Star Trek: Renegades

[SuperSpaceMan]

I am curious, how on Earth is Lexxa Khan's daughter? Unless she's a lot older than she looks (which I doubt from the TNG-era phaser rifles in the flashback), it just doesn't work.

It's scifi. Could be genetically his daughter when someone took the samples Starfleet probably had on him (from McCoy's tests on the Enterprise) and then produced her from it. Illegal experiment that now casts her as Khan's daughter. Interesting story to tell, maybe. But possible.

We left that loose end open for another episode. The gist of it is the mother was impregnated with Kahn's DNA.

This is an example of the "clunky" story telling I am talking about. For all intents and purposes, this should have been an origin story, This is when at least her background should have been introduced, in some measure. Lexxa is the (Anti)Heroine of this series, and the person who is going to be driving the story, if your going to make her Khan's daughter, you need to explain how... even if a high level, and revisit later.... Otherwise, dropping her as Khans daughter just seem like fan service....

 

[The Transformed Man]

The more I think about it, the more I want to take a stab at doing a "Karzak cut" of this film.

I mean, how much worse could it possibly get?

My feeling was there's enough material within the 87 minute runtime to create a passable TV length pilot. It would require judicious removal of extraneous subplots (e.g., arm bomb), a little bit restructuring some plot points, and trimming down a lot of the fat in terms of SFX, and ramping up some of the more tedious slow motion scenes...

But I think it could be done...

 

[Kemaiku]

The other problem with it is this - after someone tries to take out an admiral in Starfleet HQ it completely strains credibility that the vague "The federation hands are tied" set up earlier is still in force.

A chunk of Starfleet Command violently disappearing would be on the morning news of every planet in the Federation. Every one of them would be demanding answers or depending how many died in the blast, vengeance for murdered citizens.

Most of Starfleet would be after whoever did it, nevermind one ship. It's an extremely stupid and contrived terrorist plotline that fails at whatever it was it was trying to do.

Even though it didn't go off, it likely setoff a building wide alarm, everyone in SFC heard it and knows what it meant. Did the Federation Council hear nothing about it?

 

[steam235]

Spoiler: spoiler

Did we even see the girl after she lost her hand? Just emergency beam out and then never talk about what happened again?

also do we still need spoiler tags?

 

[Iamnotspock]

Spoiler: spoiler

Did we even see the girl after she lost her hand? Just emergency beam out and then never talk about what happened again?

also do we still need spoiler tags?

I don't think so, it's out there now.

Yes we did, at the end with a new arm.

 

[Dukhat]

I think we're going to need an experts opinion on which is the correct Enterprises C.

No, we most certainly do not need that.

 

[JoeZhang]

The more I think about it, the more I want to take a stab at doing a "Karzak cut" of this film.

I mean, how much worse could it possibly get?

My feeling was there's enough material within the 87 minute runtime to create a passable TV length pilot. It would require judicious removal of extraneous subplots (e.g., arm bomb), a little bit restructuring some plot points, and trimming down a lot of the fat in terms of SFX, and ramping up some of the more tedious slow motion scenes...

But I think it could be done...

Off the top of my head:

* virtually all the Chekov scenes can be either deleted or significantly cut
* The cliched Scribble on a prison wall stuff can be cut
* Captain Thingy of the USS thingy can see significant cuts
* I don't think any of the Klaxon stuff is needed as everything we see there is expressed elsewhere or repeated later.

Love to see what someone could do.

 

[The Transformed Man]

The more I think about it, the more I want to take a stab at doing a "Karzak cut" of this film.

I mean, how much worse could it possibly get?

My feeling was there's enough material within the 87 minute runtime to create a passable TV length pilot. It would require judicious removal of extraneous subplots (e.g., arm bomb), a little bit restructuring some plot points, and trimming down a lot of the fat in terms of SFX, and ramping up some of the more tedious slow motion scenes...

But I think it could be done...

Off the top of my head:

* virtually all the Chekov scenes can be either deleted or significantly cut
* The cliched Scribble on a prison wall stuff can be cut
* Captain Thingy of the USS thingy can see significant cuts
* I don't think any of the Klaxon stuff is needed as everything we see there is expressed elsewhere or repeated later.

Love to see what someone could do.

Well some of the Chekov stuff is needed as he's kind of the Basil Exposition of the show. I'd probably try to limit it to the Tuvok/Chekov scenes, dump the great-great granddaughter, and severely limit the Romulan and Andorian super spy appearances.

The scribble scene actually works against the introduction of of our protagonist... her appearance in the arena should be her introduction.

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

The more I think about it, the more I want to take a stab at doing a "Karzak cut" of this film.

I mean, how much worse could it possibly get?

My feeling was there's enough material within the 87 minute runtime to create a passable TV length pilot. It would require judicious removal of extraneous subplots (e.g., arm bomb), a little bit restructuring some plot points, and trimming down a lot of the fat in terms of SFX, and ramping up some of the more tedious slow motion scenes...

But I think it could be done...

Off the top of my head:

* virtually all the Chekov scenes can be either deleted or significantly cut
* The cliched Scribble on a prison wall stuff can be cut
* Captain Thingy of the USS thingy can see significant cuts
* I don't think any of the Klaxon stuff is needed as everything we see there is expressed elsewhere or repeated later.

Love to see what someone could do.

Except the Chekov scenes are almost the only scenes with any exposition needed to keep the plot moving for the viewer...

 

[JoeZhang]

Hello? .... or significantly cut.

 

[Captain Atkin]

The scribble scene actually works against the introduction of our protagonist... her appearance in the arena should be her introduction.

I agree with this 100%. Just look at the recent ANT-MAN film. It starts with our hero is a prison fight, that also has a twist ending. Its a fun scene and an interesting way to introduce the main character.

