New episode tonights, good people. Michael Shanks guest stars. 
Supernatural 5x17 "99 Problems" discussion/spoilerish
- Thread starter Dorian Thompson
- Start date
Awwww, Dean. 
He has given up.
He has given up.
Looking back on the episodes following The End in which Dean visits the future, sadly I'm not completely surprised by Dean's decision. But I think things won't go as easy as Dean thought it would be after saying "Yes" to being Michael's vessel.
This one was just alright--it was watchable I suppose but I wasn't particularly riveted by it--caught myself checking the clock from time to time. Last week was definitely a much better episode.
One thing the episode did very well that the season overall hasn't was give us an effective glimpse into the build up to the Apocalypse via the rest of the larger world--granted it was only through a small town--but it was better than nothing. the show hasn't done as good a job creating an "End times" atmosphere--a lot of weeks I forget just what epic stakes are at play.
That really is one of the sad things about SN being stuck on CW is the limitations that result especially when it comes to a nice budget. At least it was nice seeing about dozen or so extras--most times the episodes feel deserted and just feel like they are being shot on the same empty stages. I thought it did a good job in creating a beseiged feel.
Also the atmosphere was very effective with the blue haze and mist. A very sullen mood too. Also for a change the action sequences shined instead of feeling ordinary. The teaser was nicely done dropping us in mid action.
Didn't much care for the strained attempt at humor with trying to get Castiel laid earlier in the season and didn't care for it here any better with drunk Castiel--ha ha..not! Besides I'm so tired of the whole drunk cliche. At least he could have said he just freebased or something a little less well worn.
Looks like Dean is on the verge of agreeing to be Michael's vessel so that he can end all this suffering. I didn't much care for Dean's love interest from season 3 but I guess it is appropriate.
This week's plot was not that great and that the subject matter wasn't as fully realized as it might have been. It seemed more like a fleeting plot point than anything else.
It certainly wasn't bad but not good either-- I'll call it slightly above average--B-.
One thing the episode did very well that the season overall hasn't was give us an effective glimpse into the build up to the Apocalypse via the rest of the larger world--granted it was only through a small town--but it was better than nothing. the show hasn't done as good a job creating an "End times" atmosphere--a lot of weeks I forget just what epic stakes are at play.
That really is one of the sad things about SN being stuck on CW is the limitations that result especially when it comes to a nice budget. At least it was nice seeing about dozen or so extras--most times the episodes feel deserted and just feel like they are being shot on the same empty stages. I thought it did a good job in creating a beseiged feel.
Also the atmosphere was very effective with the blue haze and mist. A very sullen mood too. Also for a change the action sequences shined instead of feeling ordinary. The teaser was nicely done dropping us in mid action.
Didn't much care for the strained attempt at humor with trying to get Castiel laid earlier in the season and didn't care for it here any better with drunk Castiel--ha ha..not! Besides I'm so tired of the whole drunk cliche. At least he could have said he just freebased or something a little less well worn.
Looks like Dean is on the verge of agreeing to be Michael's vessel so that he can end all this suffering. I didn't much care for Dean's love interest from season 3 but I guess it is appropriate.
This week's plot was not that great and that the subject matter wasn't as fully realized as it might have been. It seemed more like a fleeting plot point than anything else.
It certainly wasn't bad but not good either-- I'll call it slightly above average--B-.
Was that Sam and Cas locking Dean in Bobby's panic room in the previews? He's definitely decided to say "yes."
I don't know because I intentionally avoid trailers these days since they show waaaay too much. I like going into an episode completely ignorant of what is going to happen. So if you kind people would spoiler code anything related to upcoming eps including trailers otherwise I'll have to stay out of these threads since I avoid spoilers, leaked slides, early clips and trailers like the plague. To me any of those things completely ruin the viewing experience.
Just a warning...this is a rant response to this episode, so if you don't want to read that's fine.
