Star Trek V re-edits?

[CorporalCaptain]

At least "TSOP" had the crew abandoning Kirk because they were under the influence of an alien flower. As I said before, I don't quite understand why the crew went against Kirk just because Sybok showed them their personal demons.

Yeah. The film really doesn't bother to explain it, does it? But I was kinda getting at the idea that Sybok's disconnecting of everybody from their pain was the direct cause of their drone-hood, at least it's the only thing in evidence that might be related to the reason. Hence, also the parallel with "The Enemy Within" (assuming one draws a parallel between primitive behavior impulses and emotional pain).

 

[Dukhat]

Yeah. The film really doesn't bother to explain it, does it? But I was kinda getting at the idea that Sybok's disconnecting of everybody from their pain was the direct cause of their drone-hood, at least it's the only thing in evidence that might be related to the reason. Hence, also the parallel with "The Enemy Within" (assuming one draws a parallel between primitive behavior impulses and emotional pain).

Then that would mean that Sybok really wasn't interested in helping people ease their pain, and was just using that to influence and control them to do his bidding. Which would actually have been a more realistic metaphor for television evangelists or cult leaders, if that was truly what Shatner was going for. The problem, however, is that Sybok gives every indication that he does care about the people he's helping, that he's really a nice guy, and that their decision to follow him was entirely their own. Which is why the crew going against Kirk really doesn't make sense, IMHO.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Then that would mean that Sybok really wasn't interested in helping people ease their pain, and was just using that to influence and control them to do his bidding. Which would actually have been a more realistic metaphor for television evangelists or cult leaders, if that was truly what Shatner was going for. The problem, however, is that Sybok gives every indication that he does care about the people he's helping, that he's really a nice guy, and that their decision to follow him was entirely their own. Which is why the crew going against Kirk really doesn't make sense, IMHO.

Well, I never said anything in the film made any sense. Not much does; we can only make the most of what's actually there.

Sybok had deluded himself into believing that reaching the center of the galaxy was essential, or he had been tricked by the being that was trapped there, or some combination. Based on his seeming earnestness, we can reasonably suppose that his delusion extended to encompass the belief that his followers weren't docile, brainwashed drones but rather were true believers who were simply in agreement regarding the paramount importance of his quest. Under his delusion, their being in lockstep with him all the way would follow simply from the paramountcy of his objective and from the soundness of his program for realizing it.

So, what he thought was releasing people was actually a kind of brainwashing, probably accomplished by mind-meld.

 

[Dukhat]

So, what he thought was releasing people was actually a kind of brainwashing, probably accomplished by mind-meld.

That explanation definitely would have made more sense.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

That explanation definitely would have made more sense.

The thing is, the dramatic beat of "I need my pain!" at least plays like that is what the issue actually is and that the disconnect of the followers from their personal pain is the main cause of their behavioral issues. Kirk isn't saying, "Get your psychic powers out of my head!" So, the film invites us to think it could be all of the above.

For me, the idea "I need my pain!" is a primary thrust of the film, and it's far more significant than the idea "Don't follow false gods."

 

[johnnybear]

I always found it odd that Kirk was so much more interested in having Spock back than his own son, David!
JB

 

[2takesfrakes]

I badmouth STAR TREK: V as much as anyone, but it really doesn't/didn't matter what it was about or whatever, because the cast had already aged out of their parts, before this point. It was time to end the original series movies and either make them about TNG, or just stop making STAR TREK movies, altogether. It's telling, though, how Kirk's all like, "when they put me out to pasture, l hope I fare better than Korrd." You've already BEEN put out to pasture, Jim! And the grazing isn't good. Truth be told, as much as I absolutely love TSFS, the cast was too old to be out $aving the Universe, even then. But we needed Spock back and just at the time when Leonard Nimoy was the most bored with playing him. Ah, well. What can you do -- you know? What can you do ...

 

[Pauln6]

There was a nugget of an interesting story here if they'd remained on the planet of galactic peace and made it a terrorist / cult leader story with more serious and less comedic overtones. What was Uhura's pain all about? I missed Saavik, Chapel, and Rand too.