Star Trek: Generations Review

[GalaxyX]

I don't deny that they bungled the movie overall and they should fought certain stuido requirments, but the whole "you can use footage from the previous movie in the climax" thing strikes me as just moving the goal posts or setting them up un-necessairly.

Was a cheap move? Sure. But when you're making a movie on a budget you've got to make cuts in some places so other places can benefit. I find it more stupid and cheap that they had two different kinds of uniforms being used in the movie on the same ship and that Frakes had to be melted down and poured into Avery Brook's uniform from DS9. Nothing would've been gained from building a new BOP model and blowing it up just for the climax scene. Why go through all of that, spend all of that money when you've already got usable footage of the ship blowing up.

And I know the Duras sisters were supposed to be in a new Klingon vessel, making it a more even match with the -D, but that was changed, likely because of the footage/budget deal. But, really, of all the problems Generations has reusing a piece of footage from the previous movie is the very least of them.

That's exactly my point. The story was rewritten to accommodate the desire to use the old footage.

I would have told Paramount to eat shit and pony up for a decent movie. They did with TMP, and now with ST9, and wow, both movies have been highly successful! Who'd have thunk it?

 

[Trekker4747]

ST:IV also had a limited budget and a lot of restrictions from the studio and that movie is fairly highly regarded, most importantly from the general public.

Honestly, saying the studio pressured them the budget was tight, etc. is just giving them excuses. If they had more talent, and the director wasn't a useless TV hack, they could've made a really good movie. They didn't. They made excuses for themselves and pointed fingers at the studio/producers. Bullshit.

 

[doubleohfive]

GalaxyX: The destruction of the bird of prey in Generations was NOT the climax of the film. It may have been the climax of one particularly important action piece, but the hinge of the film it is not.

Treker: Your assertion that the modified Excelsior class was a sign of not being cheap doesn't hold water. The whole reason they made the modifications to the old Excelsior model were precisely because they did not want to risk damaging the original Excelsior model while filming the extensive damage that would have to appear on the ship following the Enterprise-B's encounter with the Nexus. Specifically, the filmmakers did not want to have to carve up the secondary hull.

 

[doubleohfive]

I don't deny that they bungled the movie overall and they should fought certain stuido requirments, but the whole "you can use footage from the previous movie in the climax" thing strikes me as just moving the goal posts or setting them up un-necessairly.

Was a cheap move? Sure. But when you're making a movie on a budget you've got to make cuts in some places so other places can benefit. I find it more stupid and cheap that they had two different kinds of uniforms being used in the movie on the same ship and that Frakes had to be melted down and poured into Avery Brook's uniform from DS9. Nothing would've been gained from building a new BOP model and blowing it up just for the climax scene. Why go through all of that, spend all of that money when you've already got usable footage of the ship blowing up.

And I know the Duras sisters were supposed to be in a new Klingon vessel, making it a more even match with the -D, but that was changed, likely because of the footage/budget deal. But, really, of all the problems Generations has reusing a piece of footage from the previous movie is the very least of them.

That's exactly my point. The story was rewritten to accommodate the desire to use the old footage.

I would have told Paramount to eat shit and pony up for a decent movie. They did with TMP, and now with ST9, and wow, both movies have been highly successful! Who'd have thunk it?

ST:IV also had a limited budget and a lot of restrictions from the studio and that movie is fairly highly regarded, most importantly from the general public.

Honestly, saying the studio pressured them the budget was tight, etc. is just giving them excuses. If they had more talent, and the director wasn't a useless TV hack, they could've made a really good movie. They didn't. They made excuses for themselves and pointed fingers at the studio/producers. Bullshit.

This is, I gather, why you both make your living writing, producing and directing feature films?

 

[Char Aznable]

GalaxyX: The destruction of the bird of prey in Generations was NOT the climax of the film. It may have been the climax of one particularly important action piece, but the hinge of the film it is not.

Its still the climax of the big space battle, which is an important part of the movie. And pretty fucking blatent.

Of course, that's almost as bad as using stock footage from the fucking TV show! Now THAT was pathetic.

This is, I gather, why you both make your living writing, producing and directing feature films?

HERP DERP, U'VE NOT MADE SUCCESSFUL MOVIES, SO U CAN'T CRITICIZE ANY MOVIES! HERP DERP!

 

[Amaris]

Funny recap, but a minor gripe on it.

The Reccaper criticizes the movie for making the Enterprise-B an Excelsior-class vessel. This critique is silly for a couple of reasons. First of all, that the Enterprise-B was an Excelsior-class had already been established, or at the very least suggested, by the lineage wall in the E-D Observation Loung/conference room. Secondly any "cheaping out" decision on the part of the filmakers would be negated by it being a modified Excelsior-class and the new SFX shots used with it (excluding, of course, the Warp effect.) So it seemed like a needless critique to make and not one I've ever heard before in regards to this movie.

And I still don't think the reuse of the BOP shot was all that bad.

As said above several times. Stock footage usually is not a bad thing. However, using the exact same footage from the climax of the previous film as the climax of your next film truly reeks of cheapskateness (is that a word? )

This was supposed to be the entrance of TNG into the movie world. It was supposed to be epic and grandiose, but ended up flat and boring, like one of the bad TNG 2 parters.

If Braga and Moore were complaining that they were given a laundry list of stuff that "had" to be in the movie, then they should have fought it. It seems the very cliches they didn't want to do are almost the exact same ones they fell back to in the next movie, and it turned out 10 times better. Go figure.

Exactly. It's immediately noticeable and pulls me right out of the movie.

 

[doubleohfive]

GalaxyX: The destruction of the bird of prey in Generations was NOT the climax of the film. It may have been the climax of one particularly important action piece, but the hinge of the film it is not.

Its still the climax of the big space battle, which is an important part of the movie. And pretty fucking blatent.

I believe I did iterate this same point in precisely the passage you quoted.

Of course, that's almost as bad as using stock footage from the fucking TV show! Now THAT was pathetic.

Where? The only instance I can think this might have happened was a fly-by of the Enterprise over a planet ... but even then, wouldn't the crew have had to re-shoot the sequence to adjust for the film being made in widescreen as opposed to the traditional (at the time) 4:3 television effects shots?

This is, I gather, why you both make your living writing, producing and directing feature films?

HERP DERP, U'VE NOT MADE SUCCESSFUL MOVIES, SO U CAN'T CRITICIZE ANY MOVIES! HERP DERP!

I am overwhelmed by your stunningly brilliant rebuttal.

While I probably could have been more direct and explanatory with that particular reply, the fact of the matter none of us worked on the film. A fair majority of the posters on this board have likewise never worked on a major studio production -- television, film or otherwise.

Criticize all you want. I was not at all trying to mute the criticisms. Rather, I shall be blunt and merely say "If you think you can do better, do it."

 

[Trekker4747]

Criticize all you want. I was not at all trying to mute the criticisms. Rather, I shall be blunt and merely say "If you think you can do better, do it."

Give me 40 million dollars and the rights to do so and I will.

 

[BolianAuthor]

Generations has been reviewed at The Agony Booth. Enjoy!

http://www.agonybooth.com/movies/Star_Trek__Generations_1994.aspx

Wow... this guy jumped on EVERY single inconsistency in the film, yet somehow knew enough about the minute details of Trekdom to know that Kirk's Enterprise was a Constellation-Class ship... huh.

 

[Jeyl]

Wow... this guy jumped on EVERY single inconsistency in the film, yet somehow knew enough about the minute details of Trekdom to know that Kirk's Enterprise was a Constellation-Class ship... huh.

He also got the Soran/Geordi scene wrong when he thought Soran was trying to get the Enterprise's shield frequency when in fact he was trying to get Geordi to tell him what he knew about Trilithium.

Still, I'm glad he wrote this review because the film has outright terrible execution and ill-concieved ideas.

 

[RobertScorpio]

Man, I forgot how seriously some of you guys take these things... how do you enjoy anything?

I totally agree. I liked Generations, and that's all that really matters.

I love how people keep bashing GENERATIONS for that reuse of the BOP blowing up from TUC, but totally forgive the reuse of...

1. TMP footage when Enterprise leaves space dock in KHAN
2. Right before Enterprise goes into warp, after Kirk gets call from Carol, is reuse from TMP..as is the fly by right after that.

