After the USS Europa was rammed by the cloaked Klingon ship (Battle of the Binary Stars) though severely damaged its antimatter field was breached in order to blow up both itself and the Klingon vessel. That would seem to be consistent as a means to destroy a ship.
The age of the antihero
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Star Trek TNG: "The Buried Age" novel describes standard Starfleet protocol for scuttling its ships:
Chronology and continuity in the Pocket novels:
According to this, it had to be consistent with on-screen canon.
Afterwards, Phillipa changed her tack, concentrating on the third charge, Picard’s alleged failure to ensure that the ship was scuttled. She called Simenon to the stand, and the engineer testified to everything Picard had attempted, first to save his ship, then to ensure its destruction once abandonment became inevitable. He explained why they could not have risked returning to the ship or sparing a shuttle warp core to destroy it, and stated that its descent into the Jovian’s atmosphere was certain in any case. “And long-range scans saw no sign of hostile ships in the time it would’ve taken the Stargazer’s orbit to decay.”
Chronology and continuity in the Pocket novels:
Pocket's licensed novels are required to be consistent with on-screen canon, with CBS Consumer Products approving the outlines and manuscripts of each novel on that basis.
According to this, it had to be consistent with on-screen canon.
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^^^
This!
Is anyone arguing that a ship is never blown up? O_o
Two things. First, CBS can change that whenever they want. Secondly, it was a 100 years later from DISCO era, so maybe Starfleet changed regulations? Weird, I know...Star Trek TNG: "The Buried Age" novel describes standard Starfleet protocol for scuttling its ships:
Afterwards, Phillipa changed her tack, concentrating on the third charge, Picard’s alleged failure to ensure that the ship was scuttled. She called Simenon to the stand, and the engineer testified to everything Picard had attempted, first to save his ship, then to ensure its destruction once abandonment became inevitable. He explained why they could not have risked returning to the ship or sparing a shuttle warp core to destroy it, and stated that its descent into the Jovian’s atmosphere was certain in any case. “And long-range scans saw no sign of hostile ships in the time it would’ve taken the Stargazer’s orbit to decay.”
Chronology and continuity in the Pocket novels:
Pocket's licensed novels are required to be consistent with on-screen canon, with CBS Consumer Products approving the outlines and manuscripts of each novel on that basis.
According to this, the novel had to be approved by CBS Consumer Products to be consistent with on-screen canon.
How could they when there are three examples on Discovery alone
That has no relationship to what I actually said. I suppose I confused you by saying "blow up the ship policy." That is, a policy that a Starfleet ship is to be blown up upon giving an abandon ship order.
Oh that is kind of funny! So all these comparisons riddled in this thread after the DISCO era are relevant until someone else brings up one??
Weird all right
Just exploring possibilities. If you like, I will only cite TOS examples of crazy captains, and starship non-destructionOh that is kind of funny! So all these comparisons riddled in this thread after the DISCO era are relevant until someone else brings up one??
Weird all right
Hey, you post what you likeJust exploring possibilities. If you like, I will only cite TOS examples of crazy captains, and starship non-destruction
I just noticed something. It's ALL exploring.
In each, there was a specific, pressing reason for it to be done, in the moment. It wasn't done preemptively, as a matter of course, "just because" or "just in case"! Do you really not see the distinction? The former is something we've always known Starfleet to do. The latter is something we've never known them to do. You can think it's dumb, and from the standpoint of a military mind you might be right, but that appears to be their policy. Consistently.How could they when there are three examples on Discovery alone
The context in "The Catwalk" suggested it was a bluff, because he had also told them the crew was dead, when really they were all hiding in the nacelle. His motivation was saving their lives, not destroying the ship at all costs. He just wanted the Takret to believe that. It was a clever ploy, and it worked.
But for the sake of argument, let's say it wasn't a bluff. The ship was (1) already being actively occupied and exploited by the enemy, and also (2) was Starfleet's most advanced prototype vessel. Those would be specific, pressing reasons to blow up the ship. The same ones that applied to the Buran and the Glenn, respectively.
In TMP, they were inside V'Ger, which was approaching Earth and intended to wipe out all life on the planet. That's also a specific, pressing reason. The same one that (in less extreme form) applied to the Europa.
Once again, none of these conditions applied to the Shenzhou. She was just useless old space junk as far as they were concerned. Of course, they turned out to be (somewhat) wrong about that. Just like a lot of the other decisions they made turned out to be foolish, even though they seemed to be the right ones at the time, from their point of view.
-MMoM
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You...actually don't see a difference?
The Glenn was literally Starfleet's most advanced ship—even more so than Discovery herself—and like her sister wholly designed around the spore drive. The sort of big strategic advantage she could potentially provide if taken was of an entirely different order on a whole other level beyond the minor incidental one an old wreck like Shenzhou ever could. Moreover, they knew affirmatively that the Klingons had located and boarded her at least once already (though fortunately the tardigrade apparently prevented them from doing much). Of course she had to be destroyed!
-MMoM
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The Glenn needed to be destroyed and so did the Shenzhou. We've kind of been through this a few times over now 
Clearly given half a chance the Klingons showed they would salvage whatever they could from Starfleet vessels, no matter what type. There was no advantage to (Starfleet) keeping the Shenzhou afloat. There was to the Klingons though.
