Superman
- Thread starter urbandefault
- Start date
I'll admit that I had no idea about C.J. (I fell off most of the CW stuff a while ago, and she didn't come up in my rudimentary search) and I avoided having "briefly younger" versions listed, but looking at the wiki she does seem to cross the line from "young cameo" into being the character fully.
I also spaced completely on Smallville Cat 1.0 who also wasn't on the list I found online.
I shall update the Cat graphic ASAP.
I thought about Smallville Cat 1.0 also, but within the show's own continuity she explicitly isn't the same character as 2.0, who is clearly the series' "official" Cat Grant. It's a judgment call, but I personally think she's better omitted for that reason.
And BTW, Helm is actually a blast as "CJ," and that two-parter is one of the few highlights of Supergirl's final couple of seasons. I'd recommend checking it out, or at least searching up some clips on YouTube of Helm's turn in the role. (Those episodes also feature the return of the two excellent young actresses who played young Kara and Alex in the third season's "Midvale," and have some great comedic work by Nicole Maines and Jesse Rath as Nia and Brainy.)
ETA: Oh, I see you've already done the update. Looks nice. I withdraw any further nitpicking.
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The thing with Cat 1.0 is that she was clearly meant to be the show's version of Cat Grant when they did it, and only in hindsight did they decide to do another version of the character, which made it necessary to basically retcon Cat 1.0 into an original character.
Which, to my knowledge, is unprecedented, and I'm not aware of such a case happening since. The closest I'm aware of is S&L, but there the producers decided the whole show was set in a different universe. In all of media, the closest would be the Wallace/Wally West in the post-New 52 comics, but even that had a narrative reason (the reestablishing of legacy in the DC Universe).
I also can't figure out why they did this. There was nothing particularly wrong with Cat 1.0 that would have compelled anybody to retcon it. My best guess is they got the pitch for the Cat 2.0 episode, liked it, but then remembered they already did Cat 1.0, so they decided to just handwave it.
But then, I have never rewatched those later seasons of SV (and even the early seasons I haven't rewatched in over a decade), so I may have forgotten something horribly wrong with Cat 1.0.
And, hey, I just remembered SV did another character mulligon with Professor Hamilton. They did him pretty early on as a quasi-adversary, portrayed by Joe Morton, but killed him off rather quickly, and then decided in the later seasons they wanted to actually do him as an ally, so the Morton version became Steven Hamilton, a retroactively original character (sounds like an oxymoron, but that's what it was), and the new version got the comics accurate name Emil Hamilton.
Also not sure if the fake Kara qualifies for this category, either. The producers probably didn't think the show was going to last long enough to introduce the real Kara.
Man, that show was messed up.
Which, to my knowledge, is unprecedented, and I'm not aware of such a case happening since. The closest I'm aware of is S&L, but there the producers decided the whole show was set in a different universe. In all of media, the closest would be the Wallace/Wally West in the post-New 52 comics, but even that had a narrative reason (the reestablishing of legacy in the DC Universe).
I also can't figure out why they did this. There was nothing particularly wrong with Cat 1.0 that would have compelled anybody to retcon it. My best guess is they got the pitch for the Cat 2.0 episode, liked it, but then remembered they already did Cat 1.0, so they decided to just handwave it.
But then, I have never rewatched those later seasons of SV (and even the early seasons I haven't rewatched in over a decade), so I may have forgotten something horribly wrong with Cat 1.0.
And, hey, I just remembered SV did another character mulligon with Professor Hamilton. They did him pretty early on as a quasi-adversary, portrayed by Joe Morton, but killed him off rather quickly, and then decided in the later seasons they wanted to actually do him as an ally, so the Morton version became Steven Hamilton, a retroactively original character (sounds like an oxymoron, but that's what it was), and the new version got the comics accurate name Emil Hamilton.
Also not sure if the fake Kara qualifies for this category, either. The producers probably didn't think the show was going to last long enough to introduce the real Kara.
Man, that show was messed up.
It kinda was, and only the first three seasons are really very consistently good IMO. But damned if I don't love the whole silly ramshackle mess anyway.
They were all in the very first episode. Briefly.
[Edit] Done!
