He did? What was that altruistic reason? So he could later become the great Captain Kirk who selflessly saves the Federation?
He cheated because he doesn't like to lose.
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Star Trek trailer description (Spoilers)
- Thread starter mr.peany
- Start date
He cheated because he doesn't like to lose.
Ok, wait. I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic or not; Sarcasm sometimes comes across poorly in the written word. In the event you're not, though, I don't think "altruistic" means what you think it means. I don't believe Kirk cheated on the Kobayashi Maru because he was feeling selfless ... he cheated because he was pissed at having failed (what was it, three times?) and came to the conclusion that a "no win" scenario really doesn't force you to lose, it only forces you to rewrite the rules.
Ignore the above if you were only being sarcastic!
I'm usually one of the biggest supporters of this movie but the trailer isn't doing it for me.
1. Spock being so emotional isn't doing it.
2. Kirk seems stereotyped as "the angry child" and I can't reconcile it with selfless, dedicated TOS Kirk
3. Seems totally action oriented with absolutely no cerebral/science fiction ideas or writing.
Hopefully my reservations are unfounded.
1. Spock being so emotional isn't doing it.
2. Kirk seems stereotyped as "the angry child" and I can't reconcile it with selfless, dedicated TOS Kirk
3. Seems totally action oriented with absolutely no cerebral/science fiction ideas or writing.
Hopefully my reservations are unfounded.
Kirk was anything but selfless; in fact, he was often as clear absorbed in his own goals as any ambitious man.
What I'm wondering is...this trailer was shown all day to any Paramount employee who wanted to see it, and after three days we have two brief anonymous reports sent in to one website (granted, the most browsed and notorious)? Has no one else there heard of the Internet?
What I'm wondering is...this trailer was shown all day to any Paramount employee who wanted to see it, and after three days we have two brief anonymous reports sent in to one website (granted, the most browsed and notorious)? Has no one else there heard of the Internet?
Eh, remember that we're not dealing with an adult Spock. We're dealing with a young Spock whose human half is undergoing angsty teen years. He is a child who hasn't quite perfected his Vulcan control and is trying to live up to the impossibly high standards set by Sarek. An emotional Spock really isn't a bad thing. Everybody has to start somewhere.
Well, he was an angry child. He matured quite a bit between the teen portrayed in Collision Course and Best Destiny to the 'Fleet's go-to man.
Mmm ... I used to play EverQuest, and the players who were beta-testing new expansion packs had to abide by an NDA or a Non Disclosure Agreement (even though one or two secrets leaked out, it was pretty effective). Maybe the Paramount people who viewed the trailer have had to do the same thing and theirs is more strictly enforced than the one used for the game.
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Kirk was anything but selfless; in fact, he was often as clear absorbed in his own goals as any ambitious man.
What I'm wondering is...this trailer was shown all day to any Paramount employee who wanted to see it, and after three days we have two brief anonymous reports sent in to one website (granted, the most browsed and notorious)? Has no one else there heard of the Internet?
Selfless Kirk
1. Balance of Terror -- "We are expendable"
2. Savage Curtain - Lincoln as his hero
3. Mirror, Mirror - Kirk willing to stay behind
4. The Empath - Kirk willing to die to save other 2.
5. Amok Time - willing to sacrifice career for friend
6 City of Edge of Forever - sacrifices "soul mate" & happiness for others
7. This Side of Paradise - sacrifices happiness for duty.
Admittedly there are episodes where Kirk puts his personal goals first. But I'd rather see the selfless one, especially aince this film is aimed at the our children.
Yep.
People making sacrifices does not make them "selfless" in any global sense that reasonably extends to making conclusions about their adolescent and childhood characters. You won't, for example, find that the majority of police officers or soldiers would be characterized as remarkably selfless or disciplined at the age of eleven or twelve or thirteen (I wish I had a nickel for every policeman I've known who avowed - completely honestly or not, I can't say - that they "spent so much time in the back of police cars that I decided to try out the front seat."
).To use a current example that's fresh in everyone's minds, John McCain is an American hero who chose to endure great sacrifice as a naval officer - and yet you'll find that he was something other than a completely disciplined and "selfless" adolescent.
I have the feeling that this film will show that "journey to maturity" for Jim Kirk.
