Star Trek: Axanar

[Tom Servo]

Nope, you misunderstand.

It's about the poster knowing more about what they're talking about than you do.

I understand perfectly. You're defending Bill and Tom by agreeing with their argument that industry insider opinions are intrinsically correct because of them "knowing more" than a mere "fan" does.

I don't think it's a matter of what's "correct" or not. It's a matter of practical experience and knowledge of how the industry works and the work that is done in it. Unless you or I work in that field, no matter how much you think you or I know about it, we just don't have the practical experience to comment beyond a certain point on the issue. That's not to dismiss our opinions, but our credibility on it will only carry us so far. To dismiss the expertise of those who actually do the work is short-sighted and, frankly, rude.

You're a snob agreeing with other snobs, in other words.

This is also rude, and in my opinion, entirely uncalled for.

Exactly. I'm not attempting to be a snob, nor honestly do I think I was acting like one. I'm simply trying to explain the decision making process that occurs when budgeting VFX. I may be an artist working on shots, but I've also been in the meetings with the producers trying to figure out budgets and time estimates concerning shots and the methodologies that will be implemented. Yes all VFX has a level artistic license, but is also an intense technical process with factual elements and rules that must be followed to achieve a convincing result to the viewer.

I don't tell my mechanic he is being a snob when he comments on something being off on my car, even if I don't notice it. He has the experience and expertise to notice things I don't. One thing I have been very fortunate to experience in my career so far is mentoring by some of the best VFX supervisors in the industry.

 

[TerryMcIntosh]

I understand perfectly. You're defending Bill and Tom by agreeing with their argument that industry insider opinions are intrinsically correct because of them "knowing more" than a mere "fan" does.

I don't think it's a matter of what's "correct" or not. It's a matter of practical experience and knowledge of how the industry works and the work that is done in it. Unless you or I work in that field, no matter how much you think you or I know about it, we just don't have the practical experience to comment beyond a certain point on the issue. That's not to dismiss our opinions, but our credibility on it will only carry us so far. To dismiss the expertise of those who actually do the work is short-sighted and, frankly, rude.

You're a snob agreeing with other snobs, in other words.

This is also rude, and in my opinion, entirely uncalled for.

Exactly. I'm not attempting to be a snob, nor honestly do I think I was acting like one. I'm simply trying to explain the decision making process that occurs when budgeting VFX. I may be an artist working on shots, but I've also been in the meetings with the producers trying to figure out budgets and time estimates concerning shots and the methodologies that will be implemented. Yes all VFX has a level artistic license, but is also an intense technical process with factual elements and rules that must be followed to achieve a convincing result to the viewer.

I don't tell my mechanic he is being a snob when he comments on something being off on my car, even if I don't notice it. He has the experience and expertise to notice things I don't. One thing I have been very fortunate to experience in my career so far is mentoring by some of the best VFX supervisors in the industry.

I'd tend to agree, especially observing how much work (and stress) Alec is going through to make sure to everything in the budget is accounted for -- meaning nothing is missed to avoid surprises -- and then to also negotiate rates (where possible) to keep the expenses down.

That's not my department at all, but I watch it unfold from the front row, and have supreme respect for not only what EPs need to do to make things happen, but how every member of the team, and every department, does what needs to be done for the good of the production even if it's against their (or our) best personal interests. Self-sacrifice for the sake of the work is something that was rare in my main profession (geekdom), and it also seems rare in the entertainment business. But, when you see it, it's sure something to behold and is a proper morale booster. Good people doing good things to get the ship to port and with the highest quality, no matter what industry, demonstrates integrity and good character.

 

[Amaris]

I've learned, over the years, not to underestimate a handful of people determined to see a project through. You guys have funding (hopefully all of it soon!), professionals behind and in front of the camera, and a desire to really make something great, and I cannot wait to see the final results.

 

[fireproof78]

I don't think it's a matter of what's "correct" or not. It's a matter of practical experience and knowledge of how the industry works and the work that is done in it. Unless you or I work in that field, no matter how much you think you or I know about it, we just don't have the practical experience to comment beyond a certain point on the issue. That's not to dismiss our opinions, but our credibility on it will only carry us so far. To dismiss the expertise of those who actually do the work is short-sighted and, frankly, rude.

This is also rude, and in my opinion, entirely uncalled for.

Exactly. I'm not attempting to be a snob, nor honestly do I think I was acting like one. I'm simply trying to explain the decision making process that occurs when budgeting VFX. I may be an artist working on shots, but I've also been in the meetings with the producers trying to figure out budgets and time estimates concerning shots and the methodologies that will be implemented. Yes all VFX has a level artistic license, but is also an intense technical process with factual elements and rules that must be followed to achieve a convincing result to the viewer.

