let me know and I'll try to make it up on the next go-around.)
I then used a random number generator -- www.random.org, to be specific -- and had it pick a number between 1 and 12. This is completely and totally random. There is no favoritism of any kind shown.
And the winner is...
*drumroll*
Ziz!
Congratulations, Ziz!
So, Ziz, the next move is yours. Would you like to select the next episode we are going to do line-by-line? You are free to select the next episode or pass and I will re-run the randomization. You can pick any episode from any of the Trek series that you like. For reference, the ones we've done so far, ordered by series, are:
Where No Man Has Gone Before (TOS)
The Man Trap (TOS)
The Menagerie (TOS)
Measure of a Man (TNG)
Yesterday's Enterprise (TNG)
Peak Performance (TNG)
The First Duty (TNG)
The Visitor (DS9)
Trials and Tribble-ations (DS9)
Bride of Chaotica (VOY)
Dark Frontier (VOY)
Scorpion (VOY)
Counterpoint (VOY)
Once a new episode has been chosen, I will fire up the next line-by-line thread in the appropriate forum and post the link here.
I think the tension was mostly perceived in my addled brain. I thought I'd annoyed Adm_Hawthorne but it turned out we were cool.
We were like ice, yo.
I was never annoyed. After all, I knew it wouldn't be me posting that speech, but I got to pick the episode. So, I was already full of awesomesauce.
I was never annoyed. After all, I knew it wouldn't be me posting that speech, but I got to pick the episode. So, I was already full of awesomesauce.
^Yay! Although you did steal the one I would choose! Forget that, we get to do it! 
And you can have your awesomesauce Adm_Hawthorne, As for me, I am a Cipher, wrapped around an Enigma and smothered in Secretsauce.
10 fake and meaningless points for anyone who gets that reference.
And you can have your awesomesauce Adm_Hawthorne, As for me, I am a Cipher, wrapped around an Enigma and smothered in Secretsauce.
10 fake and meaningless points for anyone who gets that reference.
Similar threads
