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Spock’s Command Decision In Galileo Seven

I think it depends on how you define 'most valuable'. When it comes to flying a shuttle, why is Spock more or less valuable than the others? Scotty is the engineer, Boma is a scientist, and everyone on board is trained to fly and fix the shuttle.

Spock has a better chance of surviving on the planet than the others and is heavier due to his physiology. It might be deemed more logical for him stay.
The most valuable person for flying the shuttle would be the person with the most experience and skill not "everyone". I find the idea that everyone on the shuttle "is trained to fly and fix the shuttle." a bit dubious. This is the Enterprise with a crew of over 400 not the ISS, the Space Shuttle or Apollo where a very small crew needs cross training. The shuttle was out for a "three hour tour" with the specialists needed for observing the quasar.
 
Or better yet, disintegrate the pluckers? (At least once.) I don't recall whether phasers had been used to disintegrate at that time.

As were approximately 13 others. After Thompson bought the tetrahondral farm, no more yeomans ever beamed down on TOS. That makes perfect sense as Thompson's only report was immediately confirmed by Spock. Her other four lines were ''Captain!'', ''Captain....'', or superfluous questions to the Captain or Kelinda.

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The most valuable person for flying the shuttle would be the person with the most experience and skill not "everyone". I find the idea that everyone on the shuttle "is trained to fly and fix the shuttle." a bit dubious. This is the Enterprise with a crew of over 400 not the ISS, the Space Shuttle or Apollo where a very small crew needs cross training. The shuttle was out for a "three hour tour" with the specialists needed for observing the quasar.
Sure not everyone is an expert pilot (Spock certainly isn't) but Roddenberry's vision was that all the crew were trained astronauts ergo, they were all trained to fly the shuttle. In Immunity Syndrome, McCoy and Spock were vying for the mission because they can both fly the shuttle. Yeoman Barrows is a technician. She barely helps because she's a girl and her only stated job is to turn on the tricorder but she is likely basic tech assistance for Scotty and would be able to fly and fix (on a basic level) the shuttle.
 
Or better yet, disintegrate the pluckers? (At least once.) I don't recall whether phasers had been used to disintegrate at that time.

As were approximately 13 others. After Thompson bought the tetrahondral farm, no more yeomans ever beamed down on TOS. That makes perfect sense as Thompson's only report was immediately confirmed by Spock. Her other four lines were ''Captain!'', ''Captain....'', or superfluous questions to the Captain or Kelinda.
Grace Lee Whitney described all the yeomen as 'cute and not very bright'.
 
Sure not everyone is an expert pilot (Spock certainly isn't) but Roddenberry's vision was that all the crew were trained astronauts ergo, they were all trained to fly the shuttle. In Immunity Syndrome, McCoy and Spock were vying for the mission because they can both fly the shuttle. Yeoman Barrows is a technician. She barely helps because she's a girl and her only stated job is to turn on the tricorder but she is likely basic tech assistance for Scotty and would be able to fly and fix (on a basic level) the shuttle.
Roddenberry was speaking in the most general of terms. Shorthand for people in space. Has anyone in Starfleet ever been called an "astronaut" by Starfleet? It's like saying every sailor can pilot a boat or ship. My father was in the Air Force. He had nothing to do with aircraft. He was technician working with intelligence gathering equipment. A lot of people in Starfleet are probably the same.

McCoy being able to fly a shuttle doesn't mean every member of the Enterprise crew (or Starfleet) can fly a shuttle. It's an example of character X having the skill needed for plot element Y to work in episode Z. Not dissimilar to Spock's Swiss Army Physiology.
 
if one person had to be left on the planet because the ship could not lift off the answer is clear


the fattest one
 
During this episode the possibility of 3 crew members being left behind on the planet is discussed. This got me to thinking : hypothetically, if it really came down to Spock deciding who would remain, who exactly do you think he would have chosen? Logically, of course…

I think Spock would have been one of them for these reasons:
  • He sacrificed his life in Star Trek II: tWoK.
  • He said they could lift off when he was trapped by the boulder.
  • He says he's perfectly logical because his experiences growing up on Vulcan, but he later comes to think "logic is the beginning the wisdom, not the end." In this episode he ignites their fuel, which Kirk and McCoy claim was not entirely logical.
Based on all that I think he would have made the heroic choice to stay behind and said, "I'm sorry Doctor, I have no time to discuss this logically."

For the other two people, he would have chosen those with the longest expected survival time while stranded on the planet.

