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Supernatural, season 11 *SPOILERS!*

But didnt Lucifer say he was there when God put Amara away? So if so then this had to be after the Leviathans.

I took you literally--you said "angels," not "archangels." It's been said that it took God and the four archangels to defeat Amara--so it's fair to assume the timeline looks something like this:


  • "In the beginning..." there was God and The Darkness
  • God creates the four Archangels
  • The five of them defeat Amara and seal her away
  • God creates the Leviathan, then seals them into Purgatory
  • God creates angel and man
  • Lucifer rebels, is cast into the Cage
And the rest, as they say, is history.

Oh ok, i always thought Archangels were just Angels with more powers and higher rank. Thought they were all created at the same time.
Thanks.
 
God and the Darkness exist
God creates the Archangels (or does he dun dun DUUUUUUUUUN!)
God seals the Darkness
God creates the Earth
God creates Eden
God creates Eve and 'man' (Leviathan)
God creates Angels
god creates humans
God sends both Eve and Leviathan to purgatory
god introduces humanity to Death, Cain kills Abel
God sends Lucifer to hell and seals Death away after he floods the Earth.
Lucifer corrupts human souls into demons and taints the human population, the corrupted souls too are sent to hell.
God leaves, Michael and Lucifer gain keys to the kingdom but have a brotherly spat that ends with Lucifer sealed in the cage.
 
Lucy's back! holy hell those eyes when he appeared.

Limbo was nicely done, Amara really is lost in just what she is and wants, but thinking about it, she's younger than any other major big bad or creature we've ever seen.

Oh an Angels being dickbags, did god accidentally spill something in the mix when he made them or did he make them that way to troll humanity?

It was always him sending Sam those messages but how was the problem. Amara appearing was that big an event it cracked things in the deepest levels of Hell?

I'm not sure if Amara doesn't want to, or just simply physically can't hurt Dean.

And whelp, there goes Ruby's knife.

Ugh, so much happened and it's weeks before we know exactly what.
 
Less than halfway through tonight's episode...one word:

EPIC.

You and I don't seem to agree often, but in this case - yes, they brung the epic.

If only season 5 had had this vibe. :devil:

There were nonetheless a few naff moments, which I will list:

-Rowena says "It's now or never" (or something) so that Sam has to go to Hell without Dean. It's a transparent ploy by the writers to keep Dean out of the scene, with no justification whatsoever.
-Crowley says "It begins." Obviously this being Supernatural this moment was meant to be kinda ironic, but it didn't really work; it was just lame.
-That second angel attacking Amara :rolleyes:
After the first angel went kerfloohey, it should have been obvious that walking slowly toward Amara by one's self was completely futile as a form of attack. Why did he do it? Because the script said.

Anyway, I hope that they somehow maintain the vibe of this episode to the end of the season.
 
One thing bothers me. Lucy could obviously control exactly what Sam saw so that he only saw Lucifer in the visions. And they summoned him, and only him, to the surrogate cage.

But he said he would be "so much smoke up there" about going topside. Does that mean his host is gone now? and that it remains only as his avatar in Hell?

That could well mean Michael can appear as Adam in Heaven and Hell, but the host body is technically gone too. Is that why they're holding off, holding back the bad news?
 
One thing bothers me. Lucy could obviously control exactly what Sam saw so that he only saw Lucifer in the visions. And they summoned him, and only him, to the surrogate cage.

But he said he would be "so much smoke up there" about going topside. Does that mean his host is gone now? and that it remains only as his avatar in Hell?

That could well mean Michael can appear as Adam in Heaven and Hell, but the host body is technically gone too. Is that why they're holding off, holding back the bad news?

Interesting idea and very possible.

Or maybe the actor that played Adam is conditionally unavailable at the moment and they're trying to leave the door open for an appearance if his schedule permits it. If anything, the script's avoidance of the Adam/Michael issue suggests that they may address his situation in some TBD way down the road.

It wouldn't surprise me if they'd reached out to the actor last season (given Adam's name drop in the 200th episode) and weren't able to secure a cameo, for whatever reason.
 
The fact that Adam was referenced in the Fan Fiction episode shows that he is still on the writers' minds, so hopefully it will be addressed before the show is over. My guess is they will recast.
 
One thing bothers me. Lucy could obviously control exactly what Sam saw so that he only saw Lucifer in the visions. And they summoned him, and only him, to the surrogate cage.

But he said he would be "so much smoke up there" about going topside. Does that mean his host is gone now? and that it remains only as his avatar in Hell?

That could well mean Michael can appear as Adam in Heaven and Hell, but the host body is technically gone too. Is that why they're holding off, holding back the bad news?

Lucifer is a Archangel so he would be blinding light, not smoke. Only demons are smoke so im not sure what Lucifer was referring to.
 
^Angels are bright blue vapour that is basically the same smoke effect coloured and the brightness turned way up.

But he's a corrupted soul and the original bearer of the Mark, so he might be some weird combination of the two.

Either way, he's implying he would be the bodiless vapour/smoke the rest of them are.
 
As far as Adam/Michael goes, this has the feeling of "she swallowed the dog to catch the cat" to it. The winter premiere trailer seems to suggest that Lucifer IS going to get out of the cage (why else would we be visiting Stull Cemetery, which as we all recall was supposed to be where Michael and Lucifer had their Ultimate Showdown), and if they open the door Michael is inevitably going to escape as well. My hunch is that the glimpse we got of "I am coming" burned into Castiel came not from God, as some have theorized, but from Lucifer, warning of his imminent return. I'm guessing that if I'm right, Michael will leave to organize the angels into an army to take down Amara, and later Lucifer, meaning we'll see him/Adam briefly in the premiere and then not again for a while.

I just can't imagine a scenario where they'd release Lucifer but leave Michael trapped. It would also be tragic if Jake Abel (the actor who played Adam) wasn't available or declined to return...but since they mentioned Michael in the season premiere, it does suggest he has a role to play this year. Here's hoping we find out what that role is sooner rather than later.
 
The giant Hellraiser arrangement of chains looks like it could be supporting a few, with some poor souls used as living links like Dean in season 3.
 
^:lol:

Me, too. I can't wait!

One of the things I love about Supernatural is that, for all the gut-wrenching angst and melodrama, they still manage to have a great sense of humor.
 
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