Star Trek TNG Remastered?

[GhostFaceSaint]

I thought some more about it. Since the effects were done on video and they have to reassemble the episodes from raw material anyway (since probably no film master copy without effects exists) they save the time and money for rotoscoping, right? Finding the right takes of every episode and putting them together shouldn´t be that big of a deal? Surely there´s some kind of document where they noted down wich takes they used?

Indeed, from what I have read this seems to be the case. In fact, the edit information might have been noted directly on the raw film parts. Thus if they have the original film material they also know how it needs to be edited. However, I do not know how conistently this notation was done. Nonetheless, even if they didn't have the documentation, all they would need to do is employ a few dudes to go through every episode and compare them with the raw film parts to get this information. Surely that wouldn't be the money sink of this project?

How much would that cost? And would they make a profit? Has anyone here put the standard DVD in a blu ray player and seen the results on a HD screen?

Depending on your blu-ray player you could get a very decent image but certain images like CG shots and some other special effects don't always transfer so well even on the best blu-ray player, if you want a really good image for HD you have to render them in HD.

 

[FreddyE]

I watch blue-ray using my pc...the player software has a very elaborate SD - > HD upconvert...never watched a TNG DVD with this before though...I´ll give it a try and post a screenshot.

As for the cost for TNG RE...I don´t know a lot about studio polictics and stuff...but couldn´t they finance it via a jointventure of some kind? For example 50 % CBS and 50 % Paramount? It seems they are doing something similar on a smalscale already for the TOS BlueRay...it has the CBS Bumper on the start of each disc but on the packaging there is the "Paramount Home Entertainment" logo.

If only I was more talented...I would love to do some rotoscoping on clips from my TNG DVDs and throw together a small "demo reel".

 

[Dukhat]

I have a question that I wonder if anyone in the know (i.e., Mr. Okuda or Sternbach) could answer.

OK...let's say for argument's sake that a remastering of TNG actually happens. And let's say that all model shots will now be replaced with CGI. And let's take a specific episode as an example: "The Naked Now." In that episode, the U.S.S. Tsiolkovsky was shown to be a re-use of the old Grissom model from Star Trek III, albeit 70+ years after that movie, and would have been a terribly outdated design for the late 24th century. Now back in the day, the recycling of old movie models was prevalent, not because TPTB necessarily wanted to use them, but because they were forced to because it was a cost-cutting measure so new models didn't have to be built. However, if there had been a budget to build a new model for the Tsiolkovsky, then it would most likely have been built.

Here's my question: Since the FX would be redone In CGI, then for all intents and purposes, a new design could be created for the Tsiolkovsky. But would that happen, or would there just be a CGI model made of the Grissom-type ship, just to honor the original footage? And all those endless reuses of stock footage of the Excelsior rendesvousing with the Enterprise...would they all just be the same too, or would there be new shots of new ship designs instead?

 

[FreddyE]

Well for TOS RE they actually created a totally new design in a similar instance. Can´t remember what is was or wich episode though.

Something else: Do you think the "rubber band effect" wich was state of the art at its time should be recreated like it was or enhanced? I would love an enhanced version...maybe some kind of mixture of what they did in Star Trek 09...with that loud "BANG" at the end.

 

[Bertie]

TOS-R didn't really change ships excessively.

When there was no ship (which happened sometimes due to the budget) or a pathetically cheap ship (like a blob of light) they replaced those with something different-looking.

But when the ship was reasonably identifiable, as was the case for example with all appearances of the Constitution class or the Romulan warbird or the Klingon cruiser, the new artwork tended to keep the same basic shape as the old. At some point, supposedly, they thought about replacing some of the Constitutions in "The Ultimate Computer" with something else, but eventually decided, no, they were Constitutions in the original, and that they will stay.

So I don't see them doing anything like replacing Grissoms and Reliants or Excelsiors; its established, for better or worse, that these hulls lasted a really long time, and they'll probably stay that way.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

In "The Enterprise Incident" they changed the design of one of the Romulan ships. Originally, all three were retrofitted Klingon cruisers. But in the remastered version, one of them is now a Bird of Prey like in "Balance of Terror".

 

[Bertie]

In "The Enterprise Incident" they changed the design of one of the Romulan ships. Originally, all three were retrofitted Klingon cruisers. But in the remastered version, one of them is now a Bird of Prey like in "Balance of Terror".

Yep. Also changed the station in "The Ultimate Computer" to something different (it was previously the same as in "Tribbles") and somewhere a Klingon "scout" that was just a light blotch got changed to be the cruiser.

But I believe that might be the extent of the changes in which one class/hull was changed to be a different class of ship entirely.

(Full list of this stuff at EAS.)

 

[Flake]

Maybe they should remaster BOBW into HD with new FX, then release it on Blu-Ray & premiere it on Scifi and then see what the response is like. To test the waters.

Even then, I still have sympathies with the people editing certain episodes - that one where some guy abducts the ships kids for instance... I would pay for the 35mm masters of that particular episode to be burnt and never seen again I am sure some others could join the list.

Use season 1 Wesley Crusher sweaters as fuel for the fire.

 

[RAMA]

Maybe they should remaster BOBW into HD with new FX, then release it on Blu-Ray & premiere it on Scifi and then see what the response is like. To test the waters.