Don't! Nitpicking is what leads to discussion, and I'm happy to be convinced of who should make it to the graphic or not. I just reserve the right to not be convinced sometimes. Or to be just too lazy to bother.
...It's all about making an image that invites thoughts and possibly questions...but without delving into the dreaded "played the young version for part of one episode" territory.
I did not include Terence Stamp (voice only), George Lazenby (fake), or John Glover, but I did let Welling sneak in.
...Nelson Leigh looks like Patrick Stewart with hair.
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Dare I point out, in that case, that Izabela Vidovic played young Kara not just "for part of one episode," but basically for three entire episodes, plus another flashback appearance?Don't! Nitpicking is what leads to discussion, and I'm happy to be convinced of who should make it to the graphic or not. I just reserve the right to not be convinced sometimes. Or to be just too lazy to bother.
...It's all about making an image that invites thoughts and possibly questions...but without delving into the dreaded "played the young version for part of one episode" territory.
She actually logged a good bit more screen time as Kara than Helm did as "CJ."
My only problem there is, I'd also have to start adding all those young Lexes and Lanas from Smallville.
I think my main goal is to stick to "main versions" as much as possible.
Helm (as far as I understand it) kind of was the only Cat at that point due to Flockhart's skedaddle, so she seems a legit inclusion. (He says, with no actual experience with the material.) Whereas Izabela was (I assume) still just playing "young Kara".
So I should remove Helm after all?
I think my main goal is to stick to "main versions" as much as possible.
Helm (as far as I understand it) kind of was the only Cat at that point due to Flockhart's skedaddle, so she seems a legit inclusion. (He says, with no actual experience with the material.) Whereas Izabela was (I assume) still just playing "young Kara".
It's all your judgment call, but including Helm does open up a can of worms. Vidovic probably has more screen time as Kara than any other "younger version" of any character. Hell, she likely got more screen time in the role than Sasha Calle did (sad to say). The only reason to include Helm and exclude her would be that Helm was playing an adult, so maybe the easiest thing would be just to establish a blanket "no kid versions" policy.
Either you snuck this in as an edit or I just missed it. So no, this isn't exactly the case. The sixth season's "Prom Night!"/"Prom Again!" two-parter was a time travel story, basically included as one of the show's workarounds for Benoist's pregnancy. Nia and Brainy travel to the past because of reasons, and encounter young Kara and Alex, as well as the Cat Grant of that time period, who goes by "CJ" and is still working for the Planet. So really, for purposes of those episodes, Vidovic and Helm are fulfilling similar functions: Both of their characters' "regular" actresses were indeed unavailable, but in-story, both needed to be younger versions played by younger actresses anyway.
I guess I was confused because one of the wikis talks about CJ's story taking place in an alternate timeline as opposed to just being flashbacks to Cat's youth.
Here's to putting more effort into this than it deserves!
Or more specifically, maybe no young versions if the character has already appeared as an older version? (Or does that remove any legit appearances...I will have to check.)so maybe the easiest thing would be just to establish a blanket "no kid versions" policy.
Here's to putting more effort into this than it deserves!
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With all the hits he took to the head, he just picked names he could remember.
Anson Mount is named after his father. His older brother, Anson Mount, is also named after their father. Their father, Anson Mount, is named after his father. So, there's that.
I'm not seeing a pattern.Anson Mount is named after his father. His older brother, Anson Mount, is also named after their father. Their father, Anson Mount, is named after his father. So, there's that.
Lucas Grabeel is in far less Smallville than I recall, but he got into the cast as My Adventures with Superman, but not as Lex Luthor. That's a weird idea.
Oh, I don't remember them at all.
Martha also appears in flashbacks in the first-season episodes "The Best of Smallville" and "A Brief Reminiscence In-Between Cataclysmic Events." Perry is in the latter episode as well, also in a flashback.
They were all in the very first episode. Briefly.
[Edit] Done!
Don't! Nitpicking is what leads to discussion, and I'm happy to be convinced of who should make it to the graphic or not. I just reserve the right to not be convinced sometimes. Or to be just too lazy to bother.
...It's all about making an image that invites thoughts and possibly questions...but without delving into the dreaded "played the young version for part of one episode" territory.
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Robert Rockwell looks like he could play Captain Marvel.
Or Christopher Pike