I don't tell my mechanic he is being a snob when he comments on something being off on my car, even if I don't notice it. He has the experience and expertise to notice things I don't. One thing I have been very fortunate to experience in my career so far is mentoring by some of the best VFX supervisors in the industry.

I'd tend to agree, especially observing how much work (and stress) Alec is going through to make sure to everything in the budget is accounted for -- meaning nothing is missed to avoid surprises -- and then to also negotiate rates (where possible) to keep the expenses down.

That's not my department at all, but I watch it unfold from the front row, and have supreme respect for not only what EPs need to do to make things happen, but how every member of the team, and every department, does what needs to be done for the good of the production even if it's against their (or our) best personal interests. Self-sacrifice for the sake of the work is something that was rare in my main profession (geekdom), and it also seems rare in the entertainment business. But, when you see it, it's sure something to behold and is a proper morale booster. Good people doing good things to get the ship to port and with the highest quality, no matter what industry, demonstrates integrity and good character.

Ugh, yes. I did only basic, student level, Assistant Director stuff for a friend working on his film degree and trying to arrange shots for his final project at one location, while he did school in another part of the state. Frustrating.

I'm glad Axanar has a good, professional, team behind it and moving things forward. The more I read about, the more confident I am in this fan production-I rarely say that.

Terry, another question. Will there be extras casting call, or anything like that?

Maybe if I make my uniform just right and film some stuff in front of a green screen I could squeeze it in

 

[Quinton O'Connor]

Late to the party again, but that shot with Soval is absolutely breathtaking.

 

[Amaris]

Late to the party again, but that shot with Soval is absolutely breathtaking.

Pfft. They cheat by being talented.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

I like to think that Klingon society is a lot more complex and dynamic than what we are commonly shown. It would pretty much have to be.

Not necessarily. Klingons are not human. I prefer to think that they really are like their Beowulf counterparts; warlike with no capacity for anything else. If they're not fighting anyone else they're perfectly at ease with fighting each other.

But in that case they'd still have Beowulf's level of technology, and even that wouldn't last long before they either move on to a more productive lifestyle or kill each other.

At least the Packleds had the excuse of appearing to be harmless when you first meet them which would explain how they get their technology. But the Klingons are again and again depicted as having their own technology and their own engineers, so there's no way their society could be THAT single-minded.

 

[TerryMcIntosh]

Terry, another question. Will there be extras casting call, or anything like that?

Maybe if I make my uniform just right and film some stuff in front of a green screen I could squeeze it in

Casting is now being handled by a proper casting director in Hollywood, simply because it's become (like so many other aspects of the production as it's moved from the fetal stage to what I'll call the teenage years) a proper department in and of itself.

We surely will be casting extras 'off the street' as it were, especially for a scene that we'll be filming on location, and not to mention we'll need crews for the various ships, but right now the best way that anyone can guarantee to be in Axanar is at the (more than trivially expensive) donation level. Beyond that, if you're interested in being considered, and can physically be in L.A. when we're shooting those scenes toward the end of this year (when it's not brutally hot) then please email a head shot, resume, and IMDb, if they're available, to casting@axanarproductions.com and it'll land in the hands of whom it needs to.

 

[Amaris]

If you ever need "man locked in restroom during red alert, flushes comm badge down commode," I'm your man.

Umm, you'll have to provide airfare and accommodations.

 

[YJAGG]

I like to think that Klingon society is a lot more complex and dynamic than what we are commonly shown. It would pretty much have to be.

Not necessarily. Klingons are not human. I prefer to think that they really are like their Beowulf counterparts; warlike with no capacity for anything else. If they're not fighting anyone else they're perfectly at ease with fighting each other.

I disagree, we have seen so much more in DS9, and although Klingons are not humans their actions are written by humans.

We see Klingon arts and crafts in the shows so therefore there had to be more then hacking and slashing.

Maybe they were like the Feudal Samurai culture of Japan, if you can not be a warrior on the battlefield be a warrior at what you do.

 

[Richard Baker]

The Sontarans from Dr Who come to mind. Revel in combat and develop the technology to allow you to dominate your opponent. I think a Klingon who could create or make available a powerful weapon would achieve great honor (Kruge/Genesis)

 

[JES]

I saw the initial film some time ago, but only found this thread recently.

Some of the problems that I had with the film was the Korolev getting blasted without even fighting back, and depicting the Federation as completely helpless to the Klingon's assault.