To quote Inigo Montoya, 'You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means'. How are any of us who like what we're reading about the alleged new trailer "A servile self-seeker who attempts to win favor by flattering influential people"? Are there any influential people here that any of us feel the need to flatter? Does that practice relate in any way to those of us praising the details of that trailer description rather than chastising them?
Yeah, so anyhow...
If this is the trailer we're destined to see in front of Quantum of Solace or on the internet in a few days, I'm pretty pleased with it. I'm a dyed-in-the-wool Trekker, and I consider myself a stickler for detail and canon, and all of this sounds just fine to me. Everyone's entitled to their individual viewpoints on this, but I just can't see the point in wringing my hands in despair and frustration over the trifling plot discrepancies people have been so hung up on. How unrelentingly sad that people would allow such minor details to totally derail any chances of enjoying this movie. Yes, one would think someone could consult the books or past episodes to work out these minor details, but...well...WHY? Do they really matter in the grand scheme of things? Does the fact that Chris Pine's Kirk's eyes are blue rather than Shatner's brown really bother people THAT much? Is the Kelvin's registry number really getting people's knickers that much in a knot? Yikes.
Books or early episodes notwithstanding, I can't see young Kirk being anything but rebellious and striving for more. It just seems to fit with everything we've ever seen of Kirk from day one. Personalities fluctuate with time and experiences, but certain characteristics endure from childhood onward, and I think a penchant for rebellion matches Kirk to a tee. And Spock wasn't without emotional outbursts in his young days. Just watch "The Cage" to get a good idea of what I'm talking about. Spock has even let emotion creep into his actions in his later years. I don't know about any of you, but I got the impression Spock was downright PISSED when he, Kirk, and McCoy uncovered Valeris as a co-conspirator in STVI. When he smacked that phaser out of her hand, I heard someone in front of me in the theater say, "Damn!!!" So, if Quinto's Spock shows anger, I'm willing to bet there's a good reason for it and it's not just shock value for the fans and a selling point for the non-fans.
What makes me think we're gonna see the young Denny Crane ?
^
^^I think most people would say that Denny Crane is less mature than Captain/Admiral James T. Kirk.
^^I think most people would say that Denny Crane is less mature than Captain/Admiral James T. Kirk.
Ah, that smug old chestnut. I was using the broader definition of "flatterer," regardless of motive. But you knew that.
Exactly (and thanks!). Only, even as quickies, I'd say they show a terrifying dearth of originality.
Kirk was anything but selfless; in fact, he was often as clear absorbed in his own goals as any ambitious man.
What I'm wondering is...this trailer was shown all day to any Paramount employee who wanted to see it, and after three days we have two brief anonymous reports sent in to one website (granted, the most browsed and notorious)? Has no one else there heard of the Internet?
Not to mention that just about every cell phone in existance these days can shoot video. Why hasn't this ended up on Youtube yet?
Q2UnME
Just because employees could walk in and watch it whenever they wanted doesn't mean that there wasn't tight security there. Maybe there was a security guard who checked people for cell phones, cameras, pens and paper, employee badges, etc. before entering. In fact, I bet there was.Kirk was anything but selfless; in fact, he was often as clear absorbed in his own goals as any ambitious man.
What I'm wondering is...this trailer was shown all day to any Paramount employee who wanted to see it, and after three days we have two brief anonymous reports sent in to one website (granted, the most browsed and notorious)? Has no one else there heard of the Internet?
Not to mention that just about every cell phone in existance these days can shoot video. Why hasn't this ended up on Youtube yet?
Q2UnME
If Kirk is indeed being led by his emotions rather than his better judgement then it sounds like the perfect person for him to meet is Spock.
They need each other, and this movie must be about their eventual friendship and how they came to appreciate each others strengths and use them to their mutual gain.
They need each other, and this movie must be about their eventual friendship and how they came to appreciate each others strengths and use them to their mutual gain.
The emotional Spock in this movie may also retcon why he's so emotional in The Cage.
Maybe the scene with the Corvette is Kirk reacting to the terrible news that his father has been killed aboard the Kelvin.
I think we're looking at more of a Kal-El thing here.
Actually....thats not a bad idea, and it makes sense.
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