This right here, the presumed 32nd century setting is turning people off. Discovery didn't do a good job making it an era people were excited to find out more about.
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This right here, the presumed 32nd century setting is turning people off. Discovery didn't do a good job making it an era people were excited to find out more about.
I don't care about the era.
I care about the people. If the show gives me interesting characters in the 32nd century (like Vance did for Discovery) then I'm all in. I'm not in to Trek for made up data points or history.
I care about the people. If the show gives me interesting characters in the 32nd century (like Vance did for Discovery) then I'm all in. I'm not in to Trek for made up data points or history.
I love Vance.
And I wish we could have seen Vance interact with a more familiar setting. Him being in the 32nd century just completely separates him from the rest of the series so much so that it might as well be a different show.
It's not about made up history. It's about the story.
For instance: Discovery has basically the same plot as Andromeda, but Discovery succeeded because we KNEW THE HISTORY of the Federation. It was just as made up as Andromeda's, but as an audience we were invested in it and what it meant.
On the other side of that coin, though, we're cut off from that history. When I watch Discovery, when I see a Changeling or a Ferengi, my first thought is "Well, what have they been doing for 1000 years?" Everyone wants to know where the Klingons are. We want to know what happened, and that detracts from the story they are trying to tell.
You care about Ni'Var because you know the history of the Romulans and the Vulcans. Don't try to tell me you don't care about made-up history, because that is the backbone of every series of Star Trek since the original series.
Yes, and it's a great story.
Nope, I don't.
I am glad they are reunited, but that's because it connects to Burnham and Spock, characters I care about, not because of a "where are they now?" type situation.
If the story is making me go, "Hmmm...where are the Klingons?" then the story has failed on numerous fronts for me.
No, I don't care about the Klingons, and when I was watching Discovery in the 32nd Century I was engaged with Burnham and crew not "Where are...?" Because that wasn't the story being told.
Same.
I'm on board for Legacy, but I would also be on board for a Legacyish show. I don't care if we have all the TNG people around, and I actually thought the idea that like, EVERYONE'S kids would be involved was alittle contrived.
I want a Captain Seven show set in that universe/period. The rest of the specifics I can leave up in the air.
I feel like that would be at least addressed in a Legacy-type show. Not sure about Sisko leaving the wormhole... Brooks almost certainly isn't coming back. But I think some DS9 stuff would absolutely be appropriate in a show set in the period.
Same... with a caveat that I would actually be ok if they set it at some point in the century of the Burn. I think that was an awesome idea, I loved the idea of like.. space post-apocalypse, but it was so quickly abandoned to bring back essentially status quo.
That was always going to be the inherent problem with going 1,000 years into Star Trek's future... it should be almost incomprehensible to us, not "oh look, our warp nacelles aren't even attached! See! ADVANCED!"
I somewhat justify it with a combination of the end of the Temporal Wars/dismantling of time travel tech causing a severe regression, as potentially by the 31st century so much of the technology had some sort of temporal component as well as the general century of strife with planets mostly cut off from each other and unable to gather some of the more exotic materials potentially necessary for some of the more advanced tech.
I'm on board for this. I'm cool with the Picard type stuff, but I would also be completely on board with a Discovery-type show, just... set at a better time. Hell, Discovery itself would improve at least marginally by just having it originally set at that time, rather than nonsensically in the 2250's.
I'm still mad at Discovery. It could have been so awesome, being something of the... best of both worlds? Have the new crew doing their thing and then if you want to pump some nostalgia in? You've got it on tap. No reason to try to manufacture false nostalgia by recasting characters and what not, you could just use them. Season 2 the Enterprise shows up? Oh shit it's Captain Worf and the Enterprise-E!
With really just a few tweaks, Discovery can get mildly more interesting. Make Ariam either a reclaimed Borg, OR keep her backstory largely the same, but that she was saved with an experimental procedure that utilized borg technology.
After the Dominion War, the Klingons receded back into their territory and haven't really been seen in like 30 years until Burnham stumbles across them.
The Mirror Universe stuff actually like, makes sense. (ish. At least it's Post-DS9, so the Terran Empire may have been able to restore some of itself, or take a line from the IDW comics where the Terran Empire didn't totally fall, they're just beaten back to Earth.)
Klingons look weird now? Ok, sure, idk something happened to them between the Dominion War and now. It's still dumb, but more believable.