OK...you know what? I hate to sound like those crazies on the TWOP forums...but I'm SICK AND TIRED of this becoming the DEAN show. WTF...we get this GREAT emotional monologue in All Hell Breaks Loose, we see Dean thrown to the brink and his emotional reaction yet they cover all of Sam's emotional recovery or non-recovery from Dean's death in a few flashbacks 5 episodes into the season. We see Dean's reactions on screen, all Sam gets is the break between seasons.
OK...I admit Jared probably couldn't pull of a scene like that one in AHBL but considering Sam isn't Dean anyway they wouldn't have to be identical, but I would have liked to see SOMETHING of what happened there. But NOOOO...it's Dean for 3/4 of that follow up episode at the opening of Season 4.
And now...this crap we see in this episode? If Dean would just open his eyes and freakin' LISTEN to Sam or Lisa he might snap out of it. So while Sam is supposed to always listen and confess to Dean, Dean gets to be a hypocrite as usual?
And while we're seeing all this internal angst for Dean...isn't Sam still being pursued by Lucifer? Why are the writers completely ignoring that there's the other side of this equation as well? What about the fact that in Dean's heaven Sam was NOTHING to his own mother? They brought up some of Sam's Lucifer problem just a little tonight with Sam's confession to Dean and Dean just goes 'meh'?
Does he WANT to end up killing Lucifer in a Sam-suit? He has absolutely NOTHING to say to the fact that he's apparently a servant of heaven? (I'm imagining his little agreement at the end of last season has to do with this, but I don't know). Who's the one acting all shirty and keeping secrets now, eh Dean?
Sorry...I love the Dean character, and he's a lot more complex than he used to be (I would hope so after 5 1/2 seasons of development) but I'm mad. Mad that they're tearing him down like they are (he's been shown to be stronger than this, the old Dean wouldn't feel so 'meh' about everything).
I'm also mad that they've been ignoring any and all development for Sam's character other than to make him remorseful for what went down at the end of season 4 and to make him look like 'the bad guy' because of what memories happened to show up in heaven.
I wish they'd stop rubbing it in that he was WRONG to want a normal, safe life, WRONG to go to college like most other 18-year-olds, WRONG to want some kind of power to save Dean from hell, when he wasn't really wrong about those at all yet supposedly he is because DEAN says so.
When does Sam get to be the good guy for a change? Never because the writers are too busy wanking off while writing Dean!angst fanfic that ends up being on TV.
OK...rant over. Maybe I should just pull out my Season 2 DVDs if I want more balanced episodes.
OK...you know what? I hate to sound like those crazies on the TWOP forums...but I'm SICK AND TIRED of this becoming the DEAN show. WTF...we get this GREAT emotional monologue in All Hell Breaks Loose, we see Dean thrown to the brink and his emotional reaction yet they cover all of Sam's emotional recovery or non-recovery from Dean's death in a few flashbacks 5 episodes into the season. We see Dean's reactions on screen, all Sam gets is the break between seasons.
OK...I admit Jared probably couldn't pull of a scene like that one in AHBL but considering Sam isn't Dean anyway they wouldn't have to be identical, but I would have liked to see SOMETHING of what happened there. But NOOOO...it's Dean for 3/4 of that follow up episode at the opening of Season 4.
And now...this crap we see in this episode? If Dean would just open his eyes and freakin' LISTEN to Sam or Lisa he might snap out of it. So while Sam is supposed to always listen and confess to Dean, Dean gets to be a hypocrite as usual?
And while we're seeing all this internal angst for Dean...isn't Sam still being pursued by Lucifer? Why are the writers completely ignoring that there's the other side of this equation as well? What about the fact that in Dean's heaven Sam was NOTHING to his own mother? They brought up some of Sam's Lucifer problem just a little tonight with Sam's confession to Dean and Dean just goes 'meh'?
Does he WANT to end up killing Lucifer in a Sam-suit? He has absolutely NOTHING to say to the fact that he's apparently a servant of heaven? (I'm imagining his little agreement at the end of last season has to do with this, but I don't know). Who's the one acting all shirty and keeping secrets now, eh Dean?