I like Renegades, but it could use a few trims.

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

Hello? .... or significantly cut.

I don't see how... Other than the nonsense with his grand daughter, his scenes are the only scenes that move the story along for the viewer.... I mean, most of the exposition could and should have been moved to other parts of the movie... Like the mission briefing with Lexxa and her crew... Perfect place to check in with the audience, and make sure everyone was up to speed.... But no, just a reverence to the mission being on their padds or some nonsense.....

 

[rocketdave]

Did anybody else think Cadet Chekov's friend was going to turn out to be an enemy agent? They never explained precisely how the bad guys got to her, and while I know some people are saying that the scenes with the granddaughter were entirely unnecessary, her friend's presence in particular was suspiciously superfluous, so I thought there had to be some twist coming. Having read through this thread, now I realize both girls were there due to nepotism.

When Icheb told his story about section 31, I thought: Wait a minute he’s at Starfleet Academy, but that’s probably because I read the Voyager relaunch books.

I had a similar thought about how Tuvok was supposed to be serving on the Titan (though I suppose he could have left to join Section 31 at some point), but an even more problematic departure from the novels' continuity was

Spoiler: the Destiny trilogy

Owen Paris being alive seven years after he'd been killed by the Borg.

Of course, I'm well aware that the novels aren't "canon" and that not even fan films are beholden to what happens in them.

 

[JoeZhang]

Did anybody else think Cadet Chekov's friend was going to turn out to be an enemy agent? They never explained precisely how the bad guys got to her, and while I know some people are saying that the scenes with the granddaughter were entirely unnecessary, her friend's presence in particular was suspiciously superfluous, so I thought there had to be some twist coming. Having read through this thread, now I realize both girls were there due to nepotism.

Could be a bit of both - it might have been the intention that in the next episode, the friend is revealed as an enemy agent. However that would just compound the "why the hell are these cadets just wandering Starfleet security at will?"

 

[Maurice]

That whole bomb scene is endemic of the editorial problems this film suffers. It fails to build tension at all. It's just flat when it should be scary.

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

Did anybody else think Cadet Chekov's friend was going to turn out to be an enemy agent? They never explained precisely how the bad guys got to her, and while I know some people are saying that the scenes with the granddaughter were entirely unnecessary, her friend's presence in particular was suspiciously superfluous, so I thought there had to be some twist coming. Having read through this thread, now I realize both girls were there due to nepotism.

Could be a bit of both - it might have been the intention that in the next episode, the friend is revealed as an enemy agent. However that would just compound the "why the hell are these cadets just wandering Starfleet security at will?"

Why bother with the sabotage anyway? The perpetrators of this plan, already had their space folding device on Earth (Starfleet headquarters <which if you think about it, if your able to smuggle an alien artifact onto Earth, why take it to Starfleet Command anyway>) why raise suspicion by killing admirals.....

 

[Kemaiku]

If they had dropped it to the bottom of the Atlantic on the way, there's nothing humanity could have done in time. But villains always give the hero too many chances.

Or if they needed some form on control nearby, a desert or forest anywhere on the planet. But that would have needed a location shoot.

Etc

 

[Iamnotspock]

When Icheb told his story about section 31, I thought: Wait a minute he’s at Starfleet Academy, but that’s probably because I read the Voyager relaunch books.

I had a similar thought about how Tuvok was supposed to be serving on the Titan (though I suppose he could have left to join Section 31 at some point), but an even more problematic departure from the novels' continuity was

Spoiler: the Destiny trilogy

Owen Paris being alive seven years after he'd been killed by the Borg.

Of course, I'm well aware that the novels aren't "canon" and that not even fan films are beholden to what happens in them.

That was my first thought when I saw

Spoiler: the Destiny trilogy

Owen Paris in the trailer

I just reconcile the discrepancies as being down to the stories occurring in multiple universes. The novels, Online, and Renegades are each in one of the separate universes glimpsed in "Parallels".

 

[Merlanthe]

Just finished watching it and found it pretty enjoyable

I agree with a few of the criticisms already mentioned by other posters. They really didn't need the rape gang/prison rape references. The Chekhov scenes were too heavy on the exposition/info dumping. As mentioned the Icarus crew meeting to discuss their mission would have been a good place for expository dialogue instead it was kinda clunky with cliche dialogue that didn't really flow very well.

The only really annoyingly bad part for me was the scene that took place just as the crew was meeting between icheb and the female betazoid (forget her name sorry). It was clunky dialogue that could have been a lot smoother and seemed to there to tell us how these two characters interact and reveal Icheb's arm and the female betazoid's ability.

Except it seemed to be an emotionally intense little scene between the two of them that should never have taken place at a meeting where five other crew members just stand round listening to every word before carrying as though nothing happened. Also there are a couple minor scenes as the Icarus crew prepare for their mission that show how Icheb behaves toward the betazoid and reveal his arm in a much better more natural way.

Basically that scene between Icheb and the betazoid just did not belong at that meeting it was the wrong place for two characters to have an intense private and revealing conversation and the wrong time for those particular characters to be having that conversation.

It would have work better and seemed a lot more natural if the conversation had taken place later in the episode somewhere inbetween that minor scene showing how the two interact but before they head down to the planet. Icheb and the betazoid find themselves working alone together, she questions his attitude toward her and they have intense little scene revealing how Icheb got the arm and what she can and cannot do which leads into his less cold attitude to her down on the planet.

But as I said that was the only annoyingly bad part of the episode for me. The rest I found quite enjoyable I think there is a lot being set up for future episodes so I hope they get made somehow.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

That whole bomb scene is endemic of the editorial problems this film suffers. It fails to build tension at all. It's just flat when it should be scary.

Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb ...