Spoilers Supergirl - Season 1

[Arrrrgggh]

Riiiiight. I'm sure the only reason women make up only 4% of CEOs of Fortune 500 companies is because there are just aren't enough women out there who are as motivated and hard working as the 96% of male CEOs.

The fact is there doesn't have to be a policy against these things because the people in charge just naturally hire and gravitate toward those of their own race all on their own. Which is why we see studies like the ones where people with a white sounding name often get hired over those with a black sounding name, despite having the exact same resume.

Feel free to keep living in your little bubble of world conspiracies. Very little can change a fanatic's irrational outlook on the world.]

Still waiting for the example I asked for, by the way. Of all the horrible oppression gays and minorities suffer in the publishing world. (You know, that field where your appearance and sexuality has exactly zero impact on anything unless you make it an issue yourself.)

 

[DarKush]

Arrrgggh,

To me the accusations about living in a bubble that you're throwing at Davejames sounds like they could be applied to you. I do think your race and gender do play a role in the publishing game. For one, for appearance that's going to be seen on the back cover of the book, if not recognized by your name, and perhaps by your subject matter.

I think of the black erotic writer Zane. She was around long before E.L. James but James is making tons of bank and while Zane has parlayed her books into a television shows and at least feature film (Addicted), its nowhere near the juggernaut that James has with her 50 Shades series. Also for example there are black horror and sci-fi writers out there, perhaps black writers in just about every genre but they aren't getting the same opportunities. Now you can counter with these books aren't as 'good' as books by white writers but that's subjective, and who is making those marketing and branding decisions that put certain books and authors out there, it's more than likely white males who are making those decisions.

I did a quick search online and found some articles that seem pertinent to the discussion. It's up to you to read them or glance at them, but I would hope that before declaring the publishing industry free of racism and sexism you consider some other voices with maybe a different view or opinion.

http://www.pen.org/conversation/editorial-roundtable-diversity-equity-publishing
http://review.gawker.com/the-difficulties-of-publishing-while-black-1648538247/all
http://brooklynbased.com/blog/2013/...ers-weigh-in-on-sexism-in-the-literary-world/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/brooke-warner/the-book-industrys-discri_b_7319016.html
http://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/...ok-industry-diversity-21st-century-style.html

 

[DarKush]

Really? Other than stuff published by hate groups, please name a single mainstream publishing house that has a "only hetreosexual white Caucasian male writers accepted" policy.

This victim complex is really ridiculous in this day and age. With very, very few exceptions, the only reasons minorities don't show up in various fields is because they're not bothering with it. No one in Hollywood is saying "sorry, we don't do colored films here," corporate America doesn't have a "nope, no chicks allowed to be CEOs sowwies" bylaw, and Washington D.C. doesn't have a "sorry, no queers allowed to run for President" law in place. It's preposterous. If white heterosexual males have any advantage it's that those who do get far in lfie didn't inherently sabotage themselves by giving up before even bothering to try. You know, just like all the minorities, homosexuals, and women out there who've gotten far in life haven't either.

And before you make assumptions, which I'm sure you already have, I'm a woman with a black mother and Latin father, and a very well-paying job. So I do have some idea of where I'm coming from here.

I'm a black man with a master's degree and a good-paying job, perhaps a person you might consider who didn't 'sabotage' themselves and I know enough to realize that racism continues to plague this nation, in overt and covert ways. The racial disparities remain stark. Now the simplistic, IMO, response is to declare anyone who points this out or is not happy about it as insane (like the slaveowners used to declare slaves who ran away as suffering from drapetomania or steeped some deep into 'victimology' that they are essentially making it all up and there are no barriers. It's a simple reply that rationalizes and justifies not doing anything about existing inequities or making you feel more comfortable with the status quo.

It's easy not to be 'sabotaged' when you've never been considered the problem. Or when people have no problem giving you loans or hiring you for jobs, or even letting you walk down the street without being stopped and frisked, or when cabs actually stop for you, etc., etc.

I would argue that many non-white males along with some white males who have 'gotten far in life' also realize we have some serious work left to do in this country. Dividing it into 'winners' and 'losers' without taking into context the historical cauldron of prejudice faced by many groups and the economic straits faced by many classes along with present day problems is an unfortunate way of thinking to say the least.

