Spock's ESP didn't trigger an effect in WNMHGB

[Timo]

Or, as it the series evidence of the Valiant's crewman, along with Mitchell & Dehner strongly suggests, only full humans are subject to transformation / influence of the barrier, so Spock would not be at risk.

Full humans aren't mentioned as such, so the assorted unseen casualties could have come from whichever species.

That is, the Valiant crew searches for data on human ESP specifically - but in all likelilhood, this early vessel would have had a full human crew. Or would the Valiant have been assigned a Vulcan chaperon...? But if she had one aboard, and that one got killed (either by the Barrier, or because somebody in the crew saw a convenient opening!), then again the crew would search for human data exclusively.

Kirk's casualties are not given a species identity, nor is it confirmed that all of them were espers, just that the Barrier fried a specific part of their brain. And if it does that to everybody it hits, Spock might have taken a hit but to a harmless part of his brain...

What Spock has done with his telepathy, we've seen every other Vulcan who we've seen use it do the same thing.

Except for the "The WOMEN!" thing we see in "Omega Glory"...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kor]

We've never seen other Vulcans mind-meld with machines.

Kor

 

[Ronald Held]

Did the writer's guide mention Vulcan mental powers at the time of WNMHGB? My view of Spock is he in one of the minority of Vulcans where melding comes easily.

 

[Marsden]

I think a Vulcanian's extremely disciplined mind would completely protect them from those effects.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Did the writer's guide mention Vulcan mental powers at the time of WNMHGB? My view of Spock is he in one of the minority of Vulcans where melding comes easily.

Was there a writer's guide at that point? It was a pilot.

 

[T'Girl]

The ship that went throught the barrier two centruies before was a Earth ship and, it's possible that the only people effected were Human crewmembers. The same for the Enterprise crew, only Humans effected.


=

 

[Ronald Held]

At that time I expect only humans on the Valiant.

 

[Shawnster]

We've never seen other Vulcans mind-meld with machines.

Kor

I don't think we've ever seen a Vulcan play the Vulcan lute, either. That doesn't mean that is the case, though.

 

[Kor]

Hmm.

He mind melds... with computers.

He plays the Vulcan lute... which no full Vulcan has ever done.

He earned the Kolinahr medallion, and declined it.

He is the most interesting Vulcan on Vulcan.

Kor

 

[The Old Mixer]

Stay logical, my friends.

 

[Drone]

Full humans aren't mentioned as such, so the assorted unseen casualties could have come from whichever species.

That is, the Valiant crew searches for data on human ESP specifically - but in all likelilhood, this early vessel would have had a full human crew. Or would the Valiant have been assigned a Vulcan chaperon...? But if she had one aboard, and that one got killed (either by the Barrier, or because somebody in the crew saw a convenient opening!), then again the crew would search for human data exclusively.

Kirk's casualties are not given a species identity, nor is it confirmed that all of them were espers, just that the Barrier fried a specific part of their brain. And if it does that to everybody it hits, Spock might have taken a hit but to a harmless part of his brain...Timo Saloniemi

As to the first, unless my mind is grievously failing me at this late hour, what other alien crew members have we ever actually seen on Enterprise on TOS, or even heard mention of? I would certainly think that such other individual(s) would be given the time and space to be introduced, if not have a focus on them as a major plot point in at least one episode, if for no other reason than to emphasize the real world validity of the ethos of the Federation. If Kirk and Spock are brothers (Whom Gods Destroy) why shouldn't there be at least another sibling or two on board? But there's no evidence of it, so I kind of doubt that such an honor of dying in the pilot would be bestowed on one.

Your other contention is actually incorrect, as Kirk informs Dehner after she delivers the results of the autopsies. It's just a few words but it is there.

KIRK: You mentioned that tests show you have a high degree of extrasensory perception. So do the records of the others. Gary Mitchell has the highest esper rating of all.

 

[JimZipCode]

In the pilot, ESP was described just like it was perceived in the 1960s: as magical, unexplained and unexplainable abilities such as seeing the future (without using a time machine), reading the backs of (unmarked) playing cards, having flashes of insight, seeing through solid objects, igniting fires – Amusingly, telepathy isn't even mentioned.

That's a good point. I was equating ESP with telepathy; but you're right, Dr Dehner talks more about clairvoyance etc when discussing the crew records.. Although later she refers to "espers" in a way that was. pretty standard in sf at the time, to include telepaths. Gary Mitchell manifests telepathy and telekinesis in the second act.

On the other hand, why would Spock's abilities be on record? They are secret to Leonard H. McCoy himself until Spock first uses them in "Dagger".

Right, I thought Vulcans kept this hidden, shrouded in secrecy.

 

[Vandervecken]

Huh. more forgotten stuff--that is, at some point I might expect some race somewhere, Klingons, Romulans, somebody--to send ESPers into the barrier deliberately. Of course they wouldn't be able to control them if they lived, but then, governments have pretty high estimations of their abilities in such situations.

Or some utterly psycho ESPer flies a ship into the barrier to achieve "godhood"...

However, Dehner is proof that you DON'T have to jump the rails psychologically after being subjected to this. I DON'T think she would have eventually succumbed, not when she was willing to go so far as to give up her life. She'd have had no real place anymore as a regular human being in human society, but, still, I don't see her going all Gary Mitchell.

