ST canon is inconsistent and contradictory.

Discussion in 'General Trek Discussion' started by Trekkie27, Apr 20, 2020.

  1. 1001001

    1001001 I Like the Nightlife, Baby! Moderator

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    To knock myself unconscious with, yes...
     
  2. King Daniel Beyond

    King Daniel Beyond Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Pretty sure you could kill someone with it at this point. Or end poverty.
     
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  3. fireproof78

    fireproof78 Admiral Admiral

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    The principle is the same.
     
  4. Trekkie27

    Trekkie27 Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I like the end poverty part of it, but not the other.
     
  5. Dukhat

    Dukhat Vice Admiral Admiral

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    And in the context of the scene (the Neutral Zone, the enemy taking no prisoners) the footage should have been used to depict Romulan vessels, not Klingon.
     
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  6. JonnyQuest037

    JonnyQuest037 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, probably, but even in 1982, the Klingons were better known to the general public than the Romulans were.
     
  7. Dukhat

    Dukhat Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Oh, no doubt. I was just chiming in about the 'canon is inconsistent and contradictory' topic :)
     
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  8. Therin of Andor

    Therin of Andor Admiral Admiral

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    Ha! Changes to meet the challenges of new technologies and new audience expectations? Not a problem.

    And yet TOS had already shown us Romulans using Klingon vessels. The original ST III script did feature Romulans (the Neutral Zone, Valkris's ritual suicide, a Bird of Prey, taking prisoners) but changing to Klingons was probably to avoid having to explain why Sarek and Saavik were in the same story as Vulcanoid aliens while searching for Spock.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2020
  9. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    I believe it was the Klingon Neutral Zone being depicted in the TWoK test, not the Romulan one. Yes, there was a NZ between the Feds and the Klingons too.
     
  10. Nerys Myk

    Nerys Myk Tomorrow Never Knows Premium Member

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    And TWOK was the first place we heard of it.
     
  11. Noname Given

    Noname Given Admiral Admiral

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    Well remember - STIII:TSFS WAS going to involve the Romulans - but Paramount said: "Who? The General Audience won't know Romulans, Trekkies will but yeah the GA won't - make them Klingons."

    But the producers said hey the Ship design is still good and it would cost more money to redo that aspect - so hey Klingons now have a "Bird of Prey" ship with Cloaking abilities (which the Klingon Empire NEVER had prior to STIII:TSFS) :beer::lol:
     
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  12. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Klingon cruisers had cloaking devices in the TAS episode The Time Trap which aired in 1973.
     
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  13. Noname Given

    Noname Given Admiral Admiral

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    I'll have to re-watch that. "Time Trap" was (IMO) on of the better TAS episodes.
     
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  14. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Definitely a fun episode.
    The cloak is only a brief mention by Spock but it's definitely there! ;)
     
  15. Qonundrum

    Qonundrum Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Didn't Klingons have Romulan cloaking design thanks to "The Enterprise Incident"?

    Also, spellcheck decided those two words above were "Romanian cloaca". AI rules...
     
  16. Noname Given

    Noname Given Admiral Admiral

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    Was it? I thought there was a Federation/Klingon Neutral Zone set up under the Organian Peace Treaty? (From TOS S1 - "Errand Of Mercy" and mentioned in TOS S2 - "The Trouble With Tribbles")?
     
  17. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    That's just fanon speculation - all Spock says in response to Scotty's remark of surprise is "Intelligence reports Romulans now using Klingon designs"

    There's a "disputed area" mentioned in EOM which is where the planet Organia is situated. This is presumably also the case with Sherman's planet in TTWT, since the side which gets to develop it most efficiently gets to keep it.
    However, there's nothing like the Romulan Neutral Zone ever mentioned in TOS - the borders of the Klingons and Feds seem to butt right up against each other with a few areas of contested overlap.
     
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  18. Tenacity

    Tenacity Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Klingon neutral zone (to my eye) seemed a limited bubble, enclosing a relatively small area. Rather than a wall in space like the Romulan neutral zone.

    There formally was a neutral zone between Saudi Arabian and Iraq, but it only involved a portion of the border and not it's entire lenght.
     
  19. Trekkie27

    Trekkie27 Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    I have always presume a neutral zone between the borders of all major powers - Klingon/Federation, Romulan/Federation, and maybe even Romulan/Klingon, assuming they shared a common border.
     
  20. Tenacity

    Tenacity Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'd imagine it being inconsistent. There would be hard borders, contested borders and NZs, but the majority of the time would be just ill defined frontiers and unofficial (but reconized) boundries.

    Prior to Journey's End, the Federation and the Cardassian Union definately didn't agree on where each others space ended.