 

[USS Triumphant]

The only people who feel threatened by that are people who've invested in maintaining a social order that harms minorities.

Well, them, and also those of us who haven't been invested in that but have, instead, sought an egalitarian society - but that happen to look like the people you are talking about. Having seen how irrational the people you're talking about are, it is unfortunate but reasonable to believe that the pendulum will not stop at a nice, balanced bottom, but will instead swing up on the other side, with people who are interested in revenge, or at the least, having their turn on top, rather than equality for all in charge.

Overall, white male Christians are still the dominant group - for now. But you can already see a tendency toward what I'm describing on a small scale in some areas where other groups dominate the local power structure. The white male Christians may be bigoted a*holes - but they aren't wrong to be afraid of other groups gaining power. They have better reasons than most to know how shitty humanity of every race is, because they look in a mirror everyday. And they know exactly what bed they've made, and they don't want to ever lie in it.

 

[Christopher]

And they know exactly what bed they've made, and they don't want to ever lie in it.

Just my point. If they'd worked toward equality in the first place, they'd have nothing to fear. Mature people should be able to recognize that helping others helps themselves.

The vengeful, extremist types are not the majority of any group -- but they do have a tendency to take over when the rest of us let them. Which is why it's so important for the rest of us to stand up for a better way, rather than buying into the self-fulfilling myth that we can't change things for the better.

 

[JD]

I have watched six episodes last year in summer but didn't watch any more. You better ask: what did not insult it. I remember the most idiotic things. I may be wrong in details :

- Like this Oktavia f.e. (I checked her name) She lived for sixteen years in a cupboard or under the floor. First thing she does when she arrives on earth is to jump in the nearest lake. Where did she learn to swim? Do they have a pool on board, which she visited secretly at night? I thought they were short of oxygen.

- They send 100 young people - their genetic future - down to earth after a nucelar holocaust but they forget to give them a communication device or a contermination meter.

- How were those juvenile deliquents able to act like lifelong pathfinders anyway? They were all prisoners (it's a tiny space station but enough space for prisoncells I guess) but on earth they can build camps.

- Why would people that are forced to live on a spacestation kill the technical personal? In one of those episodes the cliche evil guy wanted to kill the main doctor of the station. Who would do the doctor work then? One of the next generation? ups, no, they were sent to earth to die.

- And they have no air on their station but they execute people by throwing them out of the airlock? Still enough air for that I guess.

There were so many things that didn't make any sense. That show was obvioulsy written for the sole purpose of showing beautiful 20 year old (playing even younger ones) running though woods and crying about their relationsship to their parents and having some love drama.
So after six or seven episodes I lost interest to watch more of it.

Comparing to that Supergirl is pure intellectual gold.

Those don't bother me, because it was never meant to be a viable survey mission -- just an excuse to rid the Ark of undesirables so that the remaining inhabitants could have a few more months of life support. It would've been too unpopular to say outright "We're executing a hundred teenagers," so the Ark leaders dressed it up as a mission to repopulate the surface, one that they expected to fail utterly.

My main problems with The 100 are, one, that they kept killing off black and Asian characters disproportionately, or else casting actors of color mainly as primitive savages and exotic others (and then killing them off too), and two, that the show embraced constant death and bloodshed and torture and cruelty as their primary go-to plot devices, relying on shock rather than substance. I think they're trying to mimic The Hunger Games, but failing to realize that the violence and sadism in THG are a means to a thematic end, not an end in themselves.

Well there's your problem right there. It started out OK, with some issues like you pointed out, but has gone on to become absolutely fricking amazing.
It's moved way beyond pretty much all of the kind of issues you mentioned.
It is one of the most dark, and grim shows on TV right now, I won't deny that, but if you can deal with that it really is great. I admit, I don't always like that kind of stuff, but The 100 is good enough that I can still enjoy it.

How The 100 Became A Fantastic Show While You Weren't Watching from Io9, and These Fascinating Characters Are The Reason The 100 Is A Must Watch Show, also from Io9. These two articles show exactly why The 100 has become one of my favorite shows. Inho, you specifically call out Octavia (with a c not a k), but she has gone on the have one of the most interesting arcs on the show, and is one of my favorite character.

