Star Wars: The Force Awakens Discussion (HERE THERE BE SPOILERS)

[USS Triumphant]

I found Finn ok but they really need to do something with his character. His fawning over Rey will tire very soon.

You really don't understand his character. He was raised in a squad with other budding stormtroopers - pretty much his whole life. He isn't fawning over Rey. She was the second member of his new squad after he had to make a run for it, and the first he spent any real time around - he has transferred his feelings of loyalty and family to her. (Note his reaction when Poe shows back up.) Does that mean that there won't be a romance between them? Well, no - there might - but that doesn't even come close to describing what all is going on in his head regarding her.

The only new character that didn't really work for me was Maz Kanata, the nuYoda type with the magnified eyes.

The only new character that didn't work for me was Snap Wexley - because screw Greg Grunberg.

 

[Ithekro]

I was already liking the new characters, but once the Falcon shows up, they sold me. That was one thing missing for the entire PT...a hero ship. And she's just as temperamental as ever.

 

[sttngfan1701d]

Well, I just saw it. Some things I liked, some were a little Meh. 3.5 out of 5 stars, though. 3 out of 4 on a 4-star scale. It is no masterpiece, and it doesn't have an "epic" feel that the best movies often have, and that Empire had. But it's solid.

I'll echo the problem many others have with Rey. While circumstances are understandable for Kylo to be off his game, there is no reason for Rey to be so proficient with the Force so fast. That is a story flaw IMO. She should not have been able to defeat him. She's a novice. I've been following this discussion since Thursday and now that I've seen the film, it comes out of nowhere. I literally said to myself "Nah. Oh no. What a contrivance." That said...as others have pointed out, the lightsaber use in this movie is pretty awesome...a nice change from the balletic, overly choreographed quality of the Prequels. They were used like swords. I liked that.

I do like her character, though. And I think it's sweet that Finn is so devoted to her.

Speaking of Finn, I mostly liked him. I mostly liked Poe (though the novel has interactions and characterization for both of them that's been cut from the film....same for Leia and a scene with C3PO). Kylo Ren was okay, but he's a pretty weak Big Bad. After killing his father because he's so desperate to go to the Dark Side, I don't want to see a Vader-like redemption for him. They already copied the first movie enough with elements in this one.

We've had 6 movies of mostly the same vision and style/pacing, because of Lucas and/or Lucas' influence. The differences with this one were jarring because of that. It's not exactly a bad thing but the "modern" style took some getting used to. I do think the pacing was a little off, though. The movie was front-loaded. The "meat" of it felt rushed. But then again, you could say the same thing about ANH.

Not having any dialogue from Mark Hamill was lame. And I really want to find out more info about Snoke.

 

[Mr Light]

Just saw it a second time in 3D. Don't bother with the 3D (as always). It holds up great on a second viewing now that I'm not confused about the Empire/First Order Resistance/Republic Hosnian Prime stuff

I'm now completely convinced Rey is Luke's daughter. He wiped her memories to put her in hiding so she could never be connected to him. The only other explanation is she was one of the Younglings at Luke's Academy and he is merely her symbolic father. Han and Leia absolutely knew who she was and pretended not to; Han tells Maz who she is off screen.

 

[TRON JA307020]

Well, I just saw it. Some things I liked, some were a little Meh. 3.5 out of 5 stars, though. 3 out of 4 on a 4-star scale. It is no masterpiece, and it doesn't have an "epic" feel that the best movies often have, and that Empire had. But it's solid.

I'll echo the problem many others have with Rey. While circumstances are understandable for Kylo to be off his game, there is no reason for Rey to be so proficient with the Force so fast. That is a story flaw IMO. She should not have been able to defeat him. She's a novice. I've been following this discussion since Thursday and now that I've seen the film, it comes out of nowhere. I literally said to myself "Nah. Oh no. What a contrivance." That said...as others have pointed out, the lightsaber use in this movie is pretty awesome...a nice change from the balletic, overly choreographed quality of the Prequels. They were used like swords. I liked that.

I do like her character, though. And I think it's sweet that Finn is so devoted to her.

Speaking of Finn, I mostly liked him. I mostly liked Poe (though the novel has interactions and characterization for both of them that's been cut from the film....same for Leia and a scene with C3PO). Kylo Ren was okay, but he's a pretty weak Big Bad. After killing his father because he's so desperate to go to the Dark Side, I don't want to see a Vader-like redemption for him. They already copied the first movie enough with elements in this one.

We've had 6 movies of mostly the same vision and style/pacing, because of Lucas and/or Lucas' influence. The differences with this one were jarring because of that. It's not exactly a bad thing but the "modern" style took some getting used to. I do think the pacing was a little off, though. The movie was front-loaded. The "meat" of it felt rushed. But then again, you could say the same thing about ANH.

Not having any dialogue from Mark Hamill was lame. And I really want to find out more info about Snoke.