Why didn't he just set the phasers to stun and shoot the damned things?
The effects don't show it, but I think the creatures were supposed to be fast, able to move around that foggy planet better than humans, and very effective with their spears. That made them close to equally matched against humans with phasers. That's why the crew suggests killing one: they don't have the power to kill them all in war of attrition, but maybe if they killed one or two of them, it would scare them away. Spock thinks shooting near them will scare them, but I think maybe it gave the creatures the idea that the humans weren't all that dangerous. McCoy says it's perfectly predictable that they might respond with anger, but I disagree. Maybe they would have been more angry if the humans killed one of them.

This made the plot point of about using the phasers' energy as fuel work for me. With the phasers, maybe they can hold their own with minimal casualties, but they don't have a chance without the phasers. When I watched it, I thought they should have someone standing guard on the shuttle roof, but maybe that would leave that crewmen vulnerable to the spears, which I think I meant to be as accurate as phasers in that fogggy environment.
 
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Anyway, it's a very hard decision to leave a person back.
Maybe Spock hasn't even made this decision already.

Yes, it’s a hypothetical situation that never really developed, although they discussed the possibility of having to leave someone behind.

Spock’s other actual decision to leave Gaetano alone on guard duty was really questionable. Gaetano paid for this error with his life.
 
Roddenberry was speaking in the most general of terms. Shorthand for people in space. Has anyone in Starfleet ever been called an "astronaut" by Starfleet? It's like saying every sailor can pilot a boat or ship. My father was in the Air Force. He had nothing to do with aircraft. He was technician working with intelligence gathering equipment. A lot of people in Starfleet are probably the same.

McCoy being able to fly a shuttle doesn't mean every member of the Enterprise crew (or Starfleet) can fly a shuttle. It's an example of character X having the skill needed for plot element Y to work in episode Z. Not dissimilar to Spock's Swiss Army Physiology.
Officers go through the same Starfleet training, which includes the basics such as emergency repairs, transporter operation, etc.

Yeoman Rand pilots the Enterprise in Naked Time. Kirk would not have asked her to do so if she had no training, and she isn't an officer.

So I think it's a fair assumption that you don't get assigned to a deep space exploration vessel if you don't know how to operate key systems, including the shuttle.
 
Yes, it’s a hypothetical situation that never really developed, although they discussed the possibility of having to leave someone behind.

Spock’s other actual decision to leave Gaetano alone on guard duty was really questionable. Gaetano paid for this error with his life.

Why questionable? It is pretty common and prudent to establish a perimeter. They did not really have man power to leave more than one at that location. Scotty could not do it, he was working, McCoy was not qualified, Spock was commanding so that would not be a good idea, Yeoman Mears was not qualified, that leaves only Boma who may have also been on guard at another location which would make sense.
 
Why questionable? It is pretty common and prudent to establish a perimeter. They did not really have man power to leave more than one at that location. Scotty could not do it, he was working, McCoy was not qualified, Spock was commanding so that would not be a good idea, Yeoman Mears was not qualified, that leaves only Boma who may have also been on guard at another location which would make sense.

Because his ‘logical decision’ cost Gaetano his life. Even Spock questioned what happened : “Strange. Step by step I’ve made the correct and logical decisions. Yet two men have died.”
 
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Quick, Easy and it’s a real space saver aboard Starships!

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Sick, yet effective.
Grace Lee Whitney described all the yeomen as 'cute and not very bright'.
I'll give one of them this: Landon could fight. Chekov wouldn't ever have to worry about getting mugged, if only they'd stay together. And Tamura wasn't afraid of Barbara Babcock either.
 
Officers go through the same Starfleet training, which includes the basics such as emergency repairs, transporter operation, etc.

Yeoman Rand pilots the Enterprise in Naked Time. Kirk would not have asked her to do so if she had no training, and she isn't an officer.

So I think it's a fair assumption that you don't get assigned to a deep space exploration vessel if you don't know how to operate key systems, including the shuttle.
Speculation and plot convenience.
 
So I think it's a fair assumption that you don't get assigned to a deep space exploration vessel if you don't know how to operate key systems, including the shuttle.

Or at the very least, it limits what kind of missions you get to go on. Perhaps whether you can go on a mission requiring potential emergency shuttle piloting, i.e. only if there's enough trained personnel that the likelihood of you being the only one left who's not in bad medical shape is low.

Yeoman Tina Lawton might be able to go on a shuttle mission if Kirk, Spock, Sulu, and two random scientists/guards are also aboard, but not if it's just her, the personnel officer, and the ship's cook.
 