Maybe a disciplined Vulcan (even half Vulcan) mind like Spock's has mental shields up, always (unless mind melding), and that was enough to protect him for the brief period of exposure to the barrier. Notice that the Melkotians took nothing from Spock's mind. I bet they couldn't, at least, not easily. However, I also think Spock didn't consider himself and most Vulcans to be "true telepaths," as the way he refers to the Melkotions as such makes me think he didn't include himself in that group.

 

[Gary Mitchell]

She'd have had no real place anymore as a regular human being in human society, but, still, I don't see her going all Gary Mitchell.

.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

 

[Marsden]

However, Dehner is proof that you DON'T have to jump the rails psychologically after being subjected to this. I DON'T think she would have eventually succumbed, not when she was willing to go so far as to give up her life. She'd have had no real place anymore as a regular human being in human society, but, still, I don't see her going all Gary Mitchell.

Well, there's different degrees of "succumbing" to the power. Maybe she wouldn't have been as trivial as Mitchell, (sorry Gary, please don't strangle me) but like Thalassa roasting Bones when he made her angry, it would be extremely difficult not to be corrupted, at least somewhat.

 

[Nerys Myk]

As to the first, unless my mind is grievously failing me at this late hour, what other alien crew members have we ever actually seen on Enterprise on TOS, or even heard mention of?

None that I recall. But in TOS 90% of the aliens encountered looked just like humans

 

[Timo]

Also, characters in general did not have their special characteristics introduced preemptively or indirectly. OTOH, even direct generally didn't amount to much. That Spock was an alien was made clear when he first appeared, but it was not a plot point, and had no significance in that episode, much less implications. That Sulu had a hobby (or, ultimately, turned out to be a compulsive hobbyist) was of not significance or implication of anything. That Chekov was a Russophile, ditto. None of this told us anything at all about the status of aliens, hobbyists or nationalists in Starfleet.

The universe of TOS is sometimes built out of interesting concepts introduced in an episode. More usually, it's pieced together from the delightful contradictions that result from the episodes making so little effort to remain consistent or to introduce new concepts when mangling an already introduced one will do. The Barrier is decidedly both. In its first appearance, it has certain characteristics; in its second one, it ignores one (it does zip to people), perverts one ("energy: negative" becomes "negative energy") and mangles a third (one ship takes damage, another takes none); in its third one, it contradicts one (it does zip to explicit espers) and ignores all others (it doesn't hurt the ship, it has no properties, indeed it doesn't even get a mention, except perhaps in visual fashion). So, at the end of the day, the Barrier is the sum total of those things.

Damage to espers? Selective. Consequence: we can't tell whether Spock was an esper saved by sheer chance, or failed to qualify as esper because of X. Damage to ships? Selective as well, and apparently unrelated to either loiter time or direction of entry. Ability to block intergalactic travel? Selective. Is the Barrier intelligent, actively selecting who is worthy of the effects mentioned? Is it just changing constantly, like weather? Does it have a function, or even a significance? We don't know, which is what the Barrier is all about in the end...

Timo Saloniemi

 

[FormerLurker]

Speculation comes up with explanations for the contradictions, as well. We are never told why the changes occur between visits to the barrier, yet in-universe reasons must exist. Therefore, fans have come up with things like "The shields have been modified between visits, as more information about the barrier becomes available", and "Different areas of the barrier are stronger or weaker in causing different effects on crew and equipment". This does nothing to actually explain definitively why the changes occur, but for those fans that accept it, it provides an explanation they can live with.

 

[johnnybear]

Yes quite clever. I'd not have thought of that!
JB

 

[Timo]

One bit of speculation: Starfleet in "Where No Man" seemed to have put quite a lot of effort into breaching the Barrier and exploring beyond. They sent a starship, supposedly a rare asset, just to see if the strange phenomenon could be braved, and went ahead even after learning that the Barrier ate ships for brunch. They may also have built the Delta Vega installation for the very purpose of exploiting the results, as it would be much less of a coincidence for Kirk to end up within spitting distance of this installation if it were all part of a greater, stagewise plan to extend Starfleet reach to the edges of the galaxy and beyond.

Would these people take no for an answer? I doubt that. Kirk lost men and women, but learned a few things about why the losses took place. Starfleet might well launch a campaign of trying out better and better protective measures, and ultimately discover and implement those, even though Kirk no longer was involved. For this reason, Kirk's ship would easily sail through the barrier in "By Any Other Name" and "In Truth" both, even with espers aboard.

But this assumes the Kelvans would be stupid enough not to prepare for the Barrier themselves and notice the Starfleet readiness, or that Kirk would be stupid enough to volunteer knowledge of the protection. Why did they hit the Barrier full steam despite already having lost their own, supposedly much more advanced ship to the phenomenon? If OTOH the protective measures were something the Kelvans added, being quick learners, we're left to wonder why Kirk wasn't worried about his espers this time around, despite Rojan not being the type to reassure Kirk on the matter - and how Kirk was so much better off in "In Truth", too, despite the Kelvans obviously not sharing any of their other supertechnologies with the Federation.

Timo Saloniemi