Control and that whole thing still works, but now it was Section 31 dicking around with Borg technology.
Red Angel becomes somewhat more believable. Makes no sense being built in the 23rd century. 25th... I can buy that more.
Put Tuvok in the Sarek role.
I knew something came along and smashed them both, but I couldn't remember whatSUPERNATURAL ended up completely shattering those records with 15 seasons and 327 episodes.
Yes, that's only "mildly" more interesting.
Hell, I barely can stand much of the 24th century but I would be onboard for this. Especially if Tuvok shows up.
I'd love a Seven/Tuvok reunion show.
Starfleet's newest ace captain and the cranky vulcan admiral babysitting her. Played as a dramady it can go far, especially if Harry is still an ensign. Bring back some of the recurring DS9 and VOY cast - there is a lot of potential.
But I'm done with Picard.
Starfleet's newest ace captain and the cranky vulcan admiral babysitting her. Played as a dramady it can go far, especially if Harry is still an ensign. Bring back some of the recurring DS9 and VOY cast - there is a lot of potential.
But I'm done with Picard.
The "Harry is still an Ensign" thing is too much, although I propose a somewhat modified version of that... Kim gets a good amount of trouble on Voyager, and Janeway flat out tells him early on that he's basically done due to his behavior.
I'd go with tilting it somewhat on its head, and Kim is just no longer in Starfleet. He WAS an Ensign for way too long. Once he got back from the DQ, he figured he was on the fast track. And then Starfleet got a hold of his record and didn't give him that fat promotion he was expecting, instead giving him some relatively unimportant assignment on an unimportant ship doing unimportant things. While holding the same rank, he was essentially demoted... he was Chief of Operations on Voyager, now he's a junior bridge officer on some Excelsior or something. Kim thinks he should be a bigger deal than Starfleet thinks he is, and keeps getting in trouble. Eventually, he just resigns and goes down a different path.
Exactly WHAT he does Post-Starfleet, I don't know... but in the end, it should be something actually really awesome. Starfleet wasted his potential, and he took his skills elsewhere. I could see him involved in the Fenris Rangers along with Seven, a bad ass mercenary leader or something out on the frontier doing bad ass shit Starfleet is too afraid to do.
Or maybe less intriguing, he ends up with Section 31.
I would prefer we don't lean into "whoa is me, grimdark and gritty Harry Kim", instead positioning it more like "Starfleet should have been the path, but it didn't work out, but that's ok I found something BETTER!"
Ooohh... maybe he even ended up in an legit fleet, just not Starfleet... maybe Kim went and actually signed on the Romulan Free State and finally has command of a ship... a Romulan ship... something like a situation where the Free State put out a call like, "look, we have ships, but crew is hard to come to by... come serve in the Free State and shine!"
Given the shortfall Starfleet would have of personnel post Dominion War, Borg attack, etc, why he wouldn't rank up is border lining on absurd. There is no need for any sort of "dark" fate for Harry. Just promote him, or move him out of Starfleet and collaborating with the Fenris rangers or another organization. Make him a leader.
That's what I was saying. It's not a dark situation, it's just... Starfleet ended up not really being the place for him. That's not a negative.
That and it had Star Trek in the title. Discovery succeeded because it had a ton of corporate money behind it.
No, but it is confusing, inconsistent and strains credulity.
No...not...MONEY!
Why is it confusing? Kim was notoriously misbehaved on Voyager and racked some an impressive list of black marks on his record. And then it completely stands to reason that after the adventure and status he just had, to get back home and be treated like a regular old Ensign with behavior and discipline problems...
Seems like a pretty straightforward situation of something just not working out.
Kim probably belongs in a place that isn't quite as structured as Starfleet. He SEEMED like he should be the model Starfleet officer but... he's not at all. He has proven consistently to be willing to disobey orders at the drop of a hat if they go against his current whim.
It's confusing because it goes against the character's stated goals, what he is capable of doing (as shown in alternate timeline episodes) and the needs of Starfleet. I don't see his black marks as any more significant than say, Chakotay or Paris, who are able to continue on in Starfleet.
Neither one were starting at the ass's end of the pyramid.
The two of them engaged in attacks on Starfleet and were a part of a known terrorism/anti-Starfleet group. And yet, Chakotay can become a captain of an experimental starship?
I'm talking about them already being part of the way up the ladder compared to Kim.
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