Sorry...I love the Dean character, and he's a lot more complex than he used to be (I would hope so after 5 1/2 seasons of development) but I'm mad. Mad that they're tearing him down like they are (he's been shown to be stronger than this, the old Dean wouldn't feel so 'meh' about everything).
I'm also mad that they've been ignoring any and all development for Sam's character other than to make him remorseful for what went down at the end of season 4 and to make him look like 'the bad guy' because of what memories happened to show up in heaven.
I wish they'd stop rubbing it in that he was WRONG to want a normal, safe life, WRONG to go to college like most other 18-year-olds, WRONG to want some kind of power to save Dean from hell, when he wasn't really wrong about those at all yet supposedly he is because DEAN says so.
When does Sam get to be the good guy for a change? Never because the writers are too busy wanking off while writing Dean!angst fanfic that ends up being on TV.
OK...rant over. Maybe I should just pull out my Season 2 DVDs if I want more balanced episodes.
I don't know why you say this. We saw one memory involving young Dean in the kitchen with Mary. For all we know Sam was off playing or watching tv in the young room and it wasn't like young Sam was old enough to understand what was going on the way young Dean could.--so I don't see how you could say Sam was nothing to his own mother.
I think you might be jumping the gun. We know very little of what Dean is planning or how he thinks everything will play out. Tonight's episode just sort of put the suspicion out there that Dean is considering accepting the angels' offer but the writers clearly are playing their cards close to the vest. I think we should give it a few more episodes to see exactly what's been going on with Dean.
But he isn't the old Dean anymore. Dean has been put through the wringer. Everything he has been through over the last two seasons has finally broken his spirit. That's human to not give a rat's ass anymore because you've repeatedly been beaten and worn down by a constant stream of shitty things happening to you with not even a brief respite from the onslaught nor catching a break. I mean Dean has reached out to God to intervene and Joshua tells him God doesn't care. It becomes a point where you feel all of this was for nothing. So everything we've seen in my opinion has been nothing but consistent and plausible.
Even the strongest individuals among us eventually have a breaking point. I'm sure all of us have seen strong-willed people we know--veritable forces of nature--who just couldn't maintain that sort of emotional strength in the face of overwhelming events. It is disconcerting.
I don't think the writers are trying to say it is wrong of Sam to want a normal life--they haven't made that call they've left it up to the viewers to decide. They are simply showing another perspective that someone like Dean would have--it is Dean with an issue with Sam's wanting a normal life and what that means for Dean in that life in his relationship with Sam and Dean's feeling of rejection.
Sam has been the good guy and saved the day several times this season.
Sam was nothing to his mother in Dean's heaven because his mother was only a construct of Dean's memory. Sam was an infant in that particular memory, presumably upstairs asleep in his crib. Her husband was calling to say he wasn't coming home. It was constructed on Dean's particular memory.
I agree. Dean's characterization is spot on. 40 unending years of torture. Contemplate that. That he got up in the morning for this long speaks to an inhuman strength, but every human being has a breaking point. He's not the old Dean. I like that he isn't given the Star Trek treatment. You cannot "snap out of" being a torture victim.
I agree. Dean's characterization is spot on. 40 unending years of torture. Contemplate that. That he got up in the morning for this long speaks to an inhuman strength, but every human being has a breaking point. He's not the old Dean. I like that he isn't given the Star Trek treatment. You cannot "snap out of" being a torture victim.
Female Voice: "You've reached the voicemail of..."
Castiel: "I don't understand, why... why do you want me to say my name?"
Mashes his fingers on the keypad.
TeeHeeHeeHee.
I'm kind of remembering the first 3 seasons being predominantly about Sam.
First off, the seasons aren't about one character or the other. Period.
If you can't understand that then please don't waste your time reading further.
Take an episode like season 2's Croatoan. That episodes' plot is driven by Sam visions (and his connection to the demon), but basically all that is just to start the plot. The key emotional (character) point of the story is about Dean. How Dean is changing (his not out and out killing the kid, a year earlier he would have) and how far he would go to be with Sam.
