Yes but they wouldn't be overtly seen with Rebels. That's my point. I can fire in cops but automatically be assumed to be part of terrorist group.
Spoilers The Controversial Star Wars Opinion Thread
- Thread starter fireproof78
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Maybe with Leia's mutating accents. If you mean this, what are your specifics?
But in this case it makes perfect sense that Vader and Leia would be in the movie, since we know that it deals with the theft of the Death Star plans, and we know from A New Hope that she received the plans and Vader was trying to get them back. Since the whole point of the movie was to show us the events leading up to beginning of A New Hope, it makes perfect sense that we'd see Leia get the plans, and Vader go after her. Now whether you like how the scenes with them played out is a totally separate issue.
But the plans were not beamed.
Well, they were beamed to the Profundity, and then hand delivered to Leia from the main computer as she takes off. I image the Devastator just opened fire as soon as they exited hyperspace right behind the Tantive IV. Naturally they would return fire.
The old radio play version has R2 outside doing "repairs" in a restricted zone while the rebel spies beam the stolen data to the rebel ship from the planet. Leia takes off as the local Star Destroyer starts to move the intercept them. They run to Tattoine, then the Star Destroyer jumps in right on top of them shooting. They naturally shoot back.
The old radio play version has R2 outside doing "repairs" in a restricted zone while the rebel spies beam the stolen data to the rebel ship from the planet. Leia takes off as the local Star Destroyer starts to move the intercept them. They run to Tattoine, then the Star Destroyer jumps in right on top of them shooting. They naturally shoot back.
The alleged point of Rogue One was the story of the Rebels who risked / sacrificed their lives to steal the plans. Vader and Leia were not at all necessary to tell the story of those who stole the plans. They served no practical or narrative purpose with their appearances. Stuffing OT characters--main OT characters into R1 was simply fanwank bait because Disney/LFL did not believe the film could be a standalone story without OT main characters.
Exactly. Vader's Star Wars dialogue:
"Several transmissions were beamed to this ship by Rebel spies. I want to know what happened to the plans they sent you."
He's quite specific in his meaning, yet R1 has one soldier hand a physical drive to another. There's no way to spin that act as "beaming" anything, he--Vader--was there to see it in R1, so there's yet another R1 scene not in continuity with Star Wars.
Obviously but the how was not accurate to dialog previously established. Watching Vader sould you think he just went on a rampage against rebels? Hearing Leia talk to Vader make you think she just saw Vader killing her protection details or the destruction of an entire Rebel fleet?
Reading the scroll are we thinking that the Rebels literally just had a battle with the Empire?
Because, I'm sorry, but what is presented and what Rogue One shows feels very incompatible.
Mileage, etc.
Vader assumes they were beamed to the ship.
What makes you think she saw it?fireproof78 said:
Maybe not saw, but reports of, eyewitness accounts, the general terror of the troops.
All of it is at odds with the tone.
From what I understand, the Vader hallway scene was added last moment due to audiences at preview screenings not liking the end of the movie.
I don't think this is a matter of mileage varying, because the crawl pretty clearly spells out that a battle had just happened and Leia was fleeing from it.
You could hear the rage in Vader's voice when he ordered his troops to tear the ship apart and find the plans. Seems pretty clear that his blood was still up after failing to stop the Rebels from escaping Scarif. As for Leia, she's obviously playing dumb and trying to stall Vader to buy time for R2-D2 to flee with them.
The opening crawl of Star Wars makes it pretty explicit that the first major battle of the rebellion just happened, and it's clear from Vader's attitude that he's particularly peeved as the film opens. I don't think any of that is in any way incongruous.
As for Leia, yes I absolutely believe that Leia could talk to Vader the way she did in spite of what just happened. Because Leia has the biggest damn balls in the entire Rebellion, and that was pretty clearly established throughout the OT. This just makes that opening scene go from setting the scene to a crowning moment of badass. Consider her behavior aboard the Death Star with Tarkin. She's pretty much cool as a cucumber until Alderaan is seriously threatened and her facade breaks. She's young, feels largely indestructible, and believes that her position and family make her more or less untouchable. And she'd probably have been right under more normal circumstances, but the Death Star changes everything.
I also don't understand why anybody is confused that Leia lies, boldly, right to Vader's face. (Again, that woman has huge brass ones and I love her for it.) What is she supposed to do? "Why, yes sir. I am in fact a terrorist and a spy and by gum you've caught me!"? No, she's going to use whatever leverage she has to try and win the day, or at least delay ultimate defeat long enough for R2 to escape/find Kenobi. She knows she's been caught red handed. That was pretty clear in the original Star Wars even without RO's additions. But part of rebelling against a tyrannical galactic Empire is being bold, and being brave. I really, really don't believe that it's a coincidence that the first Rebel we meet in the films is Leia, because she's pretty much quintessential.
People seem to be misunderstanding my point so I shall be blunt: the tone from Rogue One to A New Hope does not work. Vader's attitude doesn't work, Leia's lies doesn't work. It just is incongruous.
People can love Vader's appearance and all the badassness it has. Leia can be brave and bold and I can still find going from Rogue One to A New Hope completely different. It jsut doesn't work for me.
Not because Leia can't lie to an Empire; she can.
Not because she can't be brave; she can.
Not that she is somehow lesser because of Rogue One; she isn't.
But because the tone and tempo from film to film does not work.
I don't think it lines up as much as fans are willing to play along with it. I think the text of the film presents a different picture and I think Rogue One, for all its other strengths, misses something at the end to make these pieces line up.
I don't, and can never, agree. Whatever you're seeing just isn't there for me. So you do you.
I see almost perfectly mirrored themes, in terms of the saga as a whole. RO ends with Vader, arguably the Empire's greatest weapon before the Death Star comes online, fighting desperately to prevent the theft of the DS plans. And failing despite all his considerable might. SW opens with Leia, unquestionably the Rebellion's brightest light, being captured and imprisoned but still managing to eke out a victory despite being utterly powerless to stop Vader. It's like the almost literal tipping point between darkness and light is the tiny missing beat between the two films as the dark's power finally wanes and fails and the light is reborn to burn anew.
That has always worked for me.
Agree to disagree. Whatever you're seeing is being read in to the work. It gives more weight to a secondary character in both films for reasons that escape me. I'm glad you derive meaning from it, but I don't see that anywhere in the film.
And, honestly, if that's the whole point of Rogue One then it fails even more so for me now more than ever.
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