Yeah only having Luke in it for a few seconds and no dialogue was really idiotic. After a year of build up plus the in movie search we get seconds. Big deal.

 

[johnjm22]

Just got back from the theater.

I enjoyed the film. It had a few problems, but overall I felt very satisfied at the end of the movie.

The best thing about it is the new characters. They're compelling. Daisy Ridley was great. Every time Kylo Ren is only the screen it's a joy.

The new Death Star was kind of silly. I also could have done with out the Nazi stuff. The "bad guy" military commanders with British accents were over acted and dumb, luckily they don't get too much screen time. There was also some story elements that advanced too quickly, but nothing that was a deal breaker.

I give it a 7.75 out of 10.

This is the best JJ Abrams has ever done. He has more respect for this franchise, and takes it more seriously.

 

[sttngfan1701d]

Also, where are the guys that insisted in the "Nerd Rage" thread that Finn just can't simply wield a lightsaber as a novice or out of self defense like me and a few others were speculating several months ago? He MUST be a Jedi. You can't just USE a lightsaber! It's too powerful! Etc etc. Where are those guys now?

 

[Kor]

General Grevious already showed on screen that some non-Jedi could use a lightsaber (or five or six at once ).

But it probably takes someone sufficiently skilled with "The Force" to do advanced things like deflecting blaster bolts.

Kor

 

[Greylock Crescent]

Didn't Han pick one up in ESB without managing to chop off any of his limbs?

 

[sttngfan1701d]

Didn't Han pick one up in ESB without managing to chop off any of his limbs?

Yeah of course he did. That's why when the first images came out of Finn holding the saber and preparing to deflect Ren's first blow, I speculated that he was probably just using it...he didn't have any training, and looked kind of unsure of himself, like "Oh snap! Shit just got real!"

 

[Greylock Crescent]

Loved the sound effects for Luke's saber, too. Made it sound powerful and ominous when it was activated.

 

[Kor]

It was certainly powerful on its own as a special artifact, even without being turned on. Rey had such an intense experience from touching Luke's lightsaber that she didn't even want to go near it again.

Kor

 

[Ithekro]

That lightsaber has seen a lot. Killed a lot too.

 

[Maurice]

I retrospect I'm more and more bothered by the whole Starkiller Base, and not for its mere impacticality/implausibility, but for what it does narratively.

Like the Death Star 1 the thing blows up an inhabited world with presumably millions or billions of people on it. Okay, fine, copying the original. Got it.

But then they are targeting the Resistance, and who knows how many people are on that base, and in the middle of planting the charges, Han stops to talk to his kid. I'm sorry, but countless lives are hanging on the destruction of this thing and this... THIS is the moment when you stop to face the kid? In the original film there's no such personal moment clumsily inserted into the climactic action. Here it forces Han to act selfishly, to risk the lives not only of himself but of his companions AND Leia and all those people, and—potentially—the entire galaxy, if they fail. It even puts Chewie in a position where he can't do the right thing and push the detonator because it'll kill his buddy.

 

[Greylock Crescent]

The charges had already been planted.

 

[Maurice]

The charges had already been planted.

...annnnnd could not be set off because Han was having a moment.

 

[BigJake]

It's been established at that point that the Force users are of immense and more than symbolic significance to the various factions involved and indeed to the general state of the Galaxy. In fact the entire reason the First Order are hastily spooling up their death cannon is to distract the Republic from their search for Luke. In that context Han has more than just personal reasons to take the risk he does; it's as much part of the Events of Galactic Significance as the Starkiller base is.

Now, it is not super clear why the Force users are so important, I'll grant, but it's not out of keeping with the premises of the story.

 

[Greylock Crescent]

The charges had already been planted.

...annnnnd could not be set off because Han was having a moment.

..... annnnnnnd (aside from having demonstrated that the premise itself has an erroneous foundation) it's worth pointing out that the moment included trying to save his son from the Dark Side, and therefore save countless others who might fall victim to his son (as Jake succinctly states above).

Honestly, categorizing Han's actions as "selfish" misses the entire point of the scene.

 

[DWF]

Also, where are the guys that insisted in the "Nerd Rage" thread that Finn just can't simply wield a lightsaber as a novice or out of self defense like me and a few others were speculating several months ago? He MUST be a Jedi. You can't just USE a lightsaber! It's too powerful! Etc etc. Where are those guys now?

While I don't think Finn is a Jedi, I do have to wonder if he was one who was awakened in the movie not just Rey. Snoke said they'd been an awakending and that was before Rey had done anything special. After Finn refused to fire on the villagers Kylo looked right at him and after he help Poe escape Ren knew exactly which stormtrooper had helepd him.

 

[Mr Light]

I've seen the movie twice now, and I still don't know what Snoke was talking about with the "awakening". Was it Rey re-entering the larger world after having her memory wiped because she's Luke's daughter?