Speculation and plot convenience.
This is true, albeit it's also true of every character and is basically why, over time, Spock is shown to be qualified in everything, including engineering. But demonstrating wider training is not without precedent. Uhura never once worked a transporter in TOS until STIII but are we to assume that she only learned how to do it to help the escape? Rand didn't work a transporter until TMP but was also shown to repair and work a transporter in the first draft of CotEoF. Since her scene never made it into the final episode, are we to assume that means she isn't qualified to do those things?

Also does the crew just sit around between missions or do they do continuous training in ship's systems?
Or at the very least, it limits what kind of missions you get to go on. Perhaps whether you can go on a mission requiring potential emergency shuttle piloting, i.e. only if there's enough trained personnel that the likelihood of you being the only one left who's not in bad medical shape is low.

Yeoman Tina Lawton might be able to go on a shuttle mission if Kirk, Spock, Sulu, and two random scientists/guards are also aboard, but not if it's just her, the personnel officer, and the ship's cook.
The personnel officer is still an officer. She would have 4 years of officer training which includes ship's systems. It was embarrassing and annoying for Marina Sirtis in TNG when Troi, a Lt-Commander, was shown be very ignorant of basic ship's systems. She might be a bit rusty on some but she would be part of continuous drills. The ship's counselor would still have jobs to do during a red alert, whether commanding a damage control team, managing the civilians, or assisting in sickbay. Her duties would be on rotation, not siloed.

Why questionable? It is pretty common and prudent to establish a perimeter. They did not really have man power to leave more than one at that location. Scotty could not do it, he was working, McCoy was not qualified, Spock was commanding so that would not be a good idea, Yeoman Mears was not qualified, that leaves only Boma who may have also been on guard at another location which would make sense.
Mears must be qualified to do something. She is armed with a phaser and doesn't spend any time assisting Scotty in any meaningful way so maybe she is trained in security?
 
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Also does the crew just sit around between missions or do they do continuous training in ship's systems?
They have jobs. “Missions” are only a fraction of that. What they do in their downtime is up to them. Collect plants, tennis, martial arts…
. Since her scene never made it into the final episode, are we to assume that means she isn't qualified to do those things?
yes, because that’s how continuity works. Don’t mean a thing if it ain’t on the screen.

The personnel officer is still an officer. She would have 4 years of officer training which includes ship's systems
According to????
 
How often would someone need to hone skills they hardly ever use? Is it required or on one's own volition?
I think this is where the narrative approach to Starfleet makes a difference. On naval vessels, crew run drills all the time and non-coms take turns doing different jobs to round out their training. The idea is that anyone can step into an emergency role. Science crew may spend time on research but they would periodically be expected to refresh training in core systems and emergency processes. We see several blue shirts manning helm/nav. We have Sulu, a physicist transferring to command, we have La Forge transferring from helm to engineering, we have Tilly and Burnham bouncing between science and command etc. They couldn't do this unless they already had training, and Tilley opts for additional training to improve her command skills (it doesn't work and I have no idea how or why she was promoted to first officer over Nielsson but I assume Saru was drunk or high). Not everyone is good at everything (they can't all be O'Brien) but they should still have regular core training. Hell, I work in an office and we conduct fire drills, health and safety training/assessments, and financial crime training several times a year. Why would a starship be different?
 
They have jobs. “Missions” are only a fraction of that. What they do in their downtime is up to them. Collect plants, tennis, martial arts…

yes, because that’s how continuity works. Don’t mean a thing if it ain’t on the screen.


According to????
But it is on screen. Rand is a trained astronaut. We know that because she works on a spaceship and Roddenberry confirmed all members of the crew are trained astronauts. Yeoman is her position on the ship; her job is astronaut. :-)
They have jobs. “Missions” are only a fraction of that. What they do in their downtime is up to them. Collect plants, tennis, martial arts…

yes, because that’s how continuity works. Don’t mean a thing if it ain’t on the screen.


According to????
In ST09 it is stated to be a 4 year course akin to a degree level (typically 3 years) plus astronaut training and officer (command) training. Many characters have done one or more post-grads or extra modules. MD training seems assumed to be about 7 years like the real world, based on Bashir's career trajectory and some, like McCoy, Chapel, or Scotty qualify first and just do the additional training for astronaut and command.

Of course, I have also played some of the role-playing games where much of this background and training has been formalised so, to me, it all seems very logical.
 
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