Now Dean is the primary character of the show only in the fact that he has had more dialogue more screen time (at least the start of season 4, and yes I counted and timed them to prove a frigging point to the idiots at TWOP) not in the fact that he is the primary character and that Sam is the 2nd character. But you are never going to have a complete 50/50 split of material.
Just because you are the catalyst for a story doesn't mean you are the man character of that story.
Its like saying Sauron is the main character of LOTR, he is the catalyst.
Usually episodes show both brothers (even with uneven screen time) viewpoint to showcase tow different characters that often have two different views.
Often in the first two seasons, Sam was the moral voice of the show.
As to the difference between how they handled the deaths of Sam and Dean. Sorry but on this you are dead wrong. After AHBL@, when did we see Dean dealing with his grief over losing Sam? It was all contained in one episode, the cabin scene, the scene with Bobby, and the deal. I don't recall a single other scene where Dean is dealing with that issue (the closest was in very brief passing in Heaven & Hell). With Sam we see moments of it in Lazarus Rising, we have several scenes in I know what you did last summer (Which spanned a much larger period of time), and we had several scenes over the season showing how that was the fuel for Sam's rage against Lilith.
And to add icing on the cake we had the wonderful episode Mystery Spot (well wonderful after Dean really dies) of showing how Sam deals with the loss of his brother. It was chillingly awesome.
Really the only primary death that hasn't been fairly based between the brothers was the death of John (the writers freely admit to forgetting to show Sam's reaction to this besides in the very next episode), but if you notice they have shown it some this season.
As far as Sam's actions in starting the End of Days compared to Dean's. Yes the show has focused more on Dean's attitude, but to me that reflects the characters. Sam doesn't typically lash out, Dean does. And they did address this (though it didn't feel organic to me) with both Sam rationally pointing this out to Dean (his way of typically doing things) and finally Dean admitting his own actions. Really the only time it was out of line was Castiel's lashing out to Sam in Children Are Out Future, when Sam states let's tell the kid the truth and let him decide, and Castiel castigates him for not doing that when he was told the truth. Well the fact was he wasn't ever told the truth. It was still a beautiful scene but logically he didn't track.
As for Dean being willing to take Sam out. Yeah frankly as much as both of these characters love each other, they are truly starting to see how bad things are getting. Dean's been to hell for decades and the idea of Earth being turned into Hell, has to scare him beyond the ability for an actor to portray. And we have already seen both willing to be erased from existence.
The only downside for Dean was that even if Heaven won their would be many fatalities, but nothing compared to if Lucifer won. He also experienced a world where he didn't submit, and Sam did He knows how that ends, and it isn't pretty.
He has clung to the slim hope of any chance they had. The colt, God, killing themselves.
Each day more and more shit is happening with more and more people dying.
Last nights episode had faults, but Dean's actions and reactions weren't among them in regards to giving up.
The one fault was his going to the chick in season 3, a women who he had no emotional connection to (just great sex). The only women he has had real connection with was Cassie (and I never want to see her again).
If you can't understand that then please don't waste your time reading further.
Take an episode like season 2's Croatoan. That episodes' plot is driven by Sam visions (and his connection to the demon), but basically all that is just to start the plot. The key emotional (character) point of the story is about Dean. How Dean is changing (his not out and out killing the kid, a year earlier he would have) and how far he would go to be with Sam.
Now Dean is the primary character of the show only in the fact that he has had more dialogue more screen time (at least the start of season 4, and yes I counted and timed them to prove a frigging point to the idiots at TWOP) not in the fact that he is the primary character and that Sam is the 2nd character. But you are never going to have a complete 50/50 split of material.
Just because you are the catalyst for a story doesn't mean you are the man character of that story.
Its like saying Sauron is the main character of LOTR, he is the catalyst.
Usually episodes show both brothers (even with uneven screen time) viewpoint to showcase tow different characters that often have two different views.
Often in the first two seasons, Sam was the moral voice of the show.
