STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

[M'Sharak]

running down the street like a dork

Did not Chekov run along a navy vessel like a dork in ST IV, complete with Russian-themed chase music?

How does one run like a dork, anyway ?

Left foot, right foot, left foot, right foot (repeat for as long as needed, then do a D.S. al Coda.)

 

[CorporalCaptain]

How does one run like a dork, anyway ?

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzrI15uw92k[/yt]

 

[Opus]

Did not Chekov run along a navy vessel like a dork in ST IV, complete with Russian-themed chase music?

How does one run like a dork, anyway ?

Left foot, right foot, left foot, right foot (repeat for as long as needed, then do a D.S. al Coda.)

Band Geek.

 

[Kanenas]

It feels like the producers are just editing out a few good parts from the original series and movies in order to coble together a semblance of a story and then so computer special effects to win som sort of wow factor.

perhaps the reboot needs a reboot.

 

[Kruezerman]

It feels like the producers are just editing out a few good parts from the original series and movies in order to coble together a semblance of a story and then so computer special effects to win som sort of wow factor.

perhaps the reboot needs a reboot.

Examples please.

 

[Commishsleer]

Yes, but it seems to be okay to admit to not caring about the flaws of STID yet try to do the same for TWOK or FC and you're labelled a hypocrite.

For me, Spock yelling "Khaaan!!!!" or running down the street like a dork destroys my suspension of disbelief in a way that thinking "Gee, wasn't Checkov not on the Enterprise during Space Seed?" doesn't.

I agree with others that Nimoy used to 'run like a girl' in TOS on the few occasions he did run.
It was adorable

 

[newtontomato539]

There will never be examples. Only lies.

 

[RAMA]

Shocking: Man of Steel: 59% rotten. STID: 87% fresh

RAMA

 

[M'Sharak]

There will never be examples. Only lies.

Or spam, in your case. This, despite several recent requests that it cease appearing under the newtontomato byline. Warned as such; comments to the Hormel Foods Corporation of Austin, MN.

 

[KittyDuran]

Yes, but it seems to be okay to admit to not caring about the flaws of STID yet try to do the same for TWOK or FC and you're labelled a hypocrite.

For me, Spock yelling "Khaaan!!!!" or running down the street like a dork destroys my suspension of disbelief in a way that thinking "Gee, wasn't Checkov not on the Enterprise during Space Seed?" doesn't.

I agree with others that Nimoy used to 'run like a girl' in TOS on the few occasions he did run.
It was adorable

Myself and CorporalCaptain in another thread thought he looked like an albatross ready to take flight! (still adorable...)

 

[BillJ]

Saw it for the fourth time today with my sixteen-year old son (first time) and he loved it.

The second, third and fourth times I've seen this film I've been fully aware of its shortcomings and have expected them to impact my enjoyment, but they haven't. This is a movie that simply grabs hold of you and doesn't let go from beginning to end. The cast is incredible. I could go again tonight to see it!

I just don't know how you can say you're a Trek fan and not enjoy Into Darkness on at least some level.

 

[Ovation]

Saw it for the fourth time today with my sixteen-year old son (first time) and he loved it.

The second, third and fourth times I've seen this film I've been fully aware of its shortcomings and have expected them to impact my enjoyment, but they haven't. This is a movie that simply grabs hold of you and doesn't let go from beginning to end. The cast is incredible. I could go again tonight to see it!

I just don't know how you can say you're a Trek fan and not enjoy Into Darkness on at least some level.

Careful now. If we get to protest the "real Trek fan can't possibly enjoy Abrams Trek", shtick, you can't give them any ammo to make the same argument in reverse.

 

[AnnLouise]

I think the movie has a lot of flaws and if they stop you from liking it then that's fine. However if other people can overlook the flaws and inconsistencies and blatant homeage then why aren't their opinions as valid as yours.

For me, a movie becomes "bad" when something in it takes me out of the movie experience. I starting thinking about the flaw, and not the movie. For me, the flaws in ST didn't take me out of the film, so I'm more forgiving of them.

 

[CaptainDonovin]

How does one run like a dork, anyway ?

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzrI15uw92k[/yt]

One can always find a good explanation for things from the Pythons.

 

[BillJ]

As far as plot-holes go...

When the Enterprise starts what I've seen called her improbable fall to Earth, couldn't she have actually been in the planet's orbital path? At roughly 67,000 miles per hour and factoring in the time it took for New Vulcan to be called, the Vengeance repaired, torpedoes to be sabotaged I don't think the fall is as unlikely as when I saw the film before.

 

[Ovation]

An excellent example of applying a bit of thought to the available evidence and arriving at a reasonably plausible conclusion without having it all explicitly laid out to you.

You deserve a commendation for original thinking.

 

[Commishsleer]

I think the movie has a lot of flaws and if they stop you from liking it then that's fine. However if other people can overlook the flaws and inconsistencies and blatant homeage then why aren't their opinions as valid as yours.

