Star Trek and Colonialism...

[oberth]

Is there any evidence that the xenomorphs were native to the planet? The humans were colonists and I assume they expected LV-426 to be devoid of life (they didn't realize they were sent there with ulterior motives).

The xenomorphs don't appear to have a society per se (is there ever any evidence of one?), so it's hard for me to believe that they would intentionally colonize so much as infest.

wtf would colonise a rock 'devoid of life' - they really needed a fat replicator if they tried that

 

[Jedi Marso]

Is there any evidence that the xenomorphs were native to the planet? The humans were colonists and I assume they expected LV-426 to be devoid of life (they didn't realize they were sent there with ulterior motives).

The xenomorphs don't appear to have a society per se (is there ever any evidence of one?), so it's hard for me to believe that they would intentionally colonize so much as infest.

That wasn't actually a serious question on my part.

However... actually, there was evidence that the aliens were NOT indigenous to LV-426 in that the original eggs were in a derelict spacecraft. And while the word 'society' is debatable when applied to them, they do seem to act with some rationality and intelligence, their murder-hobo tendencies aside.

 

[ChallengerHK]

You know if you believe we should leave our planet and colonize other worlds in our solar system and galaxy. You are a colonialist like 18th colonialism. Y

Your Lit Major background is showing.

 

[Nyotarules]

Based on the present definition of colonialism, the UFP are not a colonial power but they are semi imperialist.

 

[Oddish]

However, if you visited Earth say 1 million years ago, Earth would be prime real estate for a colony .. But we eventually developed. So a colony may not allow a future species to be created.

Either we don't worry about the possible emergence of future species, or we don't colonize anything other than airless moons. Since we can't predict the future, no third option.

 

[at Quark's]

Either we don't worry about the possible emergence of future species, or we don't colonize anything other than airless moons. Since we can't predict the future, no third option.

And even then you'd have to be absolutely certain that no life can ever develop under such conditions.

On the other hand, perhaps you don't have to think in absolutes. Perhaps it's a sliding scale, where colonizing a planet with only primitive life where sapience is at least a hundred million years away (barring some freak accident) is simply less objectionable than colonizing a planet with a proto-sapient species that may well develop into actual sapience over the next few hundred thousand years or so.

 

[Kor]

Gotta watch out for those particles of preanimate matter caught in the matrix.

Why is that bad?

I haven't been following this discussion too closely, so I'm not sure if somebody thinks that's bad in itself. I don't think it's bad, as long as they're not doing this in places that are already inhabited.

Kor

 

[BillJ]

Only problems I can think of are..
Find a planet, no higher intelligence there... They colonize.
However, if you visited Earth say 1 million years ago, Earth would be prime real estate for a colony .. But we eventually developed. So a colony may not allow a future species to be created.

I have to say that I’m not too terribly concerned about what might happen a million years from now.

 

[Ferengi Prime 5]

Which Rule of Acquisition says colonialism is bad? Asking for a friend.

Ferengi are not a imperium like the other Space faring powers. Its a merchant gild trying to gain power through wealth. They are like the Hanseatic League of Germany or maybe the medieval Genoese setting up trading colonies... not for conquest... They want to ride the "Great River" or "The Great Material Continuum"...

 

[urbandefault]

Ferengi are not a imperium like the other Space faring powers. Its a merchant gild trying to gain power through wealth. They are like the Hanseatic League of Germany or maybe the medieval Genoese setting up trading colonies... not for conquest... They want to ride the "Great River" or "The Great Material Continuum"...

The Ferengi are colonialists when it is profitable.

Rule of Acquisition #45 (or #95): Expand or die.

Also, The Unwritten Rule: When no appropriate rule applies, make one up.

 

[Ferengi Prime 5]

Please. After just inventing warp drive a society is almost certainly still centuries away from being a threat to the Federation.

Once you invent warp one day you will be a threat to the Federation so the Federation intervenes early to assimilate them into the Federation or else...

In "The Day the Earth Stood Still": The people of Earth have invented the Hydrogen Bomb and an interplanetary organization steps in and gives earth a choice join or die... the Robot awaits....

The Federation shows up and gives the same choice subtly and nuanced. I can point to New Worlds S1-E1. Where Pike displays the Enterprise for all to see... Is that not intimidation... forcing them to chose...

 

[Ferengi Prime 5]

Rule of Acquisition #45 (or #95): Expand or die.

Also, The Unwritten Rule: When no appropriate rule applies, make one up.

Well you could imply rule 45 and 95 have colonial intention... In business if your not growing (expanding ) you are dying...

I like the Unwritten rule...

 

[Oddish]

Once you invent warp one day you will be a threat to the Federation so the Federation intervenes early to assimilate them into the Federation or else...

They don't assimilate you, at least not in the 24th century. Indeed, you can't join until you've eliminated certain social problems.

First Contact is just basically saying "howdy folks; just so you know, you're not alone out here."

If a newly contacted species wanted to join the Federation, the Federation envoy would tell them what was expected, which would likely include:
* Stable one-world government.
* Egalitarian society.
* Most social problems eliminated.
* Willingness to commit to the ideals of the Federation: peace, respect for life, non-interference.

 

[urbandefault]

Well you could imply rule 45 and 95 have colonial intention... In business if your not growing (expanding ) you are dying...

I like the Unwritten rule...

Pretty sure that's the one the Nagus lives by.

 

[oberth]

Pretty sure that's the one the Nagus lives by.

no way - as i see it he can offically issue new rules (kinda like the pope for catholics or the tsar issuing an ukase)

making them up on the way is for minions like quark (brunt probably lacks the fantasy for it)

 

[dupersuper]

Once you invent the wheel one day you will be a threat to the Federation so the Federation intervenes early to assimilate them into the Federation or else...

 

[Oddish]

^ By turning you into a food source while you're still non-sentient, right?

 

[Ferengi Prime 5]

I have to say that I’m not too terribly concerned about what might happen a million years from now.

The prime directive seems too...

 

[BillJ]

The prime directive seems too...

If it did, the Federation would never colonize worlds. Prime Directive has to do with sapient beings and cultures already in place.

 

[oberth]

If it did, the Federation would never colonize worlds. Prime Directive has to do with sapient beings and cultures already in place.

exactly - i always thought archer was making fun of t'pol when he said that

what is life? when archer allows reed to blow up that asteroid he has it checked for anything that might become sentient in 10 billion years (or somesuch)