As to the difference between how they handled the deaths of Sam and Dean. Sorry but on this you are dead wrong. After AHBL@, when did we see Dean dealing with his grief over losing Sam? It was all contained in one episode, the cabin scene, the scene with Bobby, and the deal. I don't recall a single other scene where Dean is dealing with that issue (the closest was in very brief passing in Heaven & Hell). With Sam we see moments of it in Lazarus Rising, we have several scenes in I know what you did last summer (Which spanned a much larger period of time), and we had several scenes over the season showing how that was the fuel for Sam's rage against Lilith.
And to add icing on the cake we had the wonderful episode Mystery Spot (well wonderful after Dean really dies) of showing how Sam deals with the loss of his brother. It was chillingly awesome.
Really the only primary death that hasn't been fairly based between the brothers was the death of John (the writers freely admit to forgetting to show Sam's reaction to this besides in the very next episode), but if you notice they have shown it some this season.
As far as Sam's actions in starting the End of Days compared to Dean's. Yes the show has focused more on Dean's attitude, but to me that reflects the characters. Sam doesn't typically lash out, Dean does. And they did address this (though it didn't feel organic to me) with both Sam rationally pointing this out to Dean (his way of typically doing things) and finally Dean admitting his own actions. Really the only time it was out of line was Castiel's lashing out to Sam in Children Are Out Future, when Sam states let's tell the kid the truth and let him decide, and Castiel castigates him for not doing that when he was told the truth. Well the fact was he wasn't ever told the truth. It was still a beautiful scene but logically he didn't track.
As for Dean being willing to take Sam out. Yeah frankly as much as both of these characters love each other, they are truly starting to see how bad things are getting. Dean's been to hell for decades and the idea of Earth being turned into Hell, has to scare him beyond the ability for an actor to portray. And we have already seen both willing to be erased from existence.
The only downside for Dean was that even if Heaven won their would be many fatalities, but nothing compared to if Lucifer won. He also experienced a world where he didn't submit, and Sam did He knows how that ends, and it isn't pretty.
He has clung to the slim hope of any chance they had. The colt, God, killing themselves.
Each day more and more shit is happening with more and more people dying.
Last nights episode had faults, but Dean's actions and reactions weren't among them in regards to giving up.
The one fault was his going to the chick in season 3, a women who he had no emotional connection to (just great sex). The only women he has had real connection with was Cassie (and I never want to see her again).
*sighs* Now that I've had a day to cool off and read all your replies I know I over-reacted, and I knew at the time. I was just upset by the ending of the episode.
I've always thought the best part of the show IS the brother's relationship. It's sad that it's gotten to the point that Dean feels he can't even talk to Sam AGAIN, especially over something he didn't have control over. In general the show is fairly well balanced, but it does seem like they focus on one character's development over the other, especially these last two seasons at times.
I also understand the whole hell torture thing isn't something to just get over quickly, and that's part of what's feeding into Dean's attitude now but still. There are some other issues that he should have built a bridge over and it seems ridiculous that he still lets himself be hurt by them, more specifically Sam's going to college and their Dad leading them on that wild-goose chase first season. Sam's stuck around when he could have left by now, so he should realize Sam's NOT going to abandon him again, if they separate it would be mutual (like earlier this season). Him just running off when he specifically TOLD Sam he wouldn't leave just seems like such a...cold, hurtful move (especially after last week's show of breaking his loss of faith in his relationship with his brother) that it seems out of character for him to do this on purpose. Also for him to abandon what support he does have, and to leave both the others of Team Free Will in such fragile states seems cruel as well. I thought he was the one that valued family?
I understand...he feels lost at the moment, but he's feeling lost over the wrong things. I didn't think he was really counting on Cas finding god as a real solution anyway, so why is he suddenly so broken up about it now?
I think I just empathize with the Sam character more because I am the youngest in my family and can see things from a younger sibling perspective better in a way. I've also seen characters I've liked destroyed by writers who wanted to further a certain plot point and I really don't want to see that happen to Sam (OK...so I admit, it was another JPad character, Dean on Gilmore Girls, but I also didn't like what those writers did with Rory in the end either, that and what Rowling did to Hermione's character in the Harry Potter series as well, even on House what they've done to House himself lately has kinda bothered me).