3. The Search for Spock reuses the same shot TWICE in the same movie..when the BOP blows up the freighter and speeds off is the same shot after they get Spock aboard the enterprise and head to vulcan...

4. The voyage home reuses the same pan in shot of the BOP that was used in SEARCH FOR SPOCK.

Oh well...

Rob

 

[doubleohfive]

Criticize all you want. I was not at all trying to mute the criticisms. Rather, I shall be blunt and merely say "If you think you can do better, do it."

Give me 40 million dollars and the rights to do so and I will.

The burden of funding a project generally falls upon the person in question seeking to write, produce, direct said project.

In other words, you're on your own.

 

[GalaxyX]

I am overwhelmed by your stunningly brilliant rebuttal.

While I probably could have been more direct and explanatory with that particular reply, the fact of the matter none of us worked on the film. A fair majority of the posters on this board have likewise never worked on a major studio production -- television, film or otherwise.

Criticize all you want. I was not at all trying to mute the criticisms. Rather, I shall be blunt and merely say "If you think you can do better, do it."

There are many super talented people in the world that never get a chance to put it to use, for several reasons. Perhaps they had the talent but just didn't try hard enough? Perhaps they tried but could never get anyone interested in the ideas? (Remember a little well known movie NO studio wanted to do at all? Back to the Future! Universal took a chance shaking in their boots, and it became a commercial success). Perhaps they just didn't want to suck all the dick necessary to suck to get that far ahead?

 

[Char Aznable]

Where? The only instance I can think this might have happened was a fly-by of the Enterprise over a planet ... but even then, wouldn't the crew have had to re-shoot the sequence to adjust for the film being made in widescreen as opposed to the traditional (at the time) 4:3 television effects shots?

The stock shot I mentioned is when Picard is giving a log entry about Data's emotion chip being fused in place, just before the Stellar cartography scene.

I am overwhelmed by your stunningly brilliant rebuttal.

I try.

While I probably could have been more direct and explanatory with that particular reply, the fact of the matter none of us worked on the film. A fair majority of the posters on this board have likewise never worked on a major studio production -- television, film or otherwise.

And that means I can't call something crap just because I've never made a major motion picture?

Criticize all you want. I was not at all trying to mute the criticisms. Rather, I shall be blunt and merely say "If you think you can do better, do it."

Again,

 

[Admiral James Kirk]

Man, I forgot how seriously some of you guys take these things... how do you enjoy anything?

I totally agree. I liked Generations, and that's all that really matters.

I love how people keep bashing GENERATIONS for that reuse of the BOP blowing up from TUC, but totally forgive the reuse of...

1. TMP footage when Enterprise leaves space dock in KHAN
2. Right before Enterprise goes into warp, after Kirk gets call from Carol, is reuse from TMP..as is the fly by right after that.

3. The Search for Spock reuses the same shot TWICE in the same movie..when the BOP blows up the freighter and speeds off is the same shot after they get Spock aboard the enterprise and head to vulcan...

4. The voyage home reuses the same pan in shot of the BOP that was used in SEARCH FOR SPOCK.

Oh well...

Rob

When Generations suddenly becomes as good as TWOK or TVH I'll forgive it for everything.

 

[RobertScorpio]

that really isnt the point is it?

And, as i said a zillion times, I think Generations is the best TNG movie..which isnt really saying much..but its true...

Rob

 

[GalaxyX]

I would forgive it if they hadn't killed Kirk.

 

[Captain Robert April]

They could canonize the Shatner novels and a lot would be forgiven...

 

[bullethead]

They could canonize the Shatner novels and a lot would be forgiven...

Those aren't that great to begin with. The Return is good, the one after that was forgettable, the Mirrorverse trilogy started off pretty well, then kinda unraveled during/after Dark Victory.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Undiscovered Country is the first film -- well, not including Motion Picture -- that doesn't re-use stock footage from the previous films.

Whoop, not quite. There is a very brief clip of the Enterprise moving forward in spacedock which was from Trek 4, and also reused in 5. But, I think that's about it, unless there's BoP footage I forgot.