 

[Neroon]

DarKush and Arrrrgggh.... actually everybody who has gone off on the tangent, please dial it back and return to the topic at hand. Your last couple of posts have veered considerably away from the discussion and are becoming far too personal in their approach.

An additional note... please remember to use the Multi-quote function (+ Quote) or the Edit function to combine consecutive posts. It may seem a little thing but it does help prevent one person from dominating the activity in a given thread.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Alex thought that "Winn and Kara" was a good idea, or at least that it wasn't a bad idea.

Jimmy bowed out to give Winn a shot, because love that pure has to be respected... Unless Jimmy was allowing Winn the opportunity to disqualify himself.

Cat at least said something about Winn being the property of Kara.

AND YET STILL, Winn was an idiot for not planning a more softly, softly approach.

 

[ihno]

How The 100 Became A Fantastic Show While You Weren't Watching from Io9, and These Fascinating Characters Are The Reason The 100 Is A Must Watch Show, also from Io9. These two articles show exactly why The 100 has become one of my favorite shows. Inho, you specifically call out Octavia (with a c not a k), but she has gone on the have one of the most interesting arcs on the show, and is one of my favorite character.

I will give it a thought if ever I'm very bored. I will look for how long that shows goes and if it has an open ending or not. Sorry for misspelling Octavia and thank you for spelling me correctly.

 

[DarKush]

DarKush and Arrrrgggh.... actually everybody who has gone off on the tangent, please dial it back and return to the topic at hand. Your last couple of posts have veered considerably away from the discussion and are becoming far too personal in their approach.

An additional note... please remember to use the Multi-quote function (+ Quote) or the Edit function to combine consecutive posts. It may seem a little thing but it does help prevent one person from dominating the activity in a given thread.

I entered the fray because I saw something that was said that didn't feel right to let it pass. So I commented on it. I actually don't see it as something that veers off from the topic much because the show Supergirl does talk about identity issues and barriers, gender and to a much lesser extent race. I decided to provide some biography for myself because Arrrrgggh did the same, hopefully in the effort to show that not everyone in the group that Arrrgggh talked about, perhaps "championed" is the wrong word, is not on board with Arrrgggh's view of things.

 

[1001001]

Just wanted to pop in and say how much I love this show. Benoist is perfectly cast, and may just be the most adorable person on TV right now (at least until Kimmy Schmidt returns). I think the humor, tension, and action are perfectly mixed, and the f/x are pretty damned good for a TV show. You have some romantic stuff but it doesn't bog things down too much.

Now that the bad guy knows who she is, I think they have a lot of room for interesting stories and conflicts.

Supergirl is probably my favorite new show of the year.

 

[JD]

I will give it a thought if ever I'm very bored. I will look for how long that shows goes and if it has an open ending or not. Sorry for misspelling Octavia and thank you for spelling me correctly.

Spelling mistakes like that are a pet peeve of mine, and I always try to make sure I spell thing like that correctly.

 

[ihno]

Spelling mistakes like that are a pet peeve of mine, and I always try to make sure I spell thing like that correctly.

I'm not a thing, I'm a person!!! But seriously: yes, typos happen, I know.

 

[Turd Ferguson]

I haven't posted in this thread yet, but while a lot of the plotlines are goofy and there's a sort of amateurish quality to the production design, I do enjoy the show. Agreed Melissa Benoist is adorable and Calista Flockhart is amusing as Cat Grant. I didn't care much for the Hank Henshaw actor at first, as I felt they really wanted Lance Reddick but couldn't afford him, so they hired the poor man's version. But, I've since grown accustomed to him and have been enjoying the character more, especially after the reveal of his true identity a few episodes back.

The part the cracked me up more than it really should have award goes to Hank Henshaw impersonating Peter Facinelli talking to his assistant in the last episode. "Agent Danvers was a lovely woman it was my narcissistic ego and unkempt facial hair."