So, yeah, and i have a history of overreacting to what I know is just fiction and fictional characters. Sorry.
Perhaps I'm just too idealistic and like things too static at times, I liked the vibe of first and second season of Supernatural better than these later seasons. It's...sucky to feel depressed after watching an episode of a show. I guess that's why we've seen some more 'light' episodes earlier in the season, to make up for these ultra-depressing later episodes.
In the end I'd also hoped (hope) that Team Free Will can find a way around either of the Winchesters saying yes. It goes against the basic, stubborn nature of both their characters. I can't believe after how vehement he was earlier in the season, and seeing how much of a dick both Zacharia and Michael are that Dean would even CONSIDER saying yes. Sure they've taken some hits, especially with the loss of Ellen and Jo, but I still don't get why give Zacharia the pleasure of being right?
Anyway...sorry about both these rants. I just hope that maybe, just maybe, Castiel, Sam and Bobby can talk some sense into Dean before he does something "Michael stupid".
I've always thought the best part of the show IS the brother's relationship. It's sad that it's gotten to the point that Dean feels he can't even talk to Sam AGAIN, especially over something he didn't have control over. In general the show is fairly well balanced, but it does seem like they focus on one character's development over the other, especially these last two seasons at times.
I also understand the whole hell torture thing isn't something to just get over quickly, and that's part of what's feeding into Dean's attitude now but still. There are some other issues that he should have built a bridge over and it seems ridiculous that he still lets himself be hurt by them, more specifically Sam's going to college and their Dad leading them on that wild-goose chase first season. Sam's stuck around when he could have left by now, so he should realize Sam's NOT going to abandon him again, if they separate it would be mutual (like earlier this season). Him just running off when he specifically TOLD Sam he wouldn't leave just seems like such a...cold, hurtful move (especially after last week's show of breaking his loss of faith in his relationship with his brother) that it seems out of character for him to do this on purpose. Also for him to abandon what support he does have, and to leave both the others of Team Free Will in such fragile states seems cruel as well. I thought he was the one that valued family?
I understand...he feels lost at the moment, but he's feeling lost over the wrong things. I didn't think he was really counting on Cas finding god as a real solution anyway, so why is he suddenly so broken up about it now?
I think I just empathize with the Sam character more because I am the youngest in my family and can see things from a younger sibling perspective better in a way. I've also seen characters I've liked destroyed by writers who wanted to further a certain plot point and I really don't want to see that happen to Sam (OK...so I admit, it was another JPad character, Dean on Gilmore Girls, but I also didn't like what those writers did with Rory in the end either, that and what Rowling did to Hermione's character in the Harry Potter series as well, even on House what they've done to House himself lately has kinda bothered me).
So, yeah, and i have a history of overreacting to what I know is just fiction and fictional characters. Sorry.
Perhaps I'm just too idealistic and like things too static at times, I liked the vibe of first and second season of Supernatural better than these later seasons. It's...sucky to feel depressed after watching an episode of a show. I guess that's why we've seen some more 'light' episodes earlier in the season, to make up for these ultra-depressing later episodes.
In the end I'd also hoped (hope) that Team Free Will can find a way around either of the Winchesters saying yes. It goes against the basic, stubborn nature of both their characters. I can't believe after how vehement he was earlier in the season, and seeing how much of a dick both Zacharia and Michael are that Dean would even CONSIDER saying yes. Sure they've taken some hits, especially with the loss of Ellen and Jo, but I still don't get why give Zacharia the pleasure of being right?
Anyway...sorry about both these rants. I just hope that maybe, just maybe, Castiel, Sam and Bobby can talk some sense into Dean before he does something "Michael stupid".
I liked the first season too. I thought the stories were entertaining and lenjoyed both leads esp Dean who wasn't the snarky prick that he became in later seasons. Loved Missouri, Loved John, Loved Meg, loved the mystery of YED, loved the prevalence of classic rock soundtracks. I thought it did a fairly good job in balancing char w/ plot as well as making their monsters of the week standalones semi-fresh--if they are going to do one-offs give me those of the first season(Scarecrow, Faith etc).
