Star Trek 4 Hits A Snag
- Thread starter Doc Mugatu
- Start date
As much as I love Shatner, I hope he never reappears in Trek. That cast photo appearing in BEYOND was just fine enough for me.
I doubt he will. They can’t afford him.
With these new tv shows coming and the lacklustre numbers the previous movies got, I would just scrap the idea. The ending of them getting the LinPrise was a good enough ending for the JJVerse.
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I agree, whether intentional or not, I really like the way BEYOND puts a cap on Kelvinverse TOS characters. Having each of the cast recite a piece of the Captain's oath at the very end feels like it could work as their farewell to the franchise.
Though I think the TV shows are the future of Trek, that's not Paramount's turf. The films are all they have as far as Trek goes and they can either try to keep it working or they'll never do anything else with it. They're pretty much on a tough spot with that brand name now.
Though I think the TV shows are the future of Trek, that's not Paramount's turf. The films are all they have as far as Trek goes and they can either try to keep it working or they'll never do anything else with it. They're pretty much on a tough spot with that brand name now.
It's not always about skill though.I'm just going to be blunt and say this.....Pine is a superior actor to Shatner...so, yeah just no...I liked Shatner's Kirk fine for his time, but that just would not mesh at all. If you are actually being serious anyway?
Look at Chris Pratt. He's not a great actor, but he has a certain charisma that people love. Shatner has a quirkiness about him that's all his own.
Pine might be a more versatile and skilled actor than the aforementioned, but he's also kind of generic. He'll never be as big as Pratt or as iconic as Shatner.
End of last movie flying off in the ENT-A/long awaited return of TV Trek following year.. we in 2018 or 1988
Shankar made good points, here's one:
I'd read the entire piece, but the easy solution here is to start the movie with a battle and Captain Kirk is killed. Chekov too or just say he was reassigned to the Reliant. This is an alternate timeline franchise and has already been fast and loose with characters, especially the first two Kelvin films. Be creative. For which, alt-timeline aside, the only thing that's been fully creative in terms of writing was "Beyond".
Heck, if he's been a writer, it'd be interesting to see how he'd write or co-write the film. As producer, he's definitely thinking all the right things a producer needs to in order to keep the project moving if possible.
(https://www.trektoday.com/content/2018/08/shankar-on-star-trek-4-minus-pine/)
I'd read the entire piece, but the easy solution here is to start the movie with a battle and Captain Kirk is killed. Chekov too or just say he was reassigned to the Reliant. This is an alternate timeline franchise and has already been fast and loose with characters, especially the first two Kelvin films. Be creative. For which, alt-timeline aside, the only thing that's been fully creative in terms of writing was "Beyond".
Heck, if he's been a writer, it'd be interesting to see how he'd write or co-write the film. As producer, he's definitely thinking all the right things a producer needs to in order to keep the project moving if possible.
I like this idea. It would force some real creativity. Heck they essentially made a whole movie without Spock.
Problem is, how do you make a convincing Kirk death scene without showing Kirk? Or would he just be played by another actor for the one scene?
OK I like this too.. And being a battle you don't have to actually show the bodies to say they died.
Oh I didn't say he wasn't great, but some of his Trek performances (because that's all I'm judging) were just off for me. But I think that may have been a flair of that era rather than an actor thing. But I still don't think Shatner could replace Kelvin verse Kirk.
Well sure, but then Paramount would still need Pine and Shatner.
On my part I never said he wasn't but he can't convincingly replace or be Kelvinverse Kirk. One of the main scenes for comparison that comes to mind is the scene with Shatner in TVH where he responds to Spock about his 'Guess'. It comes across to me as Kirk being an ass to Spock and mocking him, considering the guy can't remember anything. And then apparently the writers felt it necessary to explain it by McCoy saying it was a compliment. Yeah...sure it was. Compare that to STID where Spock says 'I will be happy to accompany you on the away team,' and Kirk Responds with 'You? Happy?' This line could also come across as mocking very easily but Pine played it beautifully, it was teasingly skeptical in tone with matching face expression. There are other comparisons that come to mind, but that one sticks out.
Of course, I'm only judging him on his Star Trek career as I've never really watched Shatner in other media except Miss Congeniality. He's done a lot of tv though so I'd expect him to have Emmys, but it's not fair to ask how many Pine has won since he is mainly a Movie star and not into TV except when he first started his career and had brief appearances.
Don't get me wrong, I loved Shatner's Kirk, but on my part there is no way he could ever replace Pine's Kirk in my eyes and do it convincingly. Just Nope!
Riight. I haven't seen a movie where Pratt stands out to me as any of that and definitely disagree that Pine isn't equal to Pratt if not better. I think that may be more of an individual preference thing though as Pratt seems like he usually plays comedy leaning characters and Pine not so much. He's done a few comedys, 'This Means War,' comes to mind.