I would've interpreted it as a case of Starfleet's patrols being outnumbered and outgunned during the initial engagements on the border, and by the time Starfleet got enough ships to launch a counter attack, the Klingons had a foothold.

I also didn't like the fact that there were only ships based off of the designs used in the past two movies.
The Saladin and Baton Rouge class should also have had important roles in the fleet at the time.

If it were up to me, I'd also have tried to get some of Masao's designs in there as well, since he as quite a few contemporary designs.

I think that the scene were the Ares comes in and starts fighting the Klingon ships should've been escorted by a couple of Loknar and Larson class ships as well, since this would've been a major tip of the hat to FASA.

And I would've just interpreted newer designs like the Ares, Loknar, and Larson classes as being a means to regain momentum. The older contemporary starship classes at the time would just have to have held the line until they were launched.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

The Sontarans from Dr Who come to mind. Revel in combat and develop the technology to allow you to dominate your opponent. I think a Klingon who could create or make available a powerful weapon would achieve great honor (Kruge/Genesis)

Similar to the Krogan in "Mass Effect." It's not so much that they are a warrior race, they're just very very intense about everything they do, mainly because they evolved a planet where literally EVERYTHING is carnivorous.

Still, I have to think they wouldn't have much of an "Empire" if their entire civilization was THAT dedicated to warfare. I could see them being the kind of species that never does anything by a half measure with a "there's no kill like overkill!" approach to everything from space combat to dish washing.

 

[Kemaiku]

I'll take the newer designs over the TOS kitbash filler any day.

 

[beamMe]

I'll take the newer designs over the TOS kitbash filler any day.

Well, here we are getting a good mix of updated-TOS designs kitbashed with the good stuff from nuTrek.

 

[Kemaiku]

I'll take the newer designs over the TOS kitbash filler any day.

Well, here we are getting a good mix of updated-TOS designs kitbashed with the good stuff from nuTrek.

I was refering more to the 70's publications that just had about twenty different configurations of the Enterprise.

The Axanar designs we've seen so far look far more diverse and pleasant, for the most part.

 

[Maurice]

... Saladin and Baton Rouge class should also have had important roles in the fleet at the time.

If it were up to me, I'd also have tried to get some of Masao's designs in there as well, since he as quite a few contemporary designs.

...escorted by a couple of Loknar and Larson class ships as well, since this would've been a major tip of the hat to FASA.

...Ares, Loknar, and Larson classes...

No disrespect, but all of that would mean nothing to 99% of their potential audience.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

... I also didn't like the fact that there were only ships based off of the designs used in the past two movies.
The Saladin and Baton Rouge class should also have had important roles in the fleet at the time.

If it were up to me, I'd also have tried to get some of Masao's designs in there as well, since he as quite a few contemporary designs.

I think that the scene were the Ares comes in and starts fighting the Klingon ships should've been escorted by a couple of Loknar and Larson class ships as well, since this would've been a major tip of the hat to FASA.

And I would've just interpreted newer designs like the Ares, Loknar, and Larson classes...

All of that would mean nothing to 99% of their potential audience.

Ships are nice. Story is better.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

... I also didn't like the fact that there were only ships based off of the designs used in the past two movies.
The Saladin and Baton Rouge class should also have had important roles in the fleet at the time.

If it were up to me, I'd also have tried to get some of Masao's designs in there as well, since he as quite a few contemporary designs.

I think that the scene were the Ares comes in and starts fighting the Klingon ships should've been escorted by a couple of Loknar and Larson class ships as well, since this would've been a major tip of the hat to FASA.

And I would've just interpreted newer designs like the Ares, Loknar, and Larson classes...

All of that would mean nothing to 99% of their potential audience.

Particularly people like me, who never actually READ any of the FASA books and is only aware of their existence from TrekBBS and from having browsed a few of them for a couple of seconds at a Star Trek convention once.

I think Axanar will work superbly as a Star Trek fan film of the pre-TOS days. It doesn't need to become "FASA: the Motion Picture."

 

[gazomg]

... I also didn't like the fact that there were only ships based off of the designs used in the past two movies.
The Saladin and Baton Rouge class should also have had important roles in the fleet at the time.

If it were up to me, I'd also have tried to get some of Masao's designs in there as well, since he as quite a few contemporary designs.

I think that the scene were the Ares comes in and starts fighting the Klingon ships should've been escorted by a couple of Loknar and Larson class ships as well, since this would've been a major tip of the hat to FASA.

And I would've just interpreted newer designs like the Ares, Loknar, and Larson classes...

All of that would mean nothing to 99% of their potential audience.

Ships are nice. Story is better.