Really my favorite seasons are 4 and 1. Season 5 has been not very good in my opnion. Sure the myth episodes like "The End", "Children are Our Future", "Abandon All Hope", "My Bloody Valentine" have been standout 3.5 or 4 star episodes but the rest were disposable barring a quick intro of a future seed or a fleeting character moment but not enough to cobble together a solid hour. *Maybe* I'll change my opinion when I rewatch it this summer and can look at the Big Picture and see everything in context. I'm known to do that from time to time esp when I can go in with adjusted expectations and a better appreciation for how everything fits.
I still think this should be the final season.
Really my favorite seasons are 4 and 1. Season 5 has been not very good in my opnion. Sure the myth episodes like "The End", "Children are Our Future", "Abandon All Hope", "My Bloody Valentine" have been standout 3.5 or 4 star episodes but the rest were disposable barring a quick intro of a future seed or a fleeting character moment but not enough to cobble together a solid hour. *Maybe* I'll change my opinion when I rewatch it this summer and can look at the Big Picture and see everything in context. I'm known to do that from time to time esp when I can go in with adjusted expectations and a better appreciation for how everything fits.
I still think this should be the final season.
Season 2 is much better than season 1. So very much better. I'll never get the affection people have for season 1, but different strokes and all. Startrekwatcher, this season (with the exception of the very bad "Swap Meat" and "The Curious Case of Dean Winchester") holds up extremely well if watched in a marathon. I have it all on DVD. All the pieces are going to be needed.
Sure all the pieces are going to be needed but my first reaction to a lot of episodes this season was they were not good solid episodes and most of the time the only thing worthwhile to come out of them was a brief mention or seeding of a plot point or character i.e, Crowley at the tail end of "The Real Ghostbusters"--the rest I could have done without so I basically watched an episode for a 2 minute scene.
Ideally I prefer an episode to be enjoyable and have many worthwhile aspects not just one element. Either cram it full of all sorts of stuff much like Lost(new mysteries, new character dynamics, seed clues, dip into a thread, advance the plot, throw in some interesting revelations, anchor it down with an emotional core etc) don't use a precious hour as a mere vehicle for introducing a 2 minute element that will be exploited later i.e. "Changing Channels". Also a a scene here or there focusing on character is welcomed but it will never be enough to compensate for an hour that has numerous other flaws--which was the case a great deal of the time this season I thought.
I have so far felt that there hasn't been a consistently good hour through and through, scene to scene that wasn't a mixed bag except for the myth episodes. Those were the only thoroughly engaging episodes this season. I have my doubts that when I rewatch it that will come together as seamlessly and beautifully as say Heroes in season one or Lost where when you step back and look at how everything was constructed and how everything came together it is just an amazing realization. SN has just had too many chugholes and the season hasn't been as smooth as I would have liked but we'll see.
Oh, I think season four was better overall and flowed more coherently, but we'll have to agree to disagree about season five. Next week is the 100th episode. It's supposed to be a huge mythology ep. Me? I have a late sales meeting I can't get out of so I'll have to DVR and watch later, darnit.
Alicia, don't worry about sounding like the TWOPers. They've moved on to a new psychosis. Apparently, a few of them were offended at Dean's joke about "pimping the whore" since they were dealing with the mythical "Whore of Babylon" this week. Dean, having been raised in an ivory tower and having attended high brow ivy league universities, should be more politically correct when it comes to female supernatural creatures.
They just look and look and look for things to be offended at. The copious blood and guts? No problem.
Alicia, don't worry about sounding like the TWOPers. They've moved on to a new psychosis. Apparently, a few of them were offended at Dean's joke about "pimping the whore" since they were dealing with the mythical "Whore of Babylon" this week. Dean, having been raised in an ivory tower and having attended high brow ivy league universities, should be more politically correct when it comes to female supernatural creatures.
They just look and look and look for things to be offended at. The copious blood and guts? No problem.Similar threads