Bones only told him that Spock had taken Khan's crew. He didn't have time to repeat the conversation between Prime Spock and younger Spock, which is what we were discussing when he says 'This is what you would have done.'
I will say one thing for that idea, if you want to permanently kill the Kelvin verse Star Trek films, that is the advice to follow.
Shatner telling Spock, 'you...guess' was said to Spock from deep friendship, rsspect, and friendly banter. Was it smart ass, prob, BUT done so as Kirk expressing how glad he was to have Spock back and exactly what McCoy explained later - he TRUSTED Spock's guesses more than others facts, Kirk trusted Spock completely n comfortable with Spock solving the equation
Pine Kirk to Spock was done just as well. Kirk telling Spock 'Thanks' for helping him see through his emotion n his realize his duty through friendly banter n non verbal expressions.
Both great examples of Kirk Spock friendship n respect, IMO
Now Shatner should done w ST and more importantly ST done w him, again IMO
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My response got put on the quote, my bad on 1st cup of coffee......
Pretty sure it was the universe closing down the movie unless contracts are honoured.
I mean, we can pretend Kirk really did take up an admiralty post on Yorktown, but the next ‘star’ On the Trek roster is Pegg...and he’s not a frontman for action adventure, unless it’s his own stuff.
KT is done without Pine/Kirk.
I mean, we can pretend Kirk really did take up an admiralty post on Yorktown, but the next ‘star’ On the Trek roster is Pegg...and he’s not a frontman for action adventure, unless it’s his own stuff.
KT is done without Pine/Kirk.
So I read this article here https://movieweb.com/star-trek-4-cast-chris-pine-zachary-quinto/ and I read some info I wasn't aware of. It's an old article from before Beyond came out I believe. Apparently they tried to rip off the Actors for Beyond too, and part of the deal of upping the pay was that Pine and Quinto sign a contract for Star Trek 4 and now Paramount is trying it again. These people never learn....here is the quote with the info I found interesting. It makes sense why Pine is fed up and walked away.
"Paramount only wanted to give its stars the standard raise as listed in their initial contracts from way back in 2007. Under California law, a personal services contract cannot bind someone for more than 7 years. In 2014, the old deals became invalid. While Paramount tried to dispute this, neither side wanted to go to court. And complicating the matter was the fact that some of the cast had risen in their star power considerably since 2009. Paramount agreed to a combination of hefty raises and better performance bonuses. At this time, the studio has no comment.
Though, Chris Pine appears to be the biggest winner, as the leader of the USS Enterprise. He only earned $600,000 for his 2009 performance. Now, he is looking to net a cool $6 million for this currently-shooting sequel. In 2013, he only got $1.5 million for Star Trek Into Darkness, and was supposed to get $3 million for Star Trek Beyond. Star Trek 4 is actually a result of these raises. One condition for the pay bump was that both Chris Pine and Zachary Quinto return for another movie, insuring that the iconic duo of Kirk and Spock remain in tact."
Though, Chris Pine appears to be the biggest winner, as the leader of the USS Enterprise. He only earned $600,000 for his 2009 performance. Now, he is looking to net a cool $6 million for this currently-shooting sequel. In 2013, he only got $1.5 million for Star Trek Into Darkness, and was supposed to get $3 million for Star Trek Beyond. Star Trek 4 is actually a result of these raises. One condition for the pay bump was that both Chris Pine and Zachary Quinto return for another movie, insuring that the iconic duo of Kirk and Spock remain in tact."
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At this point Shatner has built up a warchest of enough powerful acting moments that he shouldn't need to defend himself anymore. Sure, pound for pound, there's more cheese and ham and self-parody in his portfolio than credible drama, but he can and has done it many times over, usually with the guidance of a firm director at the helm to constrain him (like Nick Meyer).
They do, I agree! I just couldn't believe they were trying to pay these guys with only a small increase the same thing as 10-11 years previous for Beyond. It's like WTH were they thinking? I mean really? Makes me wonder how much they were actually trying to decrease his pay? By half? I wouldn't be surprised at all.
I think that is the issue exactly. As much as I loved Leonard Nimoy, I think this was the issue with Shatner's performance hiccups I mentioned earlier in TVH and then ran rampant in the Final Frontier. I know Shatner is capable of making that scene in TVH so much better but without the right hand on the reins, he turns in more, like you said self-parody or campy moments. What's weird is, I don't remember seeing as many of those moments in the tv series so someone must've had a really firm hand with him. Rodenberry himself no doubt. One of my fav exchanges in TOS was where Spock asks him if he realizes that asking him for his opinion on something Kirk has already made his mind up on is inefficient and Kirk answers it gives him emotional security. Love that scene.
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