 

[davejames]

Just wanted to pop in and say how much I love this show. Benoist is perfectly cast, and may just be the most adorable person on TV right now (at least until Kimmy Schmidt returns). I think the humor, tension, and action are perfectly mixed, and the f/x are pretty damned good for a TV show. You have some romantic stuff but it doesn't bog things down too much.

Now that the bad guy knows who she is, I think they have a lot of room for interesting stories and conflicts.

Supergirl is probably my favorite new show of the year.

Agreed on all counts.

 

[Christopher]

I didn't care much for the Hank Henshaw actor at first, as I felt they really wanted Lance Reddick but couldn't afford him, so they hired the poor man's version.

Well, that's rather harsh, considering that David Harewood's acting career began six years before Reddick's and their filmographies are comparable in size. It's just that Harewood is an English actor and so he isn't as well-known in the states (although he appeared in Doctor Who's "The End of Time" and played Tuck in the third season of the 2006 Robin Hood series, as well as being a regular in the first two seasons of Showtime's Homeland).

 

[Dick Whitman]

"Hank" is one of the biggest pleasant surprises of this whole series. Not just him being Martian Manhunter either. Even once that was revealed I never expected to see him using his powers so much as often as we have. Never thought we would see J'onn in his full alien form flying in daylight next to Supergirl.

Obviously much of that was done in CGI. But I wonder if David Harewood contributed anything other than his voice? Normal walking and taking scenes he is probably on set for the other actors to interact with before he is replace by the CGI character.

 

[tomalak301]

Just wanted to pop in and say how much I love this show. Benoist is perfectly cast, and may just be the most adorable person on TV right now (at least until Kimmy Schmidt returns). I think the humor, tension, and action are perfectly mixed, and the f/x are pretty damned good for a TV show. You have some romantic stuff but it doesn't bog things down too much.

Now that the bad guy knows who she is, I think they have a lot of room for interesting stories and conflicts.

Supergirl is probably my favorite new show of the year.

We need more good adorable strong perky characters on tv. It just makes me happy when they are on the screen. The comparison between Kara and Kimmy Schmidt is a nice one.

 

[JD]

I have to agree. It seems like often when we get these kinds of characters, they tend to be very serious. Supergirl is nice proof that that doesn't always have to be the case.
I've been wondering if they're going to also use makeup for scenes where J'Onn's in his Martian form but not shapeshifter or using his powers, or if he's always going to be 100% CG when he's in his Martian form.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Eh, I don't think it's "reverse discrimination" or "misandry" to point out the very real and true fact that white males in this country (whether they're aware of it or not) have a huge societal advantage over every other group out there

Its reverse discrimination / misandry for nearly every SG script to have Cat or another female character whine on an on about men as if they are the Great Oppressive Evil to All Women. If the SG producers wanted to sell Cat (or Lucy's) feeling, that could have been handled in one episode--much like James talking about being a black man having to avoid displaying anger (because of stereotypes / misconceptions of black males in America), was handled with one scene.

One.

He did not need to go on and on about it--making stabbing comments about race, but thanks to the SG producers having a juvenile, politicized of feminism, female characters are on a episode-by-episode soapbox that viewers are noticing (see the IMDB boards for the series).

It may not be something pointed out on a lot of other TV shows, but that doesn't mean it's a problem that doesn't exist or shouldn't be pointed out at all. And to me Supergirl seems like as appropriate a place as any to do that.

You completely missed the point of referencing Criminal Minds--in a show closer to reality than SG will ever be, female characters are head and shoulders better developed working in a field (FBI) that is still predominately male and/or male centric. Each CM female character is unique with well considered backgrounds, but none are going on and on in every episode with whining that--frankly--comes off like the character(s) seek to reverse whatever mistreatment experienced in the past. Their identity and achievement is clear in their characterization, instead of ranting/whining. Further, Lucy Lane's stabbing remark to her own boyfriend was utterly unjustified, and in this politicized climate, if the roles were reversed, there would be a month of Huffington Post articles accusing the series of infantilizing / abusing women.

Other than the usual Social Justice Warriors justifying the obvious one-sided agenda in the series, none have offered a coherent address of why the questioned behavior appears in nearly all episodes of SG. That requires facts, not replying with agenda leading the way.