Clearly given half a chance the Klingons showed they would salvage whatever they could from Starfleet vessels, no matter what type. There was no advantage to (Starfleet) keeping the Shenzhou afloat. There was to the Klingons though.No one's argument is convincing. Just repetitive
Starfleet Order 2005: Orders the destruction of a starship by allowing matter and antimatter to mix in an uncontrolled manner. This was a last resort for a captain that allowed them to prevent their ship or crew from falling into enemy hands. (Star Trek: The Motion Picture)
Well, speaking of fallacies, your argument here is that because Archer lied about his crew being dead, he must have lied about his orders too.
That's only one of the possibilities but not the only one.
That still doesn't remove the possibility of standard orders.
I was trying to make a point that if there is a Starfleet order that involves auto-destruct under some circumstances such as those in TMP, then it's not out of the realm of possibility that there are similar and possibly standard orders such as those mentioned by Archer in "The Catwalk."
I'd like to reiterate that it is only a possibility to consider in a discussion.
Without discounting a possibility for an explanation in the case of the Shenzhou, it's not surprising that people are making observations about it on the internet, some of which are kind of funny.
Observation #1:
Captain Georgiou left Michael a telescope and an inspirational hologram in her will. It’s a mawkish, manipulative moment that fails to answer how this material wasn’t delivered to Michael sooner, or what idiot salvaged the Shenzhou to snag an ancient telescope while [leaving] a fully-functioning dilithium processor behind.
Observation #2:
Yeah ... that functioning portable dilithium controller over there ... naw. Probably no Klingons around who might want that.
[. . .]
Why not fire a salvo and blow it up for good measure? Like they did with the Glenn. [. . .] the enemy managed to scavenge [Shenzhou] for useful parts that allowed them to bring their flagship with revolutionary cloaking technology back into operation. Seems like blowing up some old ship might be worth the energy required to fire the phasers at its antimatter core.
[. . .]
They found a telescope but forgot about dilethium thingamajig which is a far more important and a sensitive star fleet technology.
[. . .]
What did they say in the first episode about Starfleet's "tech hygiene"? Doesn't seem like they would leave a ship to rot like that.
[. . .]
No actually Starfleet did manage to salvage one thing from the wrecked shenzou. Captain georgiou's old skool telescope. They realized they needed it for a heartfelt reveal for our heroine later on and took the time to careful remove it before bailing out apparently, didn't bother with combing the wreckage or destroying sensitive military equipment so it didn't fall into enemy hands or anything like that though.
[. . .]
Why not fire a salvo and blow it up for good measure? Like they did with the Glenn. [. . .] the enemy managed to scavenge [Shenzhou] for useful parts that allowed them to bring their flagship with revolutionary cloaking technology back into operation. Seems like blowing up some old ship might be worth the energy required to fire the phasers at its antimatter core.
[. . .]
They found a telescope but forgot about dilethium thingamajig which is a far more important and a sensitive star fleet technology.
[. . .]
What did they say in the first episode about Starfleet's "tech hygiene"? Doesn't seem like they would leave a ship to rot like that.
[. . .]
No actually Starfleet did manage to salvage one thing from the wrecked shenzou. Captain georgiou's old skool telescope. They realized they needed it for a heartfelt reveal for our heroine later on and took the time to careful remove it before bailing out apparently, didn't bother with combing the wreckage or destroying sensitive military equipment so it didn't fall into enemy hands or anything like that though.
Observation #3:
Couldn't destroy it. Had to go pick up the captain's telescope.
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Really man? Why do you feel the need to go there? Every... single... frakking... time...
This is your funniest post yet. As if you would accept someone picking up the telescope if only it was explicitly shown. You just said above (for the 50th time) that it would be "dumb". Why would that change if it were acted out and filmed? Obviously, demanding to be "pointed to" the scene, that we all know doesn't exist, is nothing but stalling to yet again evade explaining why it was dumb.
The reason MMoM told you to rewatch it wasn't because there was a scene you missed, but because you were basing your criticism on things that were not shown. You said they must have returned to the ship after the fact to salvage items - didn't happen. You said the evacuation was rushed - didn't happen. You said Michael's whereabouts were hidden - didn't happen. When we strip away all the nonsense that only happened in your mind during a knee-jerk reaction of "oh shit really" and "like are you kidding me" (as you recount it), all we're left with is your mantra of "dumb" and "bad" while you dodge any real honest analysis.
At least one person is literally saying that there is a policy to blow up ships after they're left behind with any possibility of enemies finding it, no exceptions. But it gets worse. @Holly Day cites Lorca's murdering of his crew to avoid being taken prisoner as evidence of the policy. Which would mean he was actually just following orders there.
Well, make up your mind, dude. Do they trash their resources or save them? And this neglects the fact that there were no functional ships left. Both fleets were wiped out, and any survivors left in escape pods. To keep the ship from rotting, or even to change their mind and blow it up, would require another mission and another starship just to do so. There is no suggestion that that ever happened, or even a reason to think it would have been plausible given that they're still fighting 6 months later.