For me, a movie becomes "bad" when something in it takes me out of the movie experience. I starting thinking about the flaw, and not the movie. For me, the flaws in ST didn't take me out of the film, so I'm more forgiving of them.

Its OK not to like it but its OK for others to like it.

'Naked Now' took me out of TNG for years. I still hate it. Yet lots of people like TNG and 'Naked Now'. That's OK - it was my loss. As the years have progressed I'm getting over it and even like some Season 1 of TNG

I just don't know how you can say you're a Trek fan and not enjoy Into Darkness on at least some level.

Some people are only 24th century fans.

For me, Spock yelling "Khaaan!!!!" or running down the street like a dork destroys my suspension of disbelief in a way that thinking "Gee, wasn't Checkov not on the Enterprise during Space Seed?" doesn't.

I agree with others that Nimoy used to 'run like a girl' in TOS on the few occasions he did run.
It was adorable

Myself and CorporalCaptain in another thread thought he looked like an albatross ready to take flight! (still adorable...)

I thought it was just me

 

[Shazam!]

As far as plot-holes go...

When the Enterprise starts what I've seen called her improbable fall to Earth, couldn't she have actually been in the planet's orbital path? At roughly 67,000 miles per hour and factoring in the time it took for New Vulcan to be called, the Vengeance repaired, torpedoes to be sabotaged I don't think the fall is as unlikely as when I saw the film before.

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/62867

And then! To top it off, they start crashing into, what? Not the Moon, the Earth! I *think* some character mumbles something about them being caught in the Earth’s gravity, and they are all the sudden being pulled in. Here’s where the movie gets a little cloudy, or maybe it is just my understanding of what was supposed to be going on. Within a few minutes they are pulled from right next to the Moon all the way into the Earth’s atmosphere. This is just insane.

Rather than go through some equations about how long this would take, instead we can just look at the case of Apollo 13. We launched a rocket from Earth, and due to a catastrophic failure of one of the oxygen tanks, they had to abort their lunar landing mission and move to a “free return” trajectory around the moon, and back to Earth. “Free return” just means that you don’t have to fire the rockets to return to Earth, you just use lunar gravity to swing you back around to Earth, with some minor course corrections. This is cool, because it tells us how long it takes a spaceship to “fall” back to Earth from the moon, if it can’t use its engines! In the case of Apollo 13, it took about 64 hours. Actually, that’s faster than it otherwise would have, because they did burn the descent engine two hours after swinging around the moon to speed their return to Earth by 10 hours. Anyway, the bottom line is that it takes *days*, not minutes, for a spacecraft to fall to Earth from lunar orbit.

When the Enterprise is falling into the Earth, it looks like it is falling straight into it, as if the two are balls on a string being drawn to each other. That’s not the way two bodies gravitationally attracted to each other work -- they approach each other on curved paths. Have you ever wondered why everything in space orbits something? It is because of conservation of angular momentum.

The most famous terrestrial example is an ice skater spinning. When she draws in her outstretched arms, she starts spinning faster and faster. The same thing would happen to the Enterprise as it fell to Earth. It wouldn’t fall straight in, it would kind of orbit. If it didn’t have the energy to make a complete orbit, it would still sort of half-loop around the Earth, and come in at an angle.

What energy would it have? Ignoring vectors, the formula for angular momentum (L) is L=rmv, where r is the distance from the axis of rotation to the thing rotating around it, m is the mass, and v is the velocity perpendicular to the line defined by r. We can make a ratio of the angular momentum at the Moon’s orbit and the angular momentum as the Enterprise enters the Earth’s atmosphere. Then, since angular momentum is conserved, and mass is conserved, these two quantities cancel. We’re left with vE=vM*(rM/rE). The ratio of the distance to the Moon to the Earth’s radius is about 60. That means whatever transverse velocity the Enterprise had at the orbit of the Moon would be amplified by a factor of 60 by the time it reached Earth, just due to conservation of angular momentum.

Would they have even crashed into the Earth? The escape velocity of the Earth (the velocity needed to achieve orbit) is about 7 km/s if you are already in space (it is higher if you have to leave the surface). And 7 km/s / 60 = about 100 m/s. So if the Enterprise was traveling at 100 meters per second or more relative to the Earth when it was at the Moon’s orbit, it never would have fallen all the way to the Earth, it would have attained orbital velocity by the time it reached the atmosphere. One hundred meters per second is not very fast -- that’s only ten times faster than a human can run! That’s nothing for a ship that just dropped out of warp and is being hit by projectiles. Just shoot a photon torpedo in the opposite direction and let the back reaction give you the tiny push to remain in orbit.

Fine, so you have to have them actually crash into Earth, because the script calls for it. My point is, show them streaking into the atmosphere at an angle, not falling directly down on the Earth. It is a small thing, but to anyone who knows science, it is glaring, and just shows that most people who worked on this movie know very little about physics and didn’t talk to anyone who did.

 

[Kruezerman]

Isn't Ain't It Cool vehemently against the JJ films? To the point of irrational hatred?

 

[Shazam!]

No, Harry loved it and so did Capone.