Even then, I still have sympathies with the people editing certain episodes - that one where some guy abducts the ships kids for instance... I would pay for the 35mm masters of that particular episode to be burnt and never seen again I am sure some others could join the list.

Use season 1 Wesley Crusher sweaters as fuel for the fire.

Awesome idea...just as Doomsday served to test a lot of other CGI experiments with TOS!

 

[Flake]

If they re-do the original ILM FX from Encounter at Farpoint they have potentially completed 60%+ of the effects in an instant because they where reused so much.

Or, even better, remaster them to 1080p Generations style and then try to match the 3D bits to it which I think the 3d wiz kids somewhere can do.

Erase all trace of the 4ft-er

 

[jefferiestubes8]

If they re-do the original ILM FX from Encounter at Farpoint they have potentially completed 60%+ of the effects in an instant

While I have stated before that I think any TNG-R efforts would have 100% CGI work for visual effects some fans really want to see the original ILM models and I guess they would be willing to watch the branching Blu-ray with upconverted original FX shots as purists.

 

[jefferiestubes8]

just as Doomsday served to test a lot of other CGI experiments with TOS!

Star Trek season 2 Blu-ray
special feature has

three [BD-Live] bonus features on the development of the new visual effects for "The Doomsday Machine"

if you are interested...

 

[Flake]

If they re-do the original ILM FX from Encounter at Farpoint they have potentially completed 60%+ of the effects in an instant

While I have stated before that I think any TNG-R efforts would have 100% CGI work for visual effects some fans really want to see the original ILM models and I guess they would be willing to watch the branching Blu-ray with upconverted original FX shots as purists.

I think the original ILM effects would be fine at 1920x1080, Generations proved this with the Saucer Separation & the Fly-by. I think the effects should be remastered at 1080p where possible because I don't think low-budget CGI can compare.

No low-budget CGI could reproduce the original ILM effects and there is some great model work as well, Time Squared for instance.

But that would be only half of it, right? Every transport or phaser blast or Holodeck 'Arch' & Holodeck doors opening into a corridor would need re-doing... massive effort. It must be twice or three times the work that went into TOS remastered? I say they skip the CGI as much as possible and rescue every single original effect they can, I think the majority of early FX scenes where the ILM Encounter at Farpoint FX simply overlaid on top of new stuff.

Might be an interesting to go though each episode and see what needs doing

 

[TeutonicNights]

Season two could massively profit from a remastering effort.

The effect shots are often terrible , but last for a while.
So if they had more time and money this time, they could make some of those episodes very special.

Take an episode like "The Measure of a Man" for example (watched it today). The FX consist mainly of the Enterprise circling around "Regula 1", but those shots are rather long (and incredibly poor- the starfield...is terrible).
They could replace the station (like they did with the Ultimate Computer) and give us many awesome angle shots.
Or the scene when Philippa and Picard stand at the window and an ugly, odd-colored E flies by outside. That could be remade pretty cool.

Seriously, some of those early TNG FX look like cheap placeholders, anyway. TNG, maybe much more than TOS (which sometimes had very little FX to replace in the first place), would greatly benefit from a dedicated remastering.

Also, they wouldn't really need to "hold back", to not interfere with the 80's look like they tried in TOSR. At least I hope they wouldn't do that for TNG.

Also, half the Quadrant looks like Angel One. Things like these need to be changed, anyway.

 

[RAMA]

If only Paramount/CBS could see how much attention this remastering effort is getting here....

 

[Bertie]

I think the original ILM effects would be fine at 1920x1080, Generations proved this with the Saucer Separation & the Fly-by. I think the effects should be remastered at 1080p where possible because I don't think low-budget CGI can compare.

No low-budget CGI could reproduce the original ILM effects and there

While I can partly sympathize with this, image quality isn't all that matters — image variety matters too. Going back and whacking all the "thick rim" Enterprise shots in favor of the Season 1/2/Generations model might result in some better quality at HD resolutions, but really, that's an awfully limited palette of stock film to cover seven seasons worth of TNG.

In TOS-R, the extra variety in the hero ship flybys and such is a good thing.

 

[Hober Mallow]

But that would be only half of it, right? Every transport or phaser blast or Holodeck 'Arch' & Holodeck doors opening into a corridor would need re-doing... massive effort.

Redoing the FX is going to be the least challenging aspect of this project.

 

[trevanian]

I think the original ILM effects would be fine at 1920x1080, Generations proved this with the Saucer Separation & the Fly-by. I think the effects should be remastered at 1080p where possible because I don't think low-budget CGI can compare.

No low-budget CGI could reproduce the original ILM effects and there

While I can partly sympathize with this, image quality isn't all that matters — image variety matters too.

Variety matters when you've got a major storypoint, otherwise it is just background. That's why it is criminal to reuse the BoP blast from TUC in GEN, but fine to trot out the drydock TMP stuff in TWOK.

Most generic TNG stuff is fine, except the 2fter. If you can deal with how bad the -d looks in any size, you should be able to put up with the rest.

 

[TeutonicNights]

Watched more of season two... Heck the BOP FX in "A matter of honor" were absolute shit!
And the planets...ugh.

 

[Anwar]

I'd like it if they replaced a few of those scenes where the ENT meets with another ship and it's always the Excelsior class. Maybe just add some variety by